Many consider Poroshenko to a puppet. He is. But more correctly he is a
Neoliberal Comprador not that different from, say, Frau
Merkel. But from the other point of view, you can't lead a neoliberal state and be free from the
dominance of the USA as a center of the neoliberal world, who controls the world financial system.
You need to be a debt salve and as such will be looted by transnational financial institutions.
That was clearly achieved in Ukraine
where standards of living dropped to sub-Saharan Africa levels and are close to a dollar a day
(approximately 750 hrivna a month) for certain categories of population, especially pensioners. In 2008, only 47 percent of the
population of sub-Saharan Africa lived on $1.25 a day or less. (United Nations 2012).
Germany in this story acted like a real neo-imperial power using the smoke screen of "democracy"
to achieve imperial goals -- get the new markets for German industry. It's the same behaviour
it demonstrated with Greece: pay the debt poor Ukrainians.
The threat to the Bank was explicit enough. Alastair Crooke wrote: “And The Wall Street Journal
in a front page tap on Angela Merkel’s shoulder- reminding her to vote “yes” on the next “level-3″
round of Russian sanctions- warned that “Deutsche Bank’s US operations suffer from a litany
of problems…” The WSJ article is behind a pay wall.
Nude pictures? a lesbian? a murky past? Those are nothing that a little spin can’t take care
of as pointed out above. Merkel serves at the pleasure of the German elites and she would be
thrown under the bus if she became a serious liability. Merkel is not the problem.
The US
has Germany by the short hairs for sure but its not through some personal scandal. The US may
[have] a kill switch on the Germany/EU financial system. Further speculating, all that NSA spying
may have led to discovery of vulnerabilities in the German financial system, again as mentioned
above.
The US seems to have the ability to inflict massive pain on Germany, its elites and its general
population to account for German obedience. It seems likely to be a financial bludgeon that
the US is ready to swing. The blow back could take down the US financial system but, the Anglo
elites will still do quite well in a material sense and that is the only thing that matters.
France is also not that much different. Russia while neoliberal power in itself was actually the
most benign "neocolonialist" among the troika. Poland has its own neoimperial goals too.
US is much worse then all Europent neolocolinialists put togather. It really control
Ukranina goverment as puppets. As an example of such views we can cite the opinion of the Pro-Russian leader of the coalition of
NGOs "Eurasian choice - Georgia" Archil Chkoidze. Here is what he said about Poroshenko and his cabinet:
"This is controlled by the Americans puppet government, and their hands are used for carrying
out genocide of the Russian people. The government Poroshenko is very similar to the former
government of Georgia led by Saakashvili. In 2008, the authorities of Georgia did the same
when they bombed Tskhinvali,"
Being controlled does not explicitly means that they need to pursue suicidal economic policy. But
Provisional government in its nationalistic intoxication
did exactly that launching ATO and forever splitiing the country. Yatsenyuk and Turchinov should
probably be tried before high court for the betrayal of the country. Another comment from Guardian
Scipio1 -> MonsieurPetanque, 09 July 2014 1:05pm
''It is also noteworthy that the word “junta” has disappeared from Russian state media’s
descriptions of the government of Ukraine.
And in turn from the lexicon of many posters here.''
You can put lipstick on a pig but it is still a pig. Interesting report from the
BBC man in Slavyansk yesterday. It ended with the journalists observing that in addition to
the Ukrainian flag being hoisted, there was also the black and red flag of Pravy Sektor
on view. Of course I will be diplomatic and call them by their name of convenience, to
wit the National Guard. I wonder what these gentlemen are up to? social work perhaps? Or winning
hearts and minds?
Funny, what comes to my mind is 'disappearing' now that the atrocity de jour - incinerating
your opponents a la Odessa is temporarily off the agenda.
Two points to make about Poroshenko:
He is not making the decisions, the US State Department and CIA are.
His invasion of the East is a nasty, kid-killing exercise, example of the type of
ideological total war which is not uncommon in this part of the world.
In literal terms he may not be a Nazi but he certainly has them at his back domestically
baying for blood which he needs to satisfy (having first cleared it with his Washington
masters of course.)
In terms of ending the war, how do you seal a frontier - Russian/ Ukraine 1500 miles long.
It is foolish to imagine that the Don Bass people are not going to fight on. There will be no
agreement without their consent and Putin and Porshenko had better realise this. Big power decisions
taken over the heads of people seldom leads to peace.
A good analogy has been the British struggle against the nationalists in Ireland. Whatever
they Republic did to aid the process of the British campaign - closing the border, outlawing
the IRA, imprisoning nationalist in the south - the IRA continued their campaign for decades.
Eventually the British authorities had to negotiate an uneasy peace conceding many points.
Ruling by force alone never works and the legitimate concerns of the local people need to
be addressed. However, Poroshenko and his Washington masters have brushed this aside with their
brutal campaign in the east. The scene is now set for an on-going low intensity war with no
visible end in sight.
Against, being a stooge of US embassy is not bad per ser. You can somewhat play on contradictions
within State Department and its obsessive desire to hit Russia as hard as possible. Moreover,
most European politicians are now to a certain extent US puppets for the simple reason the USA is the most
powerful country in neoliberal world, the center of neoliberal empire. Pax Americana.
Whether this is a fatal flaw or hidden advantage much depends on the level of talent of particular
politician. The USA as the most powerful country in the world can do a lot of good for "client" country
with proper "encouragement". For example you get more free access to tremendous amount of valuable US
technical "know how". Which is a big competitive advantage. US companies also invest more readily in
the country which is "in good relations" with Washington.
Adoption of English language as an official or "semi-official" language and requirement for government
workers to pass an exam in this language also can dampen the animosity between Ukrainian nationalists
and Russian speaking population of the South East (actually there are not two but three main languages
in Ukraine -- Western Ukrainian dialect, Russian language and
Surzhyk -- mixed dialect widely used
in rural areas of central provinces such as Kiev and Poltava as well as in border areas of Moldovia)
.
Conversion of Russian school into English schools is definably more acceptable then conversion to
Ukrainian schools, as depth and breadth of Ukrainian culture can not compare with depth and breadth
of Russian culture, but Anglo-Saxon culture can compete with Russian culture on its own merits. It is
a dominant world culture in addition to being world technological powerhouse. The word "Silicon Valley"
and Hollywood resonate in Ukraine no less then in other countries. And that create strong attraction
to such a culture and such a country. Also all countries can borrow quite a bit from the US law and
law practice, especially in such areas as the fight with organized crime.
But you need certain level of flexibility and to have own political base to operate in this mode.
And being simultaneously hostage of Right Sector Poroshenko lacks this flexibility. This make him somewhat
tragic figure. the Problem is that Poroshenko can and would like to find a political settlement South-East
crisis, but the pressure from radical forces him to rely on force.
Poroshenko was the financier of February coup d'état and as such he was a shadow member of junta
from the very beginning. Previously he also financed Orange revolution and was one of "lyubi drizy"
-- corrupt inner circle of President Yushchenko.
Presidential elections in 2014 had shown that he does enjoy support of Western Ukraine. But that's
was given and is not a news. At the same time elections were conducted during civil war unleashed by
Turchinov and does not validate the illegal or outright criminal activity of the kangaroo Rada. They
are also questionable by themselves due to a low turnout, lack of proper alternative candidates, lawlessness
of the country, pressure of Right Sector thugs, and most probably outright fraud in counting the ballots.
The main purpose of those Presidential elections was to legitimize junta. And the first significant
events of his presidency was dramatic intensification of civil war of South East (capturing Slavyansk
and several other cities and then cutting Donetsk from Lugansk and
shooting down of Malaysian flight
MH17?
Many European observers suggest that Poroshenko himself and Poroshenko government (aka "junta in
chocolate") are not independent in its actions and actually controlled by the United States. This is
true only to a certain extent. It's also under control of Right Secor which only partially is controllable
by State department and has political agenda of its own, which is distinct from the idea of neoliberal
globalization promoted by state department. And I suspect that this is why generally neoliberal tandem
of Turchinov (aka Trupchinov) and Yatsenyuk (aka Yats) were forced to start bloody campaign for pacification
of South East. This idea that Poroshenko himself and his government politically are squeezed between
US embassy and Right sector and are hostages of far right elements is also popular in pro-Russian part
of media space (which does not makes them untrue; as usual, those, who do not like Poroshenko and junta
are much more objective in judging his and junta actions and political environment in which they operate
;-).
In any case election of new president changes little in the political course of the government both
internally and externally. Poroshenko simply continued nationalistic hysteria and the dangerous cause
of junta on South East started by Turchinov-Yatsenyuk tandem attempting to wipe out rebels by indiscriminate
shelling, air bombardment and by usage of tanks and heavy artillery such as Grad multiple launchers.
As a result confederate forces (calls pro-Russian rebels in Western MSM, although large part of them
do not want to join Russia but just wants autonomy from Kiev) got the same types of weapons and manage
to hit Kiev army and supporting par-military nationalist formations with them causing heavy losses.
He also rejected federalization of the country and granting Russian language the status of the second
state language.
In this sense the idea that Poroshenko can manage to stop the bloodshed in the South-East is hard
to believe. While probably not completely subservient in all areas of internal policy, in this particular
sphere President is most probably a complete marionette which doesn't decide anything. May be personally
he would be glad to stop the war, but he is afraid that in this case he would immediately need to change
his place of residence like Yanukovich in the past.
He also influenced by (and very afraid of ) the "Party of War" and first of all by extremists from
the Eight Sector and National guard. The latter consists mainly of far right elements. Units of local
Lords like Kolomoisky, Lyashko, Timoshenko and others who gathered around himself fanatics, thugs, and
lumpens can be called death squads. To make this analogy stronger there are foreign mercenaries in the
ranks of the National Guard. Especially numerous are Swedish far right fighters.
Kolomoisky represent a painful thorn in the back of Poroshenko. Army of Kolomoisky is financed by
the state and by Kolomoisky, but they report directly to him, not Poroshenko. The same is true for foreign
mercenaries hired by Kolomoisky. It is not clear whom Right sector obeys, but it is also partially financed
by the same Kolomoisky.
How Poroshenko in this situation can stop the fighting? Moreover Kolomoisky openly said that he will
not follow the order Poroshenko to provide ceasefire. He will not stop fighting until he wipe from the
earth, these terrorists. It turns out that Poroshenko controls only to a small part of the army.
Next. Poroshenko can't stop the war and to make concessions to the militia, it would mean that he
did not keep his word to his voters. Please consider that the Maidan wants the war to a victorious end.
If he will yield to the opposition, then he betrayed those who are around him.
And he will get the next Maidan. They are probably not happy that released this Genie out of the
bottle in the form of the Right sector, with which they are no longer are able to cope because they
do not report to anyone. It is a terrible situation for Poroshenko, but this is a fact.
...Following his election as Ukraine’s President, the Podolian “Shokoladni Tsar” Poroshenko
inherited the so-called “anti-Terrorist operation” from the Yatsenyuk government. Poroshenko seems
to want to end the conflict and has vocally sought to reach out to his Russian-speaking compatriots
in the Donbas. Yet at the same time, he appears restrained in what he can do, and at times
even appears to even endorse the controversial “anti-Terror” campaign that has thus far cost hundreds
of lives, including many civilians. There are at least three reasons for this.
One is that the 2004 Orange Revolution constitution was restored in Ukraine, which effectively
means that the Ukrainian parliament, the Rada, has more power than Poroshenko. Therefore, by
law, Poroshenko is limited in what he can do.
The second problem that Poroshenko faces is the fact that the “anti-Terrorist operation” is led
by a disparate assortment of groups including Right Sector (Pravyi Sektor) and other far-right
militants, the Maidan self-defense forces, oligarch-financed militias (effectively “private armies”),
and (allegedly) mercenaries from other countries. The regular Ukrainian army, with defections and
desertions, has proved to be unreliable for Kiev. Therefore, to “reign in” the rebels, it relies
on these “independent” groups and militias. The problem with this strategy is that the latter are
truly “independent” and thus it is difficult for Poroshenko to command them to “stop,” even though
he is now calling for a cease-fire.
Finally, Poroshenko is under pressure from rival political forces, primarily the Batkivshchyna
party and its leader Yulia Tymoshenko, who has threatened to launch “another Maidan” if Poroshenko’s
presidency proves to be a disappointment. In a concerning development, the usually pro-Western
and liberal Batkivshchyna now appears to be co-opting itself with Ukraine’s nationalists. In fact,
since this crisis commenced, nationalism and Russophobia appear to have become increasingly prevalent
within the Ukrainian political elite; though it is doubtful that these attitudes reflect the popular
sentiment of the vast majority of Ukrainian people.
Will Poroshenko be reelected?
The process of distancing from Russia was common for all post-Soviet republics and actually was caused by the mere fact of
acquiring independence. That it took such a self-destructive form in Ukraine is many ways the net result to Washington
geopolitical machinations (supported by Germany, Poland and Sweden).
The key problem is not EuroMaydan nationalist "revolution" per se, but that fact that Ukrainian nationalists proved to be
neoliberal compradors. Ukraine became the debt slave of the West. Under neoliberal neocolonialism this is a very stable
condition that guarantees that the standard of living of people will not improve. The country will be sacked dry. So Ukraine
is an example of "Latin-Americanization" of post Soviet space -- that policy that Washington actively implemented since 1991.
After huge initial success with puppet Yeltsin regime, they failed to weaken and dismember Russia further due to ascendance of
Putin. But for all other republics it was pretty successful neocolonial policy. They now have military bases in few of those
republics and most of them are debt slaves of IMF and World bank. In a way EuroMaydan signified the finishing touches of
conversion of this region into dent slaves.
Neoliberal Washington was turned into an oligarchy, an autocracy run by Davos billionaires. Their “liberty” and
democracy was an early example of Orwellian Doublethink. It was to destroy everybody else’s liberty so they could grab whatever they
could, enslave the debtors and create the polarized hostile to each other countries in post-Soviet state that are easily
controlled ("divide and conquer" strategy along with "Full Spectrum Dominance" mantra and neoliberal "Washington Consensus"
method of enslavement). Ukraine is the most glaring example of this enslavement --the country with Central African level
of poverty. It is very similar how Roman oligarchy behaved -- the Roman oligarchy accused anyone of supporting debtor rights
and opposing its land grabs of “seeking kingship.” Such men were murdered, century after century. It seems that unless there’s a
Hammurabi-style “divine king” or some elected civic regulatory authority arise, local neoliberal oligarchies arise and help to
exploit their societies by Washington as much as they can, while trying to prevent the country from defending itself. In few
countries like Hungary far right ascendance slowed down this process, but for how long is unlearn as global
finance is controlled from London and Washington and can crash any individual country like a bug.
The Romans brutal "mission civilisatrice", can be viewed as to install local oligarchy and kind of "financialized" economy
in other countries. For performing this service, the imperial power takes all the money that its colonies can generate.
Washington is not different. That’s why the US meddles in foreign politics of other countries, as we have just seen in Ukraine,
Libya and Syria.
This overgrowth of debt under neoliberalism is highly destabilizing. Financial oligarchy have broken free of tax liability and
are enriching themselves not by helping the overall country economy grow and raising living standards, but just the opposite: by
getting the country into bigger and bigger debt. This is the essence of Poroshenko regime -- corrupt comprador oligarchy.
So there is no surprise that everybody hates Poroshenko and even huge "administrative resource" and personal wealth did not
help him to get more then 15% of votes in the first round (of which 5-10% are probably fraudulent). That's typical for any
neoliberal president who stand for re-election in a debt slave country.
But it is important to to note that this Washington marionette made the economic situation in Ukraine much worse that
the situation existed under Yanukovich (which was also corrupt as hell).
Another interesting feature of the current situation is that the role of Israel in EuroMaydan now open to review.
An interesting and funny detail is proliferation of modern "Children of lieutenant Schmitt" -- Holocaust survivors in
Ukraine. People who were born in 1945, the first post-war generation, are now 75, right ? And life expectantly for
this generation is probably 65 for men and 75 for women.
MH17, I had originally thought was a US ploy, but a lot of stuff points to Britain. I
think Britain pulled that stunt, no doubt coordinated with factions in the US, and it was
enough to tip the balance in the US - to force the US into action who then put pressure on
the Euro vassals.
Where the US oligarchy is a bit divided, not much of an incident is required by perfidious
albion to tip the balance.
Bellingcat is in the middle of the GRU/Czech arms depot explosion story from 2014 - now
being described as "defacto act of Russian state terrorism on a NATO soil."
It appears the GRU were following closely a movement of arms from the Czech depot to a
Bulgarian middleman, meant to be then delivered to Ukraine. The explosion is now attributed
to the GRU because of the Petrov/Boshirov ID, and their presumed signature ineffectiveness
failing to destroy the arms cache and later failing to kill the Skripals.
Time is in Russia's favor: let the Ukraine continue to serve as a financial black hole to
the IMF. Let the Western Ukrainians continue to emigrate en masse to Poland and then to the
rest of the EU and the UK. Russia has already received some 1 million Eastern Ukrainian;
those are probably the more well-educated, more productive Ukrainians, ...
Posted by: vk | Apr 11 2021 1:20 utc | 77
This is rather sketchily related to reality.
1. Ukraine is not a "black hole for the IMF". They got a smallish credit, and now they are
being denied extensions on rather preposterous grounds, and Ukraine is charged for the unused
credit line. Contrary to Nulands boasting, the West keeps Ukraine on a leash with a rather
skimpy budget.
2. There is no clear distinction between migration patterns. The one time I was in Russia,
the tourist guide on a one-day bus trip was from Rivne -- in Poland in years 1918-39. And as
Polish medical workers go to Spain etc., Ukrainian once fill the vacant positions, and they
may come from any place. Ditto with the "quality of workers". Poland has more of seasonal
jobs in picking crops (while Poles do it further West) than Russia, Russia perennially seeks
workers ready to accept extra pay in less than benign climes. The closest to truth is
scooping engineers and highly qualified workers from factories that before worked for Russian
market, including military, replaced with Russian factories and, when needed, Ukrainian
know-how. That is pretty much accomplished -- predominantly from the Eastern Ukraine. As a
result, the remaining workforce is so-so from east to west.
Scenes from the US Capitol on Wednesday, as protesters backing President Donald Trump
disrupted the joint session of Congress meeting to certify the election of Democrat Joe Biden,
looked very much like Belgrade in October 2000
.
The sight was later repeated in Ukraine – twice, in 2004 and 2014 – Georgia,
Moldova, Belarus, and several Central Asian former Soviet republics. On every occasion, the US
backed the "people power," because American NGOs and embassies were supporting what
became known as "color revolutions."
Same thing happened in 2011 with the "Arab Spring" that started in Tunisia and then
burned its way across North Africa to the Persian Gulf. In some places it "succeeded,"
overthrowing decades-old governments. In others it failed, setting off wars in Libya and Syria
and blood on the streets of Bahrain. Again, the US cheered this on as democracy – except
for Bahrain, which hosts a major naval base.
More recently, the US denounced as illegitimate the presidential elections in Belarus,
Bolivia and Venezuela. While Minsk and Caracas managed to resist – and got sanctioned for
it – the "democrats" in La Paz were successful for a while, but ended up losing the vote
last year.
Way back in 2004, the Guardian wrote approvingly about how the
US has created a "slick" operation of "engineering democracy through the ballot box and
civil disobedience," developing since Belgrade a "template for winning other people's
elections."
Now the same mainstream media that slavishly followed the State Department line in
denouncing elections elsewhere as "rigged" and color revolutions as spontaneous
democracy are clutching their pearls when Americans who believe their election was stolen take
to the streets and storm their Capitol.
Ah, but this election wasn't stolen, they'd say – it was pure as driven snow, "most
secure ever," all the experts who told us for four years the previous one was "hacked by
Russia" tell us so! And Joe Biden won the most votes in history while hardly leaving his
basement. Whether you believe this official narrative about the US election or not doesn't
really matter, however. Partisan myopia simply won't let people understand the magnitude of
what is on display here: utter moral bankruptcy of the entire US political and media
establishment.
Republicans and Democrats alike used "color revolutions" as a political weapon for
years, preaching democracy even as their astroturfed coups snuffed out any vestiges of it that
might have developed organically. Over the past year, they've done so at home as well, using
Covid-19 lockdowns to abolish elementary constitutional rights, culminating with changing the
electoral rules to better serve "our democracy," defined as whatever gets them
power.
What did they think people would do when all avenues of airing their grievances were closed
off? Meekly submit – or take a page out of the same playbook the politicians and the
media spent 20 years celebrating?
Don't go "but Trump," either. The supposed Nazi fascist dictator himself ordered
National Guard and police to clear out the protesters who sided with him, and protect the
establishment that did not. He's a real Hitler, right? No matter, expect the media to paint him
as such anyway.
Perhaps the US ought to take a long, hard look at its own house before it continues calling
out, sanctioning, regime-changing or bombing other countries over their supposed lack of
"democracy." Maybe actually answer the question Russian President Vladimir Putin asked at
the UN back in 2015, addressing the consequences of the 'Arab Spring': "Do you realize now
what you have done?"
But we all know that's not going to happen, don't we?
Money quote: "First thing to do when 'unrest rears its ugly head' is shut down external
communications and kick out any of the Five Eyes operating an embassy in your country. It
happnens so often."
The most unfortunate aspect of these large scale disruption and regime change operations
exploit actual grievances and truly indigenous civil society reform movements, thereby
compromising even the most authentic efforts by the people. Not only that but this casts
serious doubt on both authenticity and goals of all kind of demonstrations and civil
unrest, even in more developed countries, including ostensibly First World.
Take the HK demonstrations for example - how much of it was real, genuine unrest caused
by this or that more heavy handed China policy? truth is we don't know because by
definition, the exploitation of such protest movements - almost always led by supposedly
disaffected youth - includes a very sophisticated propaganda handbook that seeks to
effectively "erase" the controlling hands behind the scenes.
Or, even the BLM movement - a lot that happened with these protests seem to jive with
the instruction manuals per the ARK. Notice how these could be turned on and off - in this
or that city, made to appear organic, when in fact those invisible hands from behind
directed much of the action.
Another aspect that is very noticeable for both the HK and BLM movements is the way they
were directed at some very specific issue that most people would have a hard time
disagreeing with - on its face. Be it political "freedom", new "rules", new "taxes" and/or
police brutality - there are numerous commonalities - too many to dismiss as mere
coincidences.
At the same time, much care seems to have been taken to not allow these protests to be
directed at the actual ruling class, the 1%, the elites, big finance and the
corporatocracy. I always thought it was kind of funny the way these BLM protesters somehow
were not there when Bernie sanders ran his campaign, even though Bernie had their
grievances near the top of his list on the official platform (police brutality, uneven
criminal justice system and prison reform were huge issues for him). Yes, there were plenty
of black youths who voted with the Sanders movement in the primary (the one that was
basically a fraudulent one, due to outright vote flipping, as was exposed by several
credible analysts). But the BLM protests only came into being following the one GF killing
and were directed mostly against police in large cities, and, of course against anything
the federal government could try and do.
Now that Biden is all but declared as 'elect", those protests have died down (except for
a few flare-up points like Portland, where they seem to have taken permanent residence).
Funny that....must be that the "defund the police" was successful and black people no
longer suffer from unequal law enforcement.....so all is well now.....
Sometimes I thought something like this happened in Libya. Libyan army cleared this
town, that city, next town, moving east to west, then just before Benghazi, we get our
consent manufacturing message that Gaddafi said there would be a slaughter in Benghazi. So
NATO just had to attack, to save Benghazi.
After Libya was smashed, turns out a whole gang of British "diplomats & SAS" were in
Benghazi.
thanks b! informative... this ARK is not noahs or boris's... who is behind this grand
scheme?? it seems the idea of keeping lebannon and syria in a state of tension is the
goal.. whose purpose does this serve? it seems like an agenda written in tel aviv, or is it
washington?? who is behind all this?? it seems clear enough that the goal is to coddle
israel... take this money and make sure israel continues to dominate in the middle east and
all other countries are destabilized basket cases... these are sick people behind all
this.. that much is very clear... who would spend money like this??
the really shocking thing is the UK gov't is in on it, but don't want it to appear this
way.. the people in the UK sure are a weird lot.. i think they are weirder then the people
in the USA!
ARK (Analysis Research Knowledge) has a website and its founder, former British diplomat
Alistair Harris has a LinkedIn account you can look up on Google or whatever search engine
you normally use. The company is based in Dubai.
Among ARK's various activities in Syria was managing the Facebook page and probably
other PR for the White Helmets. The propaganda surrounding Bana Alabed and other Syrian
children seems to be of a type similar to White Helmets propaganda - designed to appeal to
people's emotions, particularly women's emotions - so there is a possibility all this
rubbish was being generated by the same organisation.
In the end the target audience for all this propaganda is us, as our support is needed
to justify an eventual US or NATO invasion of Syria and Lebanon.
First thing to do when 'unrest rears its ugly head' is shut down external communications
and kick out any of the Five Eyes operating an emmbasy in your country. It happnens so
often. Kick Out the Five Eyes (I live in one of them). Media Communications (the industry I
work in) is the publicly acceptable term for Information Program, Propaganda, Information
Warfare. It's all the same thing, with Event Management being the sister of and information
program.
I've worked in both areas; external media communications programs and event
coordination and management , often dovetailing the two and switching between roles in
order to 'maximise stakeholder value' for the benefit of the client. Who is the
client..? If the client isn't obvious then Follow the money. It is always the person
paying the bill. Follow the money people... follow the money and you will understand the
objectives of even the most obtuse communications programs.
As an aside, with all the hundreds of billions of dollars of weapons being pumped into
the MENA, 'no one in Government' is able to 'shut down the wars. It's a joke, Government
can track your spending down to the last cent and hit you up with a fine for 'incorrect tax
return' but they 'can't follow the hundreds of billions of dollars' in weapons that gets
flown around the world. Follow the money people. Follow the money and you'll catch the
culprit.
Selfishness may be exalted as the root and branch of capitalism, but it doesn't make you
look good to the party on the receiving end or those whose sympathy he earns. For that, you
need a government prepared to do four things, which each have separate dictums based on study,
theorization, and experience. Coercion: Force is illegitimate only if you can't sell it.
Persuasion: How do I market thee? Let me count the ways. Bargaining: If you won't scratch my
back, then how about a piece of the pie? Indoctrination: Because I said so. (And paid for the
semantics.)
Predatory capitalism is the control and expropriation of land, labor, and natural resources
by a foreign government via coercion, persuasion, bargaining, and indoctrination.
At the coercive stage, we can expect military and/or police intervention to repress the
subject populace. The persuasive stage will be marked by clientelism, in which a small
percentage of the populace will be rewarded for loyalty, often serving as the capitalists'
administrators, tax collectors, and enforcers. At the bargaining stage, efforts will be made to
include the populace, or a certain percentage of it, in the country's ruling system, and this
is usually marked by steps toward democratic (or, more often, autocratic) governance.
At the fourth stage, the populace is educated by capitalists, such that they continue to
maintain a relationship of dependency.
The Predatory Debt Link
In many cases, post-colonial states were forced to assume the debts of their colonizers. And
where they did not, they were encouraged to become in debt to the West via loans that were
issued through international institutions to ensure they did not fall prey to communism or
pursue other economic policies that were inimical to the West. Debt is the tie that binds
nation states to the geostrategic and economic interests of the West.
As such, the Cold War era was a time of easy credit, luring postcolonial states to undertake
the construction of useless monoliths and monuments, and to even expropriate such loans through
corruption and despotism, thereby making these independent rulers as predatory as colonizers.
While some countries were wiser than others and did use the funds for infrastructural
improvements, these were also things that benefited the West and particularly Western
contractors. In his controversial work Confessions of an Economic Hit Man, John Perkins reveals
that he was a consultant for an American firm (MAIN), whose job was to ensure that states
became indebted beyond their means so they would remain loyal to their creditors, buying them
votes within United Nations organizations, among other things.
Predatory capitalists demand export-orientations as the means to generate foreign currency
with which to pay back debt. In the process, the state must privatize and drastically slash or
eliminate any domestic subsidies which are aimed at helping native industry compete in the
marketplace. Domestic consumption and imports must be radically contained, as shown by the
exchange rate policies recommended by the IMF. The costs of obtaining domestic capital will be
pushed beyond the reach of most native producers, while wages must be depressed to an absolute
bare minimum. In short, the country's land, labor, and natural resources must be sold at
bargain basement prices in order to make these goods competitive, in what one author has called
"a spiraling race to the bottom," as countries producing predominantly the same goods engage in
cutthroat competition whose benefactor is the West.
Under these circumstances, foreign investment is encouraged, but this, too, represents a
loaded situation for countries that open their markets to financial liberalization.
S
o first neoliberal plunder the
country dry and then they offer hope of "Eurointergation" as a carrot and organize a color revolution to overthouth the government.
Is not this brilliant?
A
nd as people want ot live "as in
Europe" (often without understanding realities and seeing only tourist facade of the countries) this desire can become a door opener
of the color revolution.
Another factor is that neoliberalism lifts the standard of living of top 10% or 5 % of the population and create powerful fifth
column of compradors oriented on the West (a part of programmers and IT workers, large part of other well-paid professionals (such
as corporate lawyers, medical professionals, etc), naive or crooked students, employees of joint ventures, etc) who can be relied on
during the protest. Social network also simplify organization of frustrated underachievers and net hamsters for the protests.
Notable quotes:
"... From Ukraine's Euromaidan in 2014, we know that hope can be rather deceptive and elusive. It hovers within touching distance during protests and is an additional incentive, but it never becomes a reality. Disillusionment and frustration do not set in until it is already too late, by which time power has fallen into the hands of those who immediately tighten the screws and have no intention of discussing anything with the people. ..."
Colour revolutions and other forms of outside interference in state affairs are changing. This is both logical and natural, since
government bodies adapt to change, find ways to counter threats, and retain the right to use legitimate force, which, according
to Max Weber, is one of the features of the modern state. But no sooner do the world's leading centres for interference and
destabilisation start feeling for new vulnerabilities in state systems than there is yet another attempted coup or an attack on a
state system. This kind of instability is not desirable for any country, since it could gradually weaken the immunity of
sovereignty. As a consequence, the transformation of protest movements should be of particular interest since, by understanding
their development, it will be possible to predict protesters' and rioters' course of action. The protests in Belarus show that
this is not what happened there, and the authorities were forced to respond quickly to the situation.
For an adequate understanding of anti-government strategies, it is necessary to turn, first of all, to the methods used by those
organising the protests and coups.
In his article "
Protests
and Principles
", Srđa Popović, a well-known activist, organiser of colour revolutions and executive director of CANVAS,
writes that the ideological and geopolitical factors focussed on by the media are insufficient to fully understand what's going
on and evaluate the protests. He suggests paying attention to the structural conditions that differ in different countries, as
well as the outcomes of movements. Popović concludes that the protests in recent years have shown a certain trend – "the
traditional and institutional ways of creating change – elections, legal systems and dialogue with the elites – are
insufficiently effective. So protesters have decided to utilize another form of power to force constructive change."
Executive
director of CANVAS Srđa Popović
Further on, he asks: "If geography and ideology don't determine success, what does?" He outlines four key principles. One – a
clear vision of the future. Two – a united opposition that should have a good understanding of who its allies are and who is
neutral. Three – key pillars, which could be the media, business sectors, social institutions and government agencies
(particularly security agencies that could be enticed over to the opposition). Four – attraction, which is a common element in
many protest movements, since they position themselves as fighters of injustice.
At the same time, Popović admits that anger (and therefore also violence) is an effective tool for mobilisation, but it should be
combined with hope, otherwise it will play a destructive role.
It
is with a regretful sigh that Popović writes about the failed "revolutions" in Hong Kong and Venezuela, for which he partially
blames the opposition. The problem with the former was the violence used against the police, and with the latter it was that Juan
Guaidó put all his efforts into winning over the military and overthrowing Maduro with a coup.
In summary, Srđa Popović argues that initial conditions and context matter, but strategic skills matter even more. And it is
difficult to disagree. After all, an initial flash of protest can be suppressed, activist cells can be liquidated, and crowds can
be dispersed. And if there is no definite plan of action for how to act in a given situation, then any protest, whether peaceful
or violent, will come to nothing.
Needless to say, the information in Popović's article is for naive readers and written with the utmost care so as to rule out any
possible accusations of anti-state activities. All the advice is given from the standpoint of protecting democratic values.
Therefore, one needs to be able to read between the lines and draw conclusions from past coups.
From Ukraine's Euromaidan in 2014, we know that hope can be rather deceptive and elusive. It hovers within touching distance
during protests and is an additional incentive, but it never becomes a reality. Disillusionment and frustration do not set in
until it is already too late, by which time power has fallen into the hands of those who immediately tighten the screws and have
no intention of discussing anything with the people.
CANVAS, however, is an organisation that develops strategic action plans for particular countries. Judging by its
recent
online summer academy
, CANVAS was actively involved in the overthrow of Bolivian President Evo Morales, supported protests in
Sudan, Zimbabwe and Brazil, and has close ties with opposition groups in Malaysia, the Philippines and Georgia.
Peter
Ackerman
Popović's views on the strategic planning of coups is shared by
Peter
Ackerman
, former chair of the board of trustees of Freedom House, and board member of the Council on Foreign Relations and
the NATO Atlantic Council. Ackerman believes that "
the
talented execution of even the simplest nonviolent tactics can alter the psychology of a population and the behavior of a regime
."
He also believes that the consolidated efforts of hundreds of small organisations can have a cumulative effect and make it look
like there is a unity of opinion and effort. This explains why, in Ukraine, the West actively supported both the radical
nationalists and the liberals, which is basically like crossing a grass snake with a viper, given that these two groups have
radically different ideologies. A similar situation can be seen in Belarus, where the muscle was provided by home-grown
nationalists (symbolism associated with Nazi collaborators during the war was openly used at protests), while representatives of
sexual minorities were included on various opposition councils.
The
International
Center on Nonviolent Conflict
, which was founded by Ackerman and whose headquarters are in Washington, does similar work to
CANVAS. In partnership with Rutgers University (New Jersey), the centre has been running online courses for activists since 2012.
These not only cover the theory of protest movements and provide specific examples, but also adapt new techniques. It is
noticeable that the course developers are seeking out new frontiers in resistance movements – how to exploit culture and
religion, or how to target corporations (since corporations can be state-owned, by focusing on a problem related to the company's
activities, attention can then be turned to the government itself).
George
Soros's son Alexander Soros with Hashim Thachi
The activities of another institution, the United States Institute of Peace,
cover
52 states
, and, in a number of countries (such as China and Iran), they are carried out indirectly, using local agents and
manipulating facts to its advantage. Thus, a recent report on Russia's interest in conflict zones states that "
Russia's
activities in conflict zones usually directly or indirectly run counter to Western interests
." The truth, however, is that it
is the West's activities that run counter to the interests of Russia, which then has to respond in some way. Russia has no
military bases in the Americas, whereas there are NATO bases and US troops on Russia's borders. Russian troops are in Syria
legitimately, whereas US troops in the country are effectively occupiers.
The
Tavistock
Institute
in London is doing some fairly serious work in the field of social engineering and manipulation. Its main
activities are carried out under the ruse of supporting self-organisation and human relationships. Thus, the Tavistock Institute
began developing the sociotechnical systems theory in the 1950s, started putting it into practice in the 1980s, and is still
using it now. The proliferation of perverts around the world under the smokescreen of tolerance is largely due to this
organisation (an agenda being carried out under the politically neutral guise of "
Group
Relations
").
It can be seen from these examples that the locale for protest headquarters and for the systematic destruction of the foundations
of national identity is the same – the West, chiefly America.
Along with attempts to maintain tactical flexibility during protests, one can often see adjustments being made in response to the
circumstances. Thus, the slogan "Flowers are better than bullets" on the placards of Belarusian opposition groups is just a
reworking of the slogan "Food not Bombs" used in the decentralised anti-war campaign that originated in the US in the 1980s
before spreading to Europe. A branch of this movement appeared in Belarus in 2005 with the help of local anarchists. A feature of
the movement is the distribution of vegetarian food to the poor and the homeless. Depending on who is behind the campaign, local
political nuances are superimposed in a number of countries.
Bernard-Henri
Levy with former Belarus' presidential candidate Svetlana Tikhanovskaya
Many protest movements rely on creativity. So, on 14 April 2020, Polish feminists
blocked
the traffic
on one of Warsaw's main streets. Although the police issued large fines (upwards of €6,000) to many of the
activists, no one is going to pay them, and the blocking of traffic was explained by the guidelines of the authorities themselves
to observe social distancing of two metres due to the pandemic. In the end, and with the help of lawyers, the draft bills were
passed to parliament, and a special commission has been appointed to review them. Thus, the feminists killed two birds with one
stone: they managed to troll the government's quarantine measures and also hold a protest that drew more attention to their
activities (which are directed against conservatives, including for the legalisation of abortion and the support of sexual
minorities).
One should also not forget the activities of individuals aimed at the destabilisation of various governments. Usually, they do it
out of ideological beliefs, often using their own money and working with international contacts. One such individual is the
French neoliberal philosopher Bernard-Henri Lévy, who actively supported coups in Yugoslavia and Ukraine, terrorists in Libya and
Syria, and is currently helping Belarus opposition leader Svetlana Tikhanovskaya, who lost in the country's recent presidential
election.
George
Soros and his son Alexander Soros
George Soros's son,
Alexander
Soros
, is diligently carrying on his father's work by serving as deputy chair of the Open Society Foundations. Recently, he
has been making frequent visits to the Balkans, where he has been seen in the company of many senior politicians. In addition to
Europe, Alexander Soros often visits Myanmar and is involved in projects in several African countries.
The activities of these people and organisations represent a multi-level international network with multiple dimensions of
communication and hidden strategies prepared with an eye to the future.
Therefore, to establish an adequate response mechanism to current and future challenges, the activities of these groups,
individuals and institutions must be monitored at the systemic level – constantly, thoroughly and comprehensively.
Reposts are welcomed with the reference to ORIENTAL REVIEW.
Geopolitical analyst, Chief editor of Geopolitica.ru, founder and chief editor of Journal of Eurasian Affairs; head of the
administration of International Eurasian Movement.
MH17 looks like a flashback to KAL007 to me, the evil is always Russian and every
where!
KAL007 was shot down by Russians, after some thousand kilometres in high sensitive Russian
air space partially shadowed by RC-135 spy plane. Extremely devilish!
Of course there are NO operational BUK systems and NO fascists in the ATO zone in east
Ukraine! And a SU-24 can't fly higher then 6km! Believe me, it's in Wikipedia!
"... The former Deputy Chief of the General Staff of the UAF Yury Dumansky stated on the air of the " NewsOne " TV channel that Kiev is guided by the decisions of the US concerning the question of resolving the conflict in Donbass ..."
Translated by Ollie Richardson & Angelina Siard21:40:3211/04/2018ria.ru
The former Deputy Chief of the General Staff of the UAF Yury Dumansky stated on the air of the "
NewsOne " TV channel
that Kiev is guided by the decisions of the US concerning the question of resolving the
conflict in Donbass.
The demands of the President Petro Poroshenko concerning the deployment of UN peacekeepers
in the east of the country will directly be agreed with the special representative of the US
State Department for Ukraine Kurt Volker , stressed Dumansky.
"We are in the conditions of the negotiation process. Not we, Ukraine, but a third
external player who presents America – Volker – decides for us. And he solves the
problem with the Russian Federation at the level of negotiations," noted the
Lieutenant-General.
And it is only after, according to the military, that Poroshenko undertakes measures
coordinated with the US for the solving of the conflict in Donbass.
"And then the corresponding processes are launched -- what we observe directly -- the
president's trips to Turkey, Germany where one of the questions concerning solving this
conflict are being raised," noted Dumansky.
Kiev in April, 2014, started a military operation against the self-proclaimed LPR and the
DPR, which declared their independence after a coup d'etat in Ukraine.
The issue of solving the situation in Donbass is discussed also during contact group
meetings in Minsk, which since September, 2014, adopted already three documents regulating
steps to de-escalate the conflict. However, firefights between the parties of the conflict
still continue.
Now the Ukrainian authorities try to obtain the introduction of UN peacekeepers in the East
of Ukraine. According to Kiev, "blue helmets" should be deployed on all the territory of
Donbass up to the border with Russia.
Vladimir Putin supported the idea of sending a peacekeeping mission to the East of Ukraine.
However, according to him, their task includes only ensuring the security of OSCE staff, and
they have to be based on the contact line.
Karl Marx said that " Philosophers have hitherto only
interpreted the world in various ways; the point is to change it ." I doubt very much that
you will know which changes you need to make if you don't have a very good idea about your
starting point. In his book Factfulness and in his many excellent online presentations, the
late Swedish Professor of International Health Hans Rosling identifies a lot of the ways things
have gotten better , especially for the world's poorest.
Suppose, for example, that you encounter the name " Milton Friedman ,"
perhaps in connection with lamented "neoliberalism" and maybe in connection with human rights
abuses perpetrated by the brutal Chilean dictator Augusto Pinochet. Friedman has been denounced
as the "father of global misery," and his reputation has taken another beating in the wake of
the fiftieth anniversary of his 1970 New York Times Magazine essay " The Social Responsibility of Business is to
Increase its Profits ," which I suspect most people haven't read past its title. But what
happened during "The Age of Milton Friedman," as the economist Andrei Shleifer asked in
a 2009
article ? Shleifer points out that "Between 1980 and 2005, as the world embraced free
market policies, living standards rose sharply, while life expectancy, educational attainment,
and democracy improved and absolute poverty declined."
Things have never been so good, and they are getting better , especially for the world's
poor.
In 2008, there was a bit of controversy over the establishment of the Milton Friedman
Institute at the University of Chicago, which operates today as the Becker Friedman Institute (it is also named for Friedman's
fellow Chicago economist Gary Becker ). In a
blistering
reply to a protest letter signed by a
group of faculty members at the University of Chicago, the economist John Cochrane wrote, "If
you start with the premise that the last 40 or so years, including the fall of communism, and
the opening of China and India are 'negative for much of the world's population,' you just
don't have any business being a social scientist. You don't stand a chance of contributing
something serious to the problems that we actually do face." Nor, might I add, do you stand
much of a chance of concocting a revolutionary program that will actually help the people
you're trying to lead.
2. What makes me so sure I won't replace the existing regime with
something far worse?
I might hesitate to push the aforementioned button because while the world we actually
inhabit is far from perfect, it's not at all clear that deleting the state overnight wouldn't
mean civilization's wholesale and maybe even perpetual collapse. At the very least, I would
want to think long and hard about it. The explicit mention of Frantz Fanon and Che Guevara in
the course description suggest that students will be approaching revolutionary ideas from the
left. They should look at the results of populist revolutions in 20th century Latin America,
Africa, and Asia. The blood of many millions starved and slaughtered in efforts to "forge a
better society" cries out against socialism and communism, and
macroeconomic populism in Latin America has been disastrous . As people have pointed out
when told that "democratic socialists" aren't trying to turn their countries into Venezuela,
Venezuelans weren't trying to turn their country into Venezuela when they embraced Hugo Chavez.
I wonder why we should expect WLU's aspiring revolutionaries to succeed where so many others
have failed.
3. Is my revolutionary program just a bunch of platitudes with which no
decent person would disagree?
In 2019, Kristian Niemietz of London's Institute of Economic Affairs published a useful
volume titled Socialism: The Failed Idea That Never Dies , which you can
download for $0 from IEA . He notes a tendency for socialists and neo-socialists to pitch
their programs almost exclusively in terms of their hoped-for results rather than in terms of
the operation of concrete social processes they hope to set in motion (on this I paraphrase
my intellectual hero Thomas Sowell ).
Apply a test proposed a long time ago by the economist William Easterly: can you imagine
anyone seriously objecting to what you're saying? If not, then you probably aren't saying
anything substantive. Can you imagine someone saying "I hate the idea of the world's poor
having better food, clothing, shelter, and medical care" or "It would be a very bad thing if
more people were literate?" If not, then it's likely that your revolutionary program is a
tissue of platitudes and empty promises. That's not to say it won't work politically–God
knows, nothing sells better on election day than platitudes and empty promises–but you
shouldn't think you're saying anything profound if all you're saying is something obvious like
"It would be nice if more people had access to clean, drinkable water."
... ... ...
7. How has it worked the other times it has been tried?
Years before the Russian Revolution, Eugene Richter predicted with eerie prescience what
would happen in a socialist society in his short book Pictures of the Socialistic Future (
which you can
download for $0 here ). Bryan Caplan, who wrote the foreword for that edition of Pictures
and who put together the online " Museum of Communism ," points out
the distressing regularity with which communists go from "bleeding heart" to "mailed fist." It
doesn't take long for communist regimes to go from establishing a workers' paradise to shooting
people who try to leave. Consider whether or not the brutality and mass murder of communist
regimes is a feature of the system rather than a bug. Hugo Chavez and Che
Guevara both expressed bleeding hearts with their words but used a mailed fist in practice
(I've written before that "irony" is denouncing Milton Friedman for the crimes of Augusto
Pinochet while wearing a Che Guevara t-shirt. Pinochet was a murderous thug. Guevara was, too).
Caplan points to
pages 105 and 106 of Four Men: Living the Revolution: An Oral History of Contemporary Cuba
. On page 105, Lazaro Benedi Rodriguez's heart is bleeding for the illiterate. On page 106,
he's "advis(ing) Fidel to have an incinerator dug about 40 or 50 meters deep, and every time
one of these obstinate cases came up, to drop the culprit in the incinerator, douse him with
gasoline, and set him on fire."
... ... ...
9. What will I do with people who aren't willing to go along with my
revolution?
Walter Williams once said that he doesn't mind if communists want to be communists. He minds
that they want him to be a communist, too. Would you allow people to try capitalist experiments
in your socialist paradise? Or socialist experiments in your capitalist paradise (Families,
incidentally, are socialist enterprises that run by the principle "from each according to his
ability, to each according to his needs.")? Am I willing to allow dissenters to advocate my
overthrow, or do I need to crush dissent and control the minds of the masses in order for my
revolution to work? Am I willing to allow people to leave, or will I need to build a wall to
keep people in?
10. Am I letting myself off the hook for questions 1-9 and giving myself
too much credit for passion and sincerity?
The philosopher David Schmidtz has said that if your best argument is that your heart is in
the right place, then your heart is most definitely not in the right place. Consider this quote
from Edmund Burke and ask whether or not it leads you to revise your revolutionary plans:
"A conscientious man would be cautious how he dealt in blood. He would feel some
apprehension at being called to a tremendous account for engaging in so deep a play, without
any sort of knowledge of the game. It is no excuse for presumptuous ignorance, that it is
directed by insolent passion. The poorest being that crawls on earth, contending to save
itself from injustice and oppression is an object respectable in the eyes of God and man. But
I cannot conceive any existence under heaven (which, in the depths of its wisdom, tolerates
all sorts of things) that is more truly odious and disgusting, than an impotent helpless
creature, without civil wisdom or military skill, without a consciousness of any other
qualification for power but his servility to it, bloated with pride and arrogance, calling
for battles which he is not to fight, contending for a violent dominion which he can never
exercise, and satisfied to be himself mean and miserable, in order to render others
contemptible and wretched." (Emphasis added).
A couple of lessons for Belarus, if it has a government capable of learning from the
mistakes of others rather than insisting upon making them itself before learning; the first
– Ukraine.
The Biggest Little Country In Yurrup has just voted, in an extraordinary meeting of the
Verkhovna Rada, to beg the EU for a further loan of $1.2 Billion. For that mess of pottage,
it will accept enhanced external governance.
"With this memorandum, Ukraine undertakes to increase the role of international
structures in the judicial system, law enforcement agencies, and state-owned enterprises'
executive boards (with the restoration of their cosmic salaries)."
Of course, that's the selfish Russian perspective; it comes from Stalker Zone. The
'reality' as Ukrainians see it might be a lot more lighthearted, like going on an adventure
with some foreign friends! And it might not even happen, considering the Ukrainian plan to
get half the money up front, without having to satisfy any of the conditions, although even
the full $1.2 Billion seems to me a bargain price to gain control of Ukrainian state
institutions. If I had $1.2 Billion lying around doing nothing, I might buy them myself.
When you think about it, it is amazing how willing eastern Europeans are to believe the
siren song of western capital investment, since as soon as they control the company, they
break it up and sell it, and the locals are left with nothing but western newspapers to keep
their bums from freezing. But it happens over and over.
It's the lottery mentality, most of the poor saps will only get poorer but the chance of
winning big (especially if you have a few connections) overwhelms logic and common sense. It
what makes capitalism so attractive – dreams of big wealth and leaving your poor slum
behind make the most miserable life somehow tolerable.
And it what makes socialism so boring – you may be, on average, better off but
little prospect for that life-changing jackpot.
There is more to it than that but the dreams of a big payday explains much of why so many
Eastern Europeans put up with, if not embrace, capitalism BS.
The carrot always seemingly just out of reach works for most until the day you die. And if
you do reach the carrot, you will soon realize that it is rotten.
Trying to make ends meet, you're a slave to the money then you die.
– Bittersweet Symphony
On July 21 st , Ukrainian businessman and politician David Zhvania revealed some
open secrets of the Ukrainian politics, including crimes that former Ukrainian President Petro
Poroshenko had carried out. The irony of the situation is that Zhvania was, at one point, the
leader of Poroshenko's campaign headquarters.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/JChtKpaulOs
He said that Euromaidan was ruled by criminal groups led by the people who were leading the
parties that came into power following the coup – the BPP (Bloc of Petro Poroshenko) and
the National Front.
He also said that he had participated in giving multimillion-dollar bribes to European
officials in exchange for their support to Poroshenko's election as president.
The former member of Ukrainian parliament, in his video message, said that Ukraine is
threatened with a new coming to power of Poroshenko.
"A creeping revenge is taking place in the country – Zelensky's rating falls, and
Poroshenko and his entourage are again striving for power. I cannot look at it calmly, so I
decided to give this press conference. Warn the citizens of Ukraine not to make a mistake. Tell
everyone. who is Poroshenko and his entourage.
This is a criminal group that from the very beginning participated in the Maidan solely for
the sake of seizing power and personal enrichment," Zhvania said.
He said that following the 2014 Maidan, an organized criminal group took power in Ukraine,
and he admitted that he was part of it.
According to Zhvania, it was this criminal group that financed the protests and thwarted any
options for agreements with the authorities (the Yanukovich government), which were designed to
avoid escalation.
"I was also a member of the organized criminal group, which seized power in 2014 on the wave
of popular protests. We financed the Maidan, we fueled protest moods in the media, thwarted the
government's peace initiatives, conducted separate negotiations with deputies of the Party of
Regions, and negotiated with foreign embassies.
The organized criminal group included Martynenko, Poroshenko, Turchynov, Yatsenyuk,
Klitschko. Each of whom has attached its own group. Turchinov, for example, brought Pashinsky
and Parubiy," Zhvania said and added that he was ready to testify on this matter.
After the coup victory, Zhvania's group engaged in political corruption to secure the
presidency for Poroshenko.
"I and Klimkin (note: Klimkin later became the foreign minister) directly participated in
the transfer of 5 million euros through the Ukrainian Embassy in Germany for one high-ranking
European official at that time in order to ensure support for Poroshenko as a candidate for the
presidency of Ukraine from the EU. I am ready to provide the circumstances of this to the
investigating authorities," Zhvania claimed.
In his opinion, Poroshenko became president as a result of the consensus of the oligarchs.
And he took on certain obligations to them, which in most cases he carried out.
According to Zhvania, during his tenure as president, Poroshenko acquired approximately $3.4
billion in bribes.
The former politician hoped that President Zelensky "will have enough political will to
bring the case of Poroshenko and his entourage to an end."
"Poroshenko today, on the eve of local elections, may try to run for mayor. Before Maidan,
it was his dream – he humiliatingly begged Yanukovych for the right to run for mayor of
Kiev, was ready to give a bribe for this. Yanukovych did not allow, and Poroshenko did not dare
to disobey," Zhvania said and promised to reveal more in the following weeks.
The Euromaidan in 2014 was not a spontaneous protest, but was financed by political
circles to overthrow Yanukovych.
Any peace initiatives were thwarted by a group that included Martynenko, Poroshenko,
Turchynov, Yatsenyuk and Klitschko.
Zhvania and Klimkin gave 5 million euros in bribes to a European official to lobby for
Poroshenko's interests as a presidential candidate in 2014.
David Zhvania is a well-known Ukrainian businessman from Georgia. Long-term business partner
of the deputy of several iterations of Parliament Nikolay Martynenko.
Zhvania was also a member in four different Ukrainian parliament configurations. In 2004, he
was an ally of Yushchenko, was a member of the Our Ukraine bloc, and took part in the Orange
Revolution. In 2005, he served as Minister of Emergency Situations in the government of Yulia
Tymoshenko.
In 2006 he went to the Verkhovna Rada from "Our Ukraine" and Yushchenko, but he had a
falling out with him.
In 2010, he became friends with the Yanukovych team.
In the 2012 elections, he entered parliament as a self-nominated and non-partisan candidate
in 140 constituencies. He was a member of the Party of Regions faction, but left it in 2013
when the Revolution of Dignity began.
In the 2014 elections, he was one of the heads of the electoral headquarters of the Petro
Poroshenko Bloc. People's Deputy Aleksandr Onishchenko stated that he transferred money to
Zhvania for a seat in the parliament of the 8th convocation.
Dominic Raab @DominicRaab
· Jul 17 Today, we remember
that 6 years ago flight #MH17 was shot down & 298
people tragically lost their lives, including 10 citizens. We support
the ongoing trial in the Netherlands to deliver justice for those who died & for their
loved ones, and call on Russia to cooperate fully
And Russia does not try to cooperate fully?
Is Russia even allowed to cooperate?
The Ukraine is allowed to cooperate, of course, and not only cooperate: the Ukraine is
part of the "Joint Investigative Team"!
The Ukraine even provides "evidence" of Russian culpability!
And of course, according to the mendacious Raab, the purpose of the "trial" is to deliver
"justice for those who died and their loved ones" and certainly not to apportion blame on
Russia and the so-called terrorists in eastern Ukraine, whom Russia supports by, amongst
other things, having dispatched a Buk ground-to-air anti-aircraft missile launching complex
from Russia to the Ukraine, which weaponry was part of the Russian armed forces and manned by
Russian servicemen, then ferreted said system out of the Ukraine back to Russia, mission
having been accomplished, namely the downing of a civilian airliner that, for some reason or
other, had been diverted by Ukraine air-traffic control over a war zone in the Ukraine and on
a day when all Ukraine air-traffic radars were, for some inexplicable reason, out of
action.
Raab, to partly quote one of your fellow British cabinet ministers and erstwhile foreign
minister: "You should go away and shut up!"
"... There was a deeply held assumption that, when the countries of Central and Eastern Europe joined NATO and the European Union in 2004, these countries would continue their positive democratic and economic transformation. Yet more than a decade later, the region has experienced a steady decline in democratic standards and governance practices at the same time that Russia's economic engagement with the region expanded significantly. ..."
"... Are these developments coincidental, or has the Kremlin sought deliberately to erode the region's democratic institutions through its influence to 'break the internal coherence of the enemy system'? ..."
"... a false flag operation" involving "an alliance of the far right organizations, specifically the Right Sector and Svoboda, and oligarchic parties, such as Fatherland". There is little in Sharp's book to suggest that non-violent resistance would have had much effect on a really brutal and determined government. He also has the naïve habit of using "democrat" and "dictator" as if these words were as precisely defined as coconuts and codfish. But any "dictatorship" – for example Stalin's is a very complex affair with many shades of opinion in it. So, in terms of what he was apparently trying to do, one can see it only succeeding against rather mild "dictators" presiding over extremely unpopular polities. With a great deal of outside effort and resources. ..."
"... His "playbook" is useful to outside powers that want to overthrow governments they don't like. Especially those run by "dictators" not brutal enough to shoot the protesters down. ..."
Once I'd seen this mention of The Russian Playbook (aka KGB, Kremlin or Putin's Playbook), I
saw the expression all over the place. Here's an early – perhaps the earliest – use
of the term. In October 2016, the Center for Strategic and International studies (" Ranked #1 ") informed us of the "
Kremlin Playbook "
with this ominous beginning
There was a deeply held assumption that, when the countries of Central and Eastern
Europe joined NATO and the European Union in 2004, these countries would continue their
positive democratic and economic transformation. Yet more than a decade later, the region has
experienced a steady decline in democratic standards and governance practices at the same
time that Russia's economic engagement with the region expanded significantly.
And asks
Are these developments coincidental, or has the Kremlin sought deliberately to erode
the region's democratic institutions through its influence to 'break the internal coherence
of the enemy system'?
Well, to these people, to ask the question is to answer it: can't possibly be disappointment
at the gap between 2004's expectations and 2020's reality, can't be that they don't like the
total Western values package that they have to accept, it must be those crafty Russians
deceiving them. This was the earliest reference to The Playbook that I found, but it certainly
wasn't the last.
Of course, all these people are convinced Moscow interfered in the 2016 presidential
election. Somehow. To some effect. Never really specified but the latest outburst of insanity
is this video from the
Lincoln Project . As Anatoly Karlin observes: "I think it's really
cool how we Russians took over America just by shitposting online. How does it feel to be
subhuman?" He has a point: the Lincoln Project, and the others shrieking about Russian
interference, take it for granted that American democracy is so flimsy and Americans so
gullible that a few Facebook ads can bring the whole facade down. A curious mental state
indeed.
What can we know about The Playbook? For a start it must be written in Russian, a language
that those crafty Russians insist on speaking among themselves. Secondly such an important
document would be protected the way that highly classified material is protected. There would
be a very restricted need to know; underlings participating in one of the many plays would not
know how their part fitted into The Playbook; few would ever see The Playbook itself. The
Playbook would be brought to the desk of the few authorised to see it by a courier, signed for,
the courier would watch the reader and take away the copy afterwards. The very few copies in
existence would be securely locked away; each numbered and differing subtly from the others so
that, should a leak occur, the authorities would know which copy read by whom had been leaked.
Printed on paper that could not be photographed or duplicated. As much protection as human
cunning could devise; right up there with
the nuclear codes .
And so on. It's all quite ridiculous: we're supposed to believe that Moscow easily controls
far-away countries but can't keep its neighbours under control.
There is no Russian Playbook, that's just projection. But there is a "playbook" and it's
written in English, it's freely available and it's inexpensive enough that every pundit can
have a personal copy: it's named "
From Dictatorship To Democracy: A Conceptual Framework for Liberation " and it's written by
Gene Sharp (1928-2018) .
Whatever Sharp may have thought he was doing, whatever good cause he thought he was assisting,
his book has been used as a guide to create regime changes around the world. Billed as
"democracy" and "freedom", their results are not so benign. Witness Ukraine today. Or Libya. Or
Kosovo whose long-time leader has just been indicted for numerous crimes .
Curiously enough, these efforts always take place in countries that resist Washington's line
but never in countries that don't. Here we do see training, financing, propaganda, discord
being sown, divisions exploited to effect regime change – all the things in the imaginary
"Russian Playbook". So, whatever he may have thought he was helping, Sharp's advice has been
used to produce what only the propagandists could call "
model interventions "; to the "liberated" themselves, the reality is poverty , destruction ,
war and
refugees .
Reading Sharp's book, however, makes one wonder if he was just fooling himself. Has there
ever been a "dictatorship" overthrown by "non-violent" resistance along the lines of what he is
suggesting? He mentions Norwegians who resisted Hitler; but Norway was liberated, along with
the rest of Occupied Europe, by extremely violent warfare. While some Jews escaped, most didn't
and it was the conquest of Berlin that saved the rest: the nazi state was killed . The
USSR went away, together with its satellite governments in Europe but that was a top-down
event. He likes Gandhi but Gandhi wouldn't have lasted a minute under Stalin. Otpor was greatly aided by NATO's war
on Serbia. And, they're only "non-violent" because the Western media doesn't talk much about
the violence ;
"non-violent" is not the first word that comes to mind in this video of Kiev 2014 . "Colour revolutions" are
manufactured from existing grievances, to be sure, but with a great deal of outside assistance,
direction and funding; upon inspection, there's much design behind their "spontaneity". And,
not infrequently, with mysterious sniping at a expedient moment – see Katchanovski's
research on the "Heavenly Hundred" of the Maidan showing pretty convincingly that the
shootings were " a false flag operation" involving "an alliance of the far right
organizations, specifically the Right Sector and Svoboda, and oligarchic parties, such as
Fatherland". There is little in Sharp's book to suggest that non-violent resistance would have
had much effect on a really brutal and determined government. He also has the naïve habit
of using "democrat" and "dictator" as if these words were as precisely defined as coconuts and
codfish. But any "dictatorship" – for example Stalin's is a very complex affair with many
shades of opinion in it. So, in terms of what he was apparently trying to do, one can see it
only succeeding against rather mild "dictators" presiding over extremely unpopular polities.
With a great deal of outside effort and resources.
The Flight Safety Foundation has begun an investigation into why Kiev did not close the
airspace over the warzone in eastern Ukraine where MH17 was destroyed in July 2014, a Dutch
foreign ministry spokesperson has confirmed to Sputnik.
"This isn't just parallel litigation, which the ECHR has already refused to allow,"
commented a London legal expert. "It's a vote of no confidence in the Dutch prosecutors to
secure convictions in the murder case they are trying to make."
Rutte and his foreign minister, Stephanus Blok, made their move on July 10 with press
releases and tweets; there has been no release of the legal papers. The ECHR has yet to
record their lawsuit
####
Well we're not surprised! Rutte seems quite adept at autof/kery.
The Russian Foreign Ministry welcomed the formation in Malaysia of its own position on
the collapse of MH17 The department noted that in the West this tragedy has been portrayed one-sidedly and
biased.
July 2, 2020
<bMOSCOW, July 2. / TASS /. The publication of a book written by Mahajir Ibrahim on the
causes of the downing of flight MH17 indicates the formation of a position in Malaysian
society on this tragedy. This was announced on Thursday at a briefing by the official
representative of the Russian Foreign Ministry, Maria Zakharova.
"The appearance of the book testifies to the increasing desire of the Malaysians to
form their own opinion about what happened. We believe that the latter is especially
important, given how the tragedy has been covered in a one-sided and biased manner in the
West", she said.
As noted by Zakharova, in the book, the author pays special attention to various
versions of the airliner crash as well as to motives, "including not always obvious ones
which concern one or another country involved in the crash investigation. For example, the
United States, as the author claims, has used tragedy to justify the need for new sanctions
against Russia", the diplomat said.
Суд одобрил
повторный
запрос у США
снимков с места
крушения MH17
RT на русском, 3
июля 2020
Court has given approval for a re-request to the United States for images of the MH17
crash site
RT in Russian, July 3, 2020
The Netherlands court has called the proposal to re-appeal to the United States about
satellite images from the crash site of a Malaysian Boeing in eastern Ukraine in 2014
justified.
This was reported by RIA Novosti with reference to the presiding judge Hendrick
Steenheys.
According to him, interest in viewing satellite images and introducing them to the case
is obvious.
"The court notes that since the autumn of 2016, the prosecutor's office has not made
any attempts to verify whether these images can be made public as part of the criminal
process. A second request would be reasonable", said the judge.
It is noted that at past hearings, lawyers asked to make a second request to the United
States about satellite data that allegedly recorded the launch of a missile on Boeing flight
MH17.
Earlier, the Dutch prosecutor Theis Berger, said that the Ukraine had not provided
primary data from radars for the case concerning the downing of the Malaysian Boeing.
The Boeing 777, flying from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur, crashed on July 17, 2014 in the
Donetsk region of the Ukraine, killing 283 passengers and 15 crew members.
A Dutch court has denied MH17 crash lawyers a second request for satellite data from
NATO. This was announced by the presiding judge Hendrick Steenhuis reports RIA
Novosti.
Earlier, on June 29, Dutch lawyer for the accused Oleg Pulatov, Baudewein van Eyck,
stated that NATO has not provided satellite data from the crash site. In this regard, he
asked the court to find out whether the North Atlantic Alliance has relevant records for the
eastern Ukraine zone on July 17, 2014. The court, in turn, recalled that it had already made
such a request and the response said that no data was recorded from the crash site of flight
MH17.
"We conclude that NATO does not have such data So the second request was rejected," the
judge explained at the July 3 hearing.
A Dutch court investigating the downing of MH17 has agreed to hear from Almaz-Antey, a
Russian arms manufacturer, which argues that the prevailing Western narrative – that
rebels in eastern Ukraine shot down the plane – is false.
The hearing in Badhoevedorp, Netherlands says it will explore alternative scenarios in
the high-profile trial, in which four anti-Kiev fighters stand accused of using a Russian
anti-aircraft missile to destroy the civilian plane, killing 283 passengers – mostly
Dutch – and 15 crew on board.
Crash site, crash site, crash site. We don't give a flip about the crash site; it has been
done to death. What Kerry claimed, and never, ever substantiated in any way whatsoever other
than non-stop allusion to having the information amongst its mountains of evidence, was that
the USA had remotely observed the taking of the shot, and had seen the where and the when of
its origin, and seen the very moment the airliner disappeared from radar. NOBODY CARES ABOUT
THE CRASH SITE. The dispute does not revolve around whether or not the aircraft crashed, or
where, but who shot it down and from where the shot originated. The USA claimed to know
– and be able to prove conclusively – both those things. It manifestly is not
going to do so no matter how many requests are floated, because if the Dutch thought there
was any hope of proving the case to that level of certainty, the prosecution would never have
embarked on its ridiculous strategy of 'conditional intent'.
I think it is at least possible if not probable that the USA did record something, or
bought it from Digital Globe and now is sitting on it. I personally think the USA knows full
well that Ukraine was probably or even definitely responsible, and is deliberately blocking
that discovery. It is at least possible that this trial is all about a verdict of 'Guess
we'll never know', so people will stop digging. But I'm sure they would still like a
conviction of some Russians if it looked like they could pull it off.
The entire trial, and indeed the investigation which preceded it, has been an attempt to
push a narrative in which first the investigators and then the officers of the court have
stated 'facts' which are not in evidence. On occasion persons have claimed to have seen the
evidence themselves, and satisfied themselves that it invites the conclusion they have
arrived upon, and have asked to be believed on the strength of their reputations because the
evidence cannot be made publicly available. Sometimes this has been difficult to grant
because no such reputation for veracity is present, and sometimes because the scenario the
missing evidence purports to tie together is so plainly ludicrous and/or biased toward or
away from certain conclusions that it is broadly unacceptable. Anyway, I think it is fair to
say that there is little we can claim we 'know'.
One think I believe we do 'know' is that if the United States had some slam-dunk evidence
which would prove east-Ukrainian militias shot down MH17, regardless by design or by mistake,
the United States would find a way to make that evidence available, and would have done so
long since. It is so clearly in its own interests to make this case, simultaneously removing
all doubt that its loyal ally – Ukraine – was not responsible, and so many
examples exist of the United States flinging aside its own rules when doing so served its
interests, that it is impossible to believe conclusive satellite evidence exists which proves
what they say it does, but modesty and concerns for national security prohibit showing it.
Similarly, if actual US government satellite data showed the movement of a single Buk TELAR
from Kursk to eastern Ukraine and back again at the time of the disaster, it would be in
every newspaper. Instead, we get limited hangouts and photoshops from Bellingcat, which has
turned out to be a nice little earner for Higgins and like-minded computer nerds.
I believe, but cannot prove yet, that an ATC is not allowed to assume control of an
aircraft in his/her airspace if no primary radar is available – something which has
long bothered me is Ukraine's cheeky assurance that it cannot supply any electronic data
because no primary radars were available, and the west's no-problem acceptance of this
excuse. If no primary radar is available, the ATC actually has no video contact with the
aircraft; Automatic Dependent Surveillance- Broadcast (ADS-B) consists of the aircraft
determining its own position relative to everything else, and broadcasting it to the ground.
The ATC must, armed with this information, provide guidance on altitude and course which will
not take the aircraft he/she is controlling too close to other aircraft operating in the same
airspace. There are rules on acceptable separation with/without primary radar, and obviously
when the ATC cannot see the aircraft on his/her own radar, greater separation is necessary
for safety. Other aircraft were operating in proximity, and there was speculation at the time
that one or more of them might have seen the flare from the explosion, but I forget now how
far away each was and am too lazy to look it up. Anyway, separation between aircraft in the
best conditions, when you have primary radar contact and can see raw video on your scope, and
secondary broadcast (because primary radar does not give identification or altitude) is five
miles ahead on the aircraft's course and three miles to each side.
ICAO PANS-ATM ( Doc.4444 , Chapter 8) details radar separation minima of five (5) and
three (3) nautical miles. These minima allow for a considerable increase in airspace
utilisation compared to procedural control. Changes to ICAO documents are about to be
published (2007) recognising ADS-B use to support 5 nautical mile separation standards.
ICAO's Separation & Airspace Safety Panel (SASP) is working on proposals to allow 3
nautical mile separation standards using ADS-B and also on the use of multilateration to
support both 3 and 5 nautical mile separation standards.
Early in the investigation of the incident, within a day or two, alert observers claimed
Ukraine had given MH17 an ordered course correction which took it directly over the DNR.
There was some talk about a altitude reduction as well, but I can't find any reference to
that now. There was immediate pushback from Ukraine's defenders, so,me saying the course
correction was just an urban legend and had never happened, some that MH17 had itself
requested a course change due to weather, etc Whatever the case, the information was expunged
from FlightRadar and other sites which provide it in the public domain, although there are
many screen captures of it as it appeared at the time – people have learned that
sensitive information has a way of vanishing from the internet as if it had never been.
Perhaps you can give course corrections to aircraft that you cannot see on radar, but it
would be an act of faith that their broadcast data is accurate, and you must observe proper
flight separation; the five-and-three rule applies to separation of aircraft that you can see
on radar. So what I am saying is that if MH17's separation from other flights did not exceed
five miles to the front and rear and three miles to either side, either the Ukrainian
controller had primary radar available and could see MH17, or else he/she was controlling in
violation of ICAO rules.
So, as to the satellite data which would reveal who shot down MH17, there are two
alternatives I can see; one, the USA has no such data, and John Kerry was full of shit as
usual, just grandstanding. Two, they do have such information, but it reveals a scenario
drastically different to the one in the official narrative. Whatever the case, if the USA
could prove beyond a doubt that Eastern-Ukrainian militia using a single Buk TELAR provided
by Russia shot down the aircraft from the vicinity of Schnizne, and then booked it back to
Russia with all reasonable dispatch, all the while firing off frantic radio messages to one
another, there is nothing which would stop them from providing it. People already have a
pretty good idea what is possible through satellite photography and analysis, what resolution
is achievable and how easy it is to interpret what is revealed, and it's pretty hard to
believe America is playing coy because it has unearthly technological capabilities which must
remain secret even if it means murderers go free.
I'm afraid I still think the Dutch have their minds made up, and have done from the first,
who is going to be awarded responsibility, and are now just going through the motions of
being scrupulously fair; they would not accept Russia's primary radar data or insisted it
shows nothing useful, supported the Ukrainian view that data held by Russia which shows the
missile the Ukies are exhibiting as the murder weapon was transferred to Ukraine many years
ago and never returned to Russia is forged or faked, ignored the impossibility of parts from
such a missile being found 'at the crash scene' or 'in the wreckage' because the missile
responsible would have exploded by proximity fuse without ever touching the airliner, except
for the shrapnel from the warhead – the missile parts would have fallen to earth miles
away, where the aircraft was hit and not where it landed. The premise of now exploring
'alternative scenarios' just looks like window-dressing to me, and I think it should be
regarded with the greatest suspicion.
The title of the linked article implies the Dutch will seek 'images of the crash site'
from the Americans. We have seen images of the crash site up the yingyang. What we need to
see is imagery of the missile shot being taken, and from where it originated plus any detail
visible of the system which fired it.
"Ukraine's SBU security service has confiscated recordings of conversations between
Ukrainian air traffic control officers and the crew of the doomed airliner, a source in Kiev
has told Interfax news agency."
####
The link above of course doesn't work but this one from the 16:38.18 snapshot does (so
take a screenshot!):
15:29: Ukraine's SBU security service has confiscated recordings of conversations between
Ukrainian air traffic control officers and the crew of the doomed airliner, a source in Kiev
has told Interfax news agency.
Ummm how does that square with reports that examination of the Cockpit Voice Recorder on
the downed flight revealed 'nothing useful'. and there being nothing on it – no audio
– for some four minutes (just guessing, I would have to look it up again, somewhere on
Helmer's site) following a routine positional update? What would be the point of confiscating
voice records of communications between the ATC and the aircraft from one end if they had a
recording in full from the other, the receiving end?
Unless, of course, there was something on it you felt you could safely remove, considering
no other record of it remained.
I believe the report of armed men seizing the ATC recordings was first offered by
'Carlos', the mystery ATC whose every appearance is greeted with yodels of joy by Matt, our
former Venezuela correspondent, who claims that Carlos was conclusively and irrefutably
proven not to exist, being a complete fabrication by Russia. So it's kind of complicated. The
only thing I could say about it at this point would be that if it actually was done by
Ukraine and was not a planned provocation but an accident, the speed and efficiency with
which the global PR apparatus swung into action was awe-inspiring. If it was planned and
executed by Ukraine, it was such a cold-blooded act that they would never live it down if it
were exposed. But how likely is it that either Ukraine or Russia accidentally shot it down,
and in only minutes, goons broke into the control tower and seized the recordings? If that
ever actually happened, it would be a critical piece of evidence arguing that the
shooting-down of MH17 was a carefully-planned provocation by Ukraine. They certainly would
not seize recordings required by law to be retained as part of an investigation in order to
protect Russia. The sole explanation for such behavior, if it could ever be proven to have
happened, would be to prevent one's own implication in the crime. And it could never have
happened so quickly by happenstance – it would have to be part of a plan.
A couple of interesting things from the Malaysian statement: one, it affirms that Ukraine
ordered a descent in altitude from 35,000 ft to 33,000 ft. Two, it affirms the aircraft was
at all times within airspace which had been cleared by the ICAO. If true, not only Ukraine is
to blame for not closing the airspace over a war zone.
I don't see anything between 16:37 and 16:41. Are you talking about the live feed
record?
When the US State Department was not yet even sure if any Americans had been aboard, Sammy
Power was already saying it was a surface-to-air missile that brought down the plane, and
there was already language being used which said "a Russian missile system or supplied by
Russia". In retrospect, it kind of looks like a plan, doesn't it? Similarly, all early
statements said that if the plane had been shot down, it was 'an unspeakable crime'. There
was never any question of it being an accident.
At 03:13 the narrative says "Data on MH17's flight route by flightradar24 suggests the
plane had deviated slightly from its usual route and flew across the length of Ukraine."
"Flightradar24" is a hotlink, but if you click it you learn that Googlemaps has disabled the
feed and the data is not recoverable.
Wow; spooky; at 04:05 the feed says "Aviation website Flightradar24.com says in a Facebook
post that MH17's plane crashed exactly 17 years after its first flight." First time I'd ever
heard that.
All through the narrative are regular intercessions by the Americans, the British and the
Australians to reiterate that it was a horrible murder and that Russia is responsible.
Mmmm interesting – in reference to my earlier statement that if you had the tapes
you would know what could safely be removed from the CVR once it was located, this report
reflects that several news sites including the BBC mentioned the ATC tapes being seized by
the SBU. At one point, Ukraine's Ambassador to Malaysia Ihor Humennyi said "it is just the
same as the flight data and cockpit voice recorders".
Oh, okay – now I see it. 15:28. I was looking at 16:38. "Ukraine's SBU security
service has confiscated recordings of conversations between Ukrainian air traffic control
officers and the crew of the doomed airliner, a source in Kiev has told Interfax news
agency." But Matt has told us several times that is all bullshit concocted by the
now-proven-to-have-never-existed 'Carlos'.
It happens to all of us, no? But, being right once doesn't verify all the other opinions
of that person. Remember he frequently refused to admit he was wrong and would accuse others
of deliberately misinterpreting what he wrote, which was very odd as his english was quite
good. He was quite the Princess because that is how he behaved, petulant, childish,
priviliged, and never, ever wrong. Or in short, a troll, which is why I never engaged with
him(?).
"We are alarmed by continuous attempts to misuse the Ukrainian justice system for
politically motivated persecution of political opponents," said lawmakers from the informal
Friends of European Ukraine group in a statement on Friday (3 July).
After the peaceful power transition of 2019 election in the post-Soviet country,
"current attempts to prosecute political opponents pose a risk of democratic backsliding,"
the group of MEPs added.
Ukraine's former president, Petro Poroshenko, is suspected of abuse of office by
illegally pressuring the then-chief of Ukraine's Foreign Intelligence Service, Yehor Bozhok,
into appointing Serhiy Semоchko as his deputy.
Poroshenko is involved in 24 investigations, with three others recently closed, and
denies any wrongdoing, calling the probes selective justice 'at the orders of [Volodymyr]
Zelensky', the current president .
The 50-member group, which does not have formal standing, was created in September last
year with the goal of providing political support and to promote Ukraine's economic
integration with the EU
####
Unfortunately there is more at the link except the names of MEPs.
A Ukrainian oligarch has his own MEP lobby group! Why should we be surprised? I can't find
a list of members (this is not the old 2014-19 group and this European Parliament page has
not been updated with the new group of the same name) but Auštrevičius is the
chaiman. There's also the Friends of Ukraine with the like of Fogh Rasmussen, Versbow,
Rifkind, Cox, Bildt etc. on the Rasmussen site.
No matter how corrupt, murderous or just plain nasty, it is more important to keep the
u-Kraine close to the EU, close to NATO etc. for strategic purposes. It's just another
western chapter of looking the other way for their 'son of a bitches.'
"... There is no beyond reasonable doubt evidence (No US satellite pictures as claimed by Biden, even within NATO to Dutch Intel) and the defence is not pushing that hard but have asked for the Russian General to be called to describe the BUK missile's documented life i. e. it came from Ukraine's stock. ..."
Enjoy your updates. The MH17 trial is turning into an interesting indictment on Dutch
justice. There is no beyond reasonable doubt evidence (No US satellite pictures as claimed by
Biden, even within NATO to Dutch Intel) and the defence is not pushing that hard but have
asked for the Russian General to be called to describe the BUK missile's documented life i.
e. it came from Ukraine's stock.
So, on July 3rd the Judges have to decide whether to allow that evidence, which definitely
puts the evidence less than reasonable double, or not allow it and convict the four
defendants on insufficient evidence to meet Dutch Law, or allow them to go free.
Looks like they have a bit of a problem meeting the expectations of the US.
The Dutch Government has
devised an evidence-proof scheme for ensuring
the trial of the Russian government for the
destruction of Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17
will end in a conviction
.
This scheme will work without evidence to prove that the four men accused of the crime of
shooting down the aircraft, killing the 298 passengers and crew on board on July 17, 2014, intended
to kill; or even intended to fire the missile which allegedly brought MH17 down.
The Dutch scheme is evidence-proof because no evidence will be needed, not from US satellite
photographs which are missing; nor NATO airborne tracking which shows no missile; nor Ukrainian
Security Service (SBU) evidence which has proved to have been fabricated, and in the case of
Ukrainian witnesses for the prosecution, threatened, tortured or bribed.
The scheme is also evidence-proof because the Dutch Prime Minister has told the Dutch Minister
of Justice to order the state prosecutors to tell the state-appointed judge that he must convict
the Russians if he finds as proven that MH17 crashed to the ground in eastern Ukraine; that
everyone on board was killed; and that the four soldiers accused – three Russians and one Ukrainian
– were on the ground fighting.
International war crimes lawyers are calling this a legal travesty. It was presented in court
near Amsterdam by Dutch state prosecutor Thijs Berger on June 10. It has gone unnoticed in the
mainstream western media. Russian reporters following the trial have missed it. The scheme was
first reported in English and Russian by a NATO propaganda unit on June 12.
As a prosecutor of the Dutch War Crimes Unit, a state entity, Berger has been employed in the
past to prosecute the targets of wars fought by the Dutch, alongside NATO and the US, in Yugoslavia
and Afghanistan. In Europe his group prosecuted war crimes alleged by the NATO alliance in its war
on Serbia from March to June of 1999. A recent
report
[2]to
which Berger contributed, entitled
Universal Jurisdiction Annual Review 2019,
identifies
a case which Berger pursued of war crimes in Afghanistan; those alleged crimes were not of the US
and allied forces in Afghanistan, but of the local Afghans defending themselves.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/YKJcJuT_5jc
Prosecutor Thijs Berger
announces
the evidence-proof scheme of Article 168. The legal loophole is spelled out over six minutes – Min
3:31:00 to 3:37:00.
For his presentation to presiding judge Hendrik Steenhuis, Berger read from a multi-page script
authorized by his superiors in the Dutch Ministry of Justice and Security. They and he repeatedly
made the mistake of calling the charges in the prosecution's indictment – Articles 168, 287 and 298
– provisions of the Dutch Code of Criminal Procedure. This is the procedure code; its provisions
are called articles in the original Dutch, but sections in the
English
version.
The charges of the indictment are from the Dutch Criminal Code. They are called articles in
court; they are called articles in the
Dutch
statute
but sections in the official English translation.
For analysis of how the prosecution has manipulated both the Criminal Code and the Code of
Criminal Procedure in the MH17 trial preliminaries, read
this
.
"The scope of the indictment," Berger began his legal argument, is that together, the four
defendants -- Igor Girkin (Strelkov), Sergei Dubinsky, Oleg Pulatov, who are Russians, and
Leonid Kharchenko, a Ukrainian –
played "a steering, organizing, and supporting role in
deploying the BUK-Telar [missile and radar unit]" to shoot down MH 17
(Min 3:25:22).
They were members of an "armed group" engaged in "armed struggle, the purpose being to shoot
down an aircraft" (Min 3:27:20-21).
Note the indefinite article –
an
aircraft. The prosecution is charging the four with
capital crimes for defending themselves from attack by the Ukrainian Air Force. This, however, is
not mentioned by the prosecution.
"They are not being prosecuted," Berger went on, "as the persons who actually carried
out the firing process"
(Min 3:38:22). "We do not need evidence as to the exact cause of
events in order to be able to judge the accused" (Min 3:28:27). Homicide or murder, Berger
conceded, is in Dutch law "death caused intentionally" (Min 3:29:15). But the crimes which must be
judged by Steenhuis and his panel of The Hague District Court, he claims aren't homicide in the
usual legal sense. "The exact course of events need not be established" (Min 3:30:43), Berger told
Steenhuis. So the prosecution does not need to prove what happened. "That the missile which hit the
MH17 could possibly have been meant and intended for a military aircraft doesn't change these
facts" (Min 3:31:17).
"
None of the charges in the indictment requires intention concerning the civilian
nature of the aircraft or the occupants.
The crimes in the indictment forbid the
downing of any aircraft; this is Article 168 of the Code of Criminal Procedure [sic]; and also
forbid causing the deaths of others under Articles 287 and 289 irrespective of whether the
aircraft has a military or civilian status, and an error in the target doesn't really make a
difference for the evidence that these crimes have been committed. So no evidence is required
that the accused should have had the intention to shoot down a civilian aircraft" (Min 3:32:00).
"It was their intention to down a military aircraft of the Ukrainian Air Force" (Min
3:32:28), Berger claims his evidence of the SBU telephone tapes and witnesses proves.
"Those who intend to shoot down a military aircraft and subsequently, accidentally, hit a
civilian aircraft are guilty of causing an aircraft to crash according to Article 168 of the
Code of Criminal Procedure [sic]; but also guilty of murder of the occupants according to
Article 289 of the Code of Criminal Procedure [sic]" (Min 3:33:04).
In a regular court of law in England, Australia, Canada or the US, a prosecutor's legal argument
is always presented with explicit references to the case law. That's the accumulation of judgements
by courts going back as far as the history of the crime and of the statute can be traced. These are
the precedents which, in international law and in Dutch law too, must be followed by judges hearing
cases to which these precedents apply. This reflects the accepted notion that law is cumulative,
and that judges administer and interpret that law; they don't issue personal opinions or
preferences.
Berger didn't identify any Dutch case law or provide the court with precedents in
previous cases decided by the Dutch courts.
The reason is that there are none , explains a veteran Dutch judge who was asked this week to
identify the case law on Article 168. The judge replied: "It's sufficient to establish that the
defendant had the intention to take down some aircraft and that he should have seriously taken into
consideration the chance that he would hit an aircraft such as the MH-17. That's called conditional
intent --
voorwaardelijk opzet
in Dutch Answering this question [of precedents] took a bit
more time. I couldn't find any case law that would be relevant to the issue. Article 168 is not
used very often."
Conditional intent doesn't exist in Anglo-American law. But in Dutch law, the concept has not
(repeat never) been applied to cases of warfare, or in situations of military engagement where men
are attacking and defending themselves. For a Dutch review of the court precedents for application
of
voorwaardelijk opzet
to deaths caused by a drunk driver and a poisoning, read
this
[8]– Sect. 3.3.1. Fatal traffic offences committed by drunken drivers are the typical
homicides in which Dutch prosecutors apply the doctrine of conditional intent; the case law and
precedents are reviewed
here
[9].
No Dutch lawyer, judge or court has ever applied this to warfare.
Berger knows this; so does Steenhuis. They also know there is voluminous case law in the
international courts dealing with similar facts to those of the MH17 case and of the combat in
which the four defendants were engaged; for a sample Dutch law review, read
this
.
Again, Berger ignored what no prosecutor outside The Netherlands would attempt in front of a
judge. "We are aware," Berger told Steenhuis, "of academic comments that imply that Article 168
would require intention in killing civilians [Min 3:33:04]. But this is incorrect. Article 168 does
not require any intention for the death of the occupants" (Min 3:33:34).
The NATO propaganda unit Bellingcat repeated this claim in a
publication
two days after Berger's presentation.
The Article 168 argument, repeated from Berger's
script, will prove to be a "boomerang" for the Russian government, NATO officials are now claiming.
"It is only a question of time, therefore, that the Dutch prosecution brings murder charges against
Russian top military commanders. Unlike the case with the 4 defendants, they would easily have
obtained combatant immunity, if only they – and their supreme commander – had admitted to being
part of the war. But they – and he – continuously denied, and this alone makes immunity impossible.
Also unlike the 4 defendants, the political price that Russia will pay such indictments will be
much higher. It is one thing for 3 Russian 'volunteers', forgotten by most, to spend the rest of
their life holed up at home and afraid to take any trip abroad. It's an altogether different story
when top Mod [Ministry of Defence] and FSB officials – and maybe even a minister – are charged
with murder of 298 civilians and end up on the Interpol red-notice list."
International lawyers already before the European Court of Human Rights are arguing that the
"boomerang" strikes the government in Kiev first, because it was ordering combat in eastern
Ukraine, including orders for bombing and strafing by the Ukrainian Air Force, and at the same time
refusing to close the airspace to civilian aircraft. The case of Denise Kenke, on behalf of her
father, MH17 victim Willem Grootscholten,
explains
.
Canadian war crimes attorney Christopher Black (right) says the Dutch prosecution is
deliberately ignoring Dutch law, as well as international law.
"What Berger is stating is a case of criminal negligence, not murder. The general principles
of criminal law apply to this case as much as to any case. As for the burden of proof, the court
has to be convinced on the basis of the lawful evidence presented that the accused has committed
the crime he is accused of."
Black is pointing out that the prosecution's evidence from the Ukrainian SBU is unlawful. For
analysis of evidence tampering by the SBU,
read
more
.
"'Any person who intentionally and unlawfully' -- that's the key phrase in the wording of
Article 168. Its use there means specific intent.
Specific intent
. A general intent to
use missiles on something is not good enough in this case. It is telling that [Berger] does not
make the distinction between specific intent versus general intent. That indicates the
prosecutors don't think they can prove the necessary specific intent. And if the plane had been
shot down by the accused thinking it was engaged in an attack on them or masking [a Ukrainian
Air Force] attack on them, then the court cannot convict. That's because the facts would show an
accident or a justifiable act of self-defence."
In Dutch courts, there are several of what are called "full defences" to indictments for murder.
One is insanity;
another
[14] is
duress. Self-defence is the third full defence; it is spelled out in Article 41 of the Criminal
Code:
European lawyers observing the MH17 trial have noted that Berger failed to mention that. They
interpret this as an indication the prosecution already believes Judge Steenhuis has decided on
conviction.
"The term 'unlawfully' is used in Article 168", Black continues, "because there may be
situations where at sea, for example, a vessel has to be grounded or sunk because it is a danger
to other shipping or to the crew -- or to save the crew. It's harder to think of a plane that
must be crashed for a comparable reason. But one can anticipate the scenario – for example, when
men on the ground believe on reasonable grounds that an aircraft was about to bomb them – when
attacking the plane would not be considered unlawful because it is self-defence."
"
So the Dutch prosecutors are trying to prove there was an intent [to fire at an
aircraft] and therefore they did it, even if there is no evidence they did.
I didn't
realise courts dealt in smoking guns. They ought to be dealing in hard evidence. The fact that
someone fantasizes about a woman and she ends up getting pregnant and then she has a miscarriage
can't be turned into the accusation against the man of intent to make her pregnant, and then of
causing her miscarriage, and so guilty of bodily harm."
"... Russia heavily subsidised Ukrainian energy imports for decades – gas and oil. In a similar fashion, Russia is doing this with Belarus until the present time. Russia is the only possible consumer of what Ukraine used to manufacture – a market that has disappeared. Gas turbines used to be made in Ukraine. Now, this has moved to Russia. Of course, the skilled Ukrainians went to Russia with their know-how. ..."
"... To the best of my knowledge the USSR was the only empire that actually subsidized its colonies – Poland, East Germany, Ukraine etc. Russia is far better off without them. ..."
"... Ukrainian supermarkets are overflowing with French/German/Italian products. European supermarkets are devoid of Ukrainian products. ..."
Only a complete and utter incompetent (or a rabid Ukrainian nationalist) can call Ukraine
an independent state. It is de-facto a colony of the West. A debt slave.
I applaud the US response of supporting Ukraine's aspirations for a freer, more
Western-oriented country and that it continues to support Ukraine's territorial interests
over those of Russia's.
This was not about supporting Ukrainian aspirations for a freer, more Western-oriented
country. It is about kicking out Russia from Ukrainian markets and plundering Ukraine all by
themselves. Mainly by Germany and the USA -- to major players of Euromaydan color revolution.
For Germans this is return to "Drang nach Osten" on a new level, on the level of neoliberal
neocolonialism.
They used Western nationalists as their fifth column, but Western Ukrainian suffered from
the results no less then people in Eastern Ukraine. Many now try to move to Kiev, Kiev region
and further East in order to escape poverty and unemployment. Seasonal labor to Russia
(mainly builders) diminished rapidly. Train communication now is blocked, and for Western
Ukraine only Poland now represents a chance to earn money for the family to survive the
winter.
For the USA this is first of all about selling Ukraine expensive weaponry, wasting
precious Ukrainian resources on permanent hostility with Russia (with Donbas conflict as a
real win to further the USA geopolitical ambitions -- in line with the "Full spectrum
dominance" doctrine) , cornering Ukrainian energy market (uranium supplies for power
stations, etc.), destruction, or buy-out of a few competing industries other than extracting
industries and maquiladoras, getting better conditions for the EU exports and multinationals
operating in Ukraine (and initially with plans for re-export products to Russia tax free) and
increasing the country debt to "debt slave" level.
In other words this is a powerful kick in a chin by Obama to Putin. Not a knockdown, but
very close.
For Ukraine first of all that means rapid accumulation of a huge external debt --
conditions of economic slavery, out of which there is no escape. Ukrainian people paid a very
dear price for their Euromaydan illusions. They became mass slave labor in Poland.
Prostitutes in Germany. Seasonal picker of fruits in some other EU countries (GB, France). A
new European blacks, so to speak.
The level of fleecing Ukraine by the USA after Euromaidan can be compared only with
fleecing of Libya. The currency dropped 300%, and 80% Ukrainians now live in abysmal poverty,
while neoliberal oligarchs allied with the West continue to plunder the country. Gold
reserves were moved to the USA.
If I had to choose between two colonizers, I probably would prefer Russians. They are
still colonizers, but they are less ruthless and brutal colonizers.
@likbezIf I had
to choose between two colonizers, I probably would prefer Russians. They are still
colonizers, but they are less ruthless and brutal colonizers.
I agree with 90% of what you wrote, but I would like to correct the above.
Russia heavily subsidised Ukrainian energy imports for decades – gas and oil. In
a similar fashion, Russia is doing this with Belarus until the present time. Russia is the
only possible consumer of what Ukraine used to manufacture – a market that has
disappeared. Gas turbines used to be made in Ukraine. Now, this has moved to Russia. Of
course, the skilled Ukrainians went to Russia with their know-how.
To the best of my knowledge the USSR was the only empire that actually subsidized its
colonies – Poland, East Germany, Ukraine etc. Russia is far better off without
them.
Ukrainian supermarkets are overflowing with French/German/Italian products. European
supermarkets are devoid of Ukrainian products.
@Mr. Hack Only a
complete and utter incompetent (or a rabid Ukrainian nationalist) can call Ukraine an
independent state. It is de-facto a colony of the West. A debt slave.
I applaud the US response of supporting Ukraine's aspirations for a freer, more
Western-oriented country and that it continues to support Ukraine's territorial interests
over those of Russia's.
This was not about supporting Ukrainian aspirations for a freer, more Western-oriented
country. It is about kicking out Russia from Ukrainian markets and plundering Ukraine all by
themselves. Mainly by Germany and the USA -- to major players of Euromaydan color revolution.
For Germans this is return to "Drang nach Osten" on a new level, on the level of neoliberal
neocolonialism.
They used Western nationalists as their fifth column, but Western Ukrainian suffered from
the results no less then people in Eastern Ukraine. Many now try to move to Kiev, Kiev region
and further East in order to escape poverty and unemployment. Seasonal labor to Russia
(mainly builders) diminished rapidly. Train communication now is blocked, and for Western
Ukraine only Poland now represents a chance to earn money for the family to survive the
winter.
For the USA this is first of all about selling Ukraine expensive weaponry, wasting
precious Ukrainian resources on permanent hostility with Russia (with Donbas conflict as a
real win to further the USA geopolitical ambitions -- in line with the "Full spectrum
dominance" doctrine) , cornering Ukrainian energy market (uranium supplies for power
stations, etc.), destruction, or buy-out of a few competing industries other than extracting
industries and maquiladoras, getting better conditions for the EU exports and multinationals
operating in Ukraine (and initially with plans for re-export products to Russia tax free) and
increasing the country debt to "debt slave" level.
In other words this is a powerful kick in a chin by Obama to Putin. Not a knockdown, but
very close.
For Ukraine first of all that means rapid accumulation of a huge external debt --
conditions of economic slavery, out of which there is no escape. Ukrainian people paid a very
dear price for their Euromaydan illusions. They became mass slave labor in Poland.
Prostitutes in Germany. Seasonal picker of fruits in some other EU countries (GB, France). A
new European blacks, so to speak.
The level of fleecing Ukraine by the USA after Euromaidan can be compared only with
fleecing of Libya. The currency dropped 300%, and 80% Ukrainians now live in abysmal poverty,
while neoliberal oligarchs allied with the West continue to plunder the country. Gold
reserves were moved to the USA.
If I had to choose between two colonizers, I probably would prefer Russians. They are
still colonizers, but they are less ruthless and brutal colonizers.
On MH17, the Dutch court is now in a bit of a bind. The State Prosecutor has to submit
evidence beyond reasonable doubt and he has had to admit this week in court that he does not
have that as primarily there are no US satellite photos, not even behind multiple levels of
security, that they or the Dutch military have been able to get hold of. He has no real
evidence just, as you say Patrick, the fair and honest not obtained under duress evidence
from Kiev and the definitely undoctored photo analysis of Bellingcat. Logically the case
should now collapse.
Given that that satellite image, as boasted about by Kerry at the time, would have had the
Russians bang to rights in a proper court in a major PR coup for the US, I suspect that its
non production means that it doesn't exist.
"... Enter the Buk system, with the 9K37 SA-11 missile. It's got the range, it's got the altitude, the Russians have it in active service. Oooo problem. It's got the range, but only if it was fired from inside Ukraine. ..."
"... Anyway, back to the Buk system. And not a moment before time, either – I just re-read that sanctimonious stab above, again; " having armed the militants without due thought as to the consequences " What, exactly, is the ridiculous nature of the accusation being presented here? That the Russians gave an anti-aircraft system to the 'militants' without considering they might use it to shoot down an aircraft? How did they not see that coming? The Ukrainian Army shot down a civilian airliner in October of 2001 , and lied about it for as long as it could – interestingly, it took place during joint Ukrainian-Russian air defense exercises on the Crimean peninsula, and Russia tried hard to avoid assigning blame to Ukraine, while at least one Israeli television station claimed the Russians had shot down their own aircraft. This disaster and subsequent lying did not prevent the USA from giving the Javelin missile to Ukraine – did it not occur to them that they might use it to shoot tanks? No due thought to the consequences, obviously. ..."
"... The Buk air-defense system normally consists of at least 4 TELAR launchers , each with 4 missiles on the launch rails, a self-propelled acquisition radar designated by NATO nomenclature as Snow Drift (the radar on the nose of the TELAR unit itself is designated Fire Dome), and a self-propelled command post, for a minimum of 6 vehicles. Also usually part of the system is a mobile crane, to reload the launchers. If you were going to supply an air-defense system to militant rebels, why wouldn't you give them the whole system? In a pinch, you might be able to get away without the command post vehicle, although it is the station that collates all the input from the sensors and makes the decision to assign targets for acquisition, tracking and engagement. If you didn't give them the crane vehicle, and perhaps a logistics truck with some reloads, they would be limited to the missiles that came already mounted – once those were fired, they'd have to abandon the system, because they couldn't reload it. Seems a little wasteful, don't you think? ..."
"... I'm going a little further with my inexpert opinion, to say that the Buk system was selected as the 'murder weapon', because it provides a limited autonomous capability. To be clear, the Fire Dome radar on the nose of the TELAR does have a limited search capability, and once the radar is locked on to a target, the TELAR vehicle is completely autonomous. The purpose of the surveillance radar is to detect the target from far beyond the Fire Dome's range, assign it to a TELAR and thereby direct it to the elevation and bearing of the target so that the TELAR's radar knows exactly where to look, and continue to update its position until the TELAR to which it was assigned has locked on to the target. ..."
"... The Fire Dome radar mounted on the TELAR can search a 120-degree sector in 4 seconds, at an elevation of 6 to 7 degrees. Its search function is maximized for defense against ground attack aircraft, and a single launcher is not looking at 240 degrees of potential air threat axis during each sweep. It is not looking high enough to see an airliner at 30,000 ft+. More importantly for a system which was not designed to shoot down helpless airliners, it leaves two-thirds of a circle unobserved all the time it is searching for a target. And the Russians provided this to the 'militants' for air defense? They should be shot. ..."
"... There is no telling what kind of ordnance might be found in the wreckage itself, as the Ukrainian Army continued to shell the site for days after the crash; doubtless various artillery shells could be found at the crash site, as well, but it would be quite a leap of faith to suggest a Boeing 777 was shot down by artillery. What you would not find is pieces of the SAM that shot it down. ..."
"... Nor is that by any means all. The Dutch investigation which concluded with the preliminary report implied that nothing of any investigative value was found on the Cockpit Voice Recorder (CVR) or the Flight Data Recorder (FDR). Nothing to indicate what might have happened to the aircraft – just that it was flying along, and suddenly it wasn't. How likely is that? No transcript was provided, and I guess that would be expected if there was no information at all. Funny how often that happens with Malaysian airliners; they really need to look at their quality control. Oh; except they don't build the aircraft. Boeing does. I could see there not being any information after the plane began to break up, because both the CVR and the FDR are in the tail , and that broke off before the fuselage hit. But the microphones are in the ceiling of the cockpit and in the microphone and earpiece of the pilots' headsets, which they wear at all times while in flight. The last audio claimed to have been recorded was a course alteration sent by Ukrainian ATC. ..."
"... According to the Malaysian government, there was an early plan by NATO for a military operation involving some 9000 troops to 'secure the crash site', which was forestalled by a covert Malaysian operation which recovered the 'black boxes' and blocked the plan. I have to say that given the many, many other unorthodox and bizarre happenings in the conduct of what was supposed to be a transparent and impartial international investigation, it's getting so nothing much is unbelievable. The Malaysian Prime Minister went on record as believing that the western powers had already concluded that Russia was responsible, and were mostly just going through the motions of investigating. ..."
"... The telephone recordings presented by the SBU as demonstrating Russian culpability were analyzed by OG IT Forensic Services, a Malaysian firm specializing in forensic analysis of audio, video and digital materials for court proceedings, which concluded the recordings were cut, edited and fabricated . Yet they are relied upon as important evidence of guilt by the Dutch and the JIT. ..."
>Uncle Volodya says, "We become slaves the moment we hand the keys to the definition of reality entirely over to someone else,
whether it is a business, an economic theory, a political party, the White House, Newsworld or CNN."
"The receptivity of the masses is very limited, their intelligence is small, but their power of forgetting is enormous.
In consequence of these facts, all effective propaganda must be limited to a very few points and must harp on these in slogans
until the last member of the public understands what you want him to understand by your slogan."
– Adolf Hitler
We're going to do something just a bit different today; the event I want to talk about is current – in the future, actually –
but the reference which is the subject of the discussion is almost a year old. and the event it discusses is coming up to its sixth
anniversary. The past event was the downing of Malaysia Airlines flight MH-17 over Ukraine, the future event is the trial in
absentia of persons accused by the west of having perpetrated that disaster, and the reference is this piece, by Mark Galeotti,
for the Moscow Times:
"Russia's Roadmap
Out of the MH17 Crisis" .
You all know Mr. Galeotti, I'm sure. Here's his bio, for Amazon:
"Professor Mark Galeotti is a senior researcher at UMV, the Institute of International Relations Prague, and coordinator of
its Centre for European Security. Formerly, he was Professor of Global Affairs at New York University and head of History at Keele
University. Educated at Cambridge University and the LSE, he is a specialist in modern Russian politics and security and transnational
organized crime. And he writes other things for fun, too "
Yes, yes, he certainly does, as you will see. But this bio is extremely modest, albeit he most likely wrote it himself. Mr. Galeotti
also authored an excellent blog, In Moscow's Shadows , which was once a go-to reference for crime and legal issues in Russia,
a subject in which he seems very well-informed. The blog is still active, although he seems mostly to use it now to advertise podcasts
and sell books. That's understandable – it's evident from the blur of titles appended to his name that he's a very busy man. Always
has been, really; either as a student or an educator. He also speaks with confidence on the details of military affairs and equipment
despite never having been in the military or studied engineering; his education has pretty much all been in history, law or political
science.
I know what you will say – many of the greatest reference works on pivotal battles, overall military campaigns and affairs were
written by those who had no personal military experience themselves. Mr. Galeotti studied under Dominic Lieven, whose
"Russia Against Napoleon"
was perhaps the greatest work of military history, rich with detail and insight, that I have ever read. It won him the Wolfson
prize for History for 2010, a well-deserved honour. Yet so far as I could make out, Mr. Lieven never served a day in uniform, and
if you handed him an AK-47 and said "Here; field-strip this", your likely response would be a blank look. He most certainly was not
a witness to the subject military campaign. No; his epic work on Napoleon's invasion of Russia was informed by research, reading
the accounts of others who were there at the time, poring over reams of old documents and matching references to get the best picture
we have been afforded to date of Napoleon's ignominious defeat through a combination of imperial overreach, a poor grasp of logistics
and, most of all, resistance by an adversary who refused to be drawn into playing to Napoleon's strength – the decisive, crushing
battle in which the enemy could not retreat, and in which Napoleon would commit all the reserves and crush his enemy to dust.
So it is perfectly possible for an inquisitive mind with no military experience to put together an excellent reference on military
happenings which already took place, even if the owner of that mind was not present for the actual event. Given human nature and
the capabilities afforded by modern military equipment, it is even possible to forecast future military events with a fair degree
of accuracy, going merely by political ambitions and enabling factors, without any personal military experience. After all, the decision-makers
who give the orders that send their military forces into battle are often not military men themselves.
Returning for a moment to Mr. Galeotti, it is quite believable that an author with no military background could compose such works
as "Armies of the Russian-Ukrainian War" , although there is no serious evidence that Russia is a part of such a conflict
in any real military strength. You could write such a book entirely from media references and documentation, which in this case would
come almost entirely from the side which claims it is under constant attack by the other – Ukraine. Likewise "Kulikovo 1380;
the Battle that Made Russia" . None of us were around in 1380, so we all have to go by historical references, and whoever collects
them all into a book first is likely to be regarded as an expert.
No, it's more when we get into how stuff works that I have an issue with it. Like " Spetsnaz: Russia's Special Forces
". Or " The Modern Russian Army ". I'm kind of skeptical about how someone could claim to know the actual internal workings
of either organization simply from reading about them in popular references, considering that more than half the material on Russia
written in English in western references is rubbish heavily influenced by politics and policy. We would not have to look very far
to find examples in which ridiculous overconfidence by one side that it had the other side's number resulted in a horrible surprise.
In fact, we would not have to look very far to find an example of this particular author confidently averring to know something inside-out,
only to find that version
of reality could not be sustained . And I would no more turn to a Senior Non-Resident Fellow at the Institute of International
Relations Prague for expert analysis of the "Combat Vehicles of Russia's Special Forces" than I would ask a house painter
to cut my hair. Unless I see some recollections of a college-age Galeotti tinkering with drivetrains and differentials until the
sun went down from a pure love of mechanics, I am going to go ahead and assume that he knows what the vast majority of us knows about
military vehicles – he could pick one out of a lineup which included a melon, a goat and an Armored Personnel Carrier, and if it
had a flat tire he could probably fix it given time and the essential equipment.
Just before we move on, the future event: the MH-17 'trial' has been
postponed
until June 8th , to give defense attorneys more time to prepare after the amazingly fortuitous capture of a 'key witness' in
Eastern Ukraine. I'm not going to elaborate here on what a kicking-the-can-down-the-road crock this is; we'll pick that up later.
The whole MH-17 'investigation' has been such a ridiculous exercise in funneling the pursuit to a single inescapable conclusion –
that Russia shot it down – irrespective of how many points have to be bent to fit the curve that no matter how it comes out, it will
stand as perhaps the greatest example of absurd western self-justification ever recorded.
There are a couple of ways of solving a mystery crime. One is to collect evidence, and follow where it takes you. Another is to
decide who you want to have been responsible, and then construct a sequence of events in which they might have done it. To do that,
especially in this case, we will have to throw out a few assumptions, such as all that stuff about means, motive and opportunity.
In the absence of a believable scenario, that is. Let's look at what we have, and what we need, and see how we get from there to
here.
First, we need for Ukraine not to have been responsible. That's going to be awkward, because it looks as if the aircraft was shot
down by a missile, but the missile had to have come from inside Ukraine, because the aircraft was too far from the nearest point
in Russia at the moment it was stricken for the missile to have come from there. But we need Russia to have been responsible, and
not Ukraine. Therefore we need a sequence of events in which a Russian missile launcher capable of shooting down an airliner at cruising
altitude was inside Ukraine, in a position from which it could have taken the shot.
You know what? We are going to have to look at means, motive and opportunity, just for a second. My purpose in doing
so is to illustrate just how improbable the western narrative is, starting from square one. The coup in Ukraine – and anyone who
believes it was a 'grass-roots revolution' might as well stop reading right here, because we are going to just get further apart
in our impressions of events – followed by the triumphant promise from the revolutionaries to repeal Yanukovych's language laws and
make Ukrainian the law of the land touched off the return of Crimea to its ancestral home in the Russian Federation. Crimea was about
65% ethnic Russian by population at the time, and only about 15% Ukrainian, and Crimea had made several attempts to break free of
Ukraine before that yet for some reason the west refused steadfastly to accept the results of a referendum which voted in favour
of Crimea becoming a part of the Russian Federation, as if it were more believable that a huge ethnic-Russian majority preferred
to learn Ukrainian and be governed by Kiev.
Be that as it may, Washington reacted very angrily; much more so than Europe, considering the distance between the United States
and Ukraine versus its proximity to Europe. Perhaps that is owed simply to Washington's assumption that every corner of the world
looks to it for leadership, and that it must have a position ready on any given situation, regardless how distant. So Washington
insisted there must be sanctions against Russia, for stealing Crimea from its rightful owner, Ukraine. We're not really going to
get into struggles for freedom and the right to self-determination right now, except to state that the USA considers nothing more
important in some cases, while in others it is completely irrelevant. Washington demanded sanctions but
much of Europe was reluctant .
"It is notoriously difficult to secure EU agreement on sanctions anywhere because they require unanimity from the 28 member
states. There were wide differences over the numbers of Russians and Crimeans to be punished, with countries such as Greece, Cyprus,
Bulgaria and Spain reluctant to penalise Moscow for fear of closing down channels of dialogue. The 21 named were on an original list
that ran to about 120 people Expanding the numbers on the sanctions list is almost certain to be discussed at the EU summit on Thursday
and Friday. Some EU states are torn about taking punitive measures against Russia for fear of undoing years of patient attempts to
establish closer ties with Moscow as well as increase trade. The EU has already suspended talks with Russia on an economic pact and
a visa agreement The German foreign minister, Frank-Walter Steinmeier, said any measure must leave "ways and possibilities open to
prevent a further escalation that could lead to the division of Europe" .
The original list of those to be sanctioned was 120 people. The haggling reduced that to 21. Only 7 of those were Russians. Putin
was not included. That was pretty plainly not the United Front That Speaks With One Voice that Washington had envisioned, and the
notion that Europe would buy into sanctions that might really do some damage to Russia, albeit there would be economic costs to Europe
as well, was a dim prospect.
Gosh – you know what we need? An atrocity which can be quickly tied to Russia, and which will so appall the EU member states that
resistance to far-reaching sanctions will collapse. That's called 'motive'. It's just not a motive for Russia. Having just gone far
out on a limb and taken back Crimea, to the obvious and vocal fury of the United States, it is a bit of a stretch that Russia was
looking for what else it could do that would stir up the world against it.
Means, now. That presents its own dilemma. Because Russia could have shot down an airliner from its own territory. Just not with
the weapon chosen. The S-400 could have done it; it has the range, easily. But if you were setting up a scenario in which something
happened that you wanted to blame on Russia, but they didn't really do it, you must have the weapon to do it yourself, or access
to it. By any reasonable construct, Ukraine must be a suspect as well – there was a hot war going on in Ukraine, Ukraine controlled
both the airspace and the aircraft that was lost, and the aircraft was lost over Ukrainian territory. But Ukraine doesn't have the
S-400. You could use a variety of western systems, but it would quickly be established that the plane was shot down with a weapon
that Russia does not have. In order for the narrative to be believable, Russia must have the weapon – but if it wasn't Russia, then
whoever did it must have the weapon, too.
Enter the Buk system, with the 9K37 SA-11 missile. It's got the range, it's got the altitude, the Russians have it in active service.
Oooo problem. It's got the range, but only if it was fired from inside Ukraine.
Which brings us back to Mr. Galeotti, an expert in Russian combat systems; enough of an expert to write books on them, anyway.
And he plainly believes it was an SA-11 missile fired from a single Buk TELAR (Transporter/Erector/Launcher and Radar) which brought
down the Boeing; he says that's what the evidence demonstrates, although by this time (2019) most of the world has backed away from
saying Putin showed up with no shirt on to close the firing switch personally (cue the instant British-press screaming headlines
before the dust had even settled, "PUTIN'S MISSILE!!!" "PUTIN KILLED MY SON!!!"). Now the story is that the disgraceful deed was
done by 'Ukrainian anti-government militants', using a weapon supplied by Russia.
"In this context, a full reversal of policy seems near-enough impossible. The evidence suggests that while the fateful missile
was fired by Ukrainian anti-government militants, it was supplied by the Russian 53rd Air Defense Brigade under orders from Moscow
and in a process managed by Russian military intelligence.
To admit this would not only be to acknowledge a share in the unlawful killing of 298 innocents, but also an unpicking of
the whole Kremlin narrative over the Donbass. It would mean admitting to having been an active participant in this bloody compound
of civil war and foreign intervention, to having armed the militants without due thought as to the consequences, and to having lied
to the world and the Russian people for half a decade."
We don't really have the scope in this piece to broaden the discussion to Russia's probable actual involvement. Suffice it to
say that despite non-stop allegations by Poroshenko throughout his presidency of entire battalions of active-service Russian Army
soldiers inside Ukraine, zero evidence has ever been provided of any such presence, although there have been
some clumsy attempts to fabricate
it . To argue that the Russian Army has been trying to overrun Ukraine for six years now, but has been unable to do so because
of the combat prowess of the Ukrainian Army is to imply a belief in leprechauns. This is only my own inexpert opinion, but it seems
likely to me the complete extent of Russia's involvement, militarily, is the minimum which prevents Eastern Ukraine from being overrun
by the Ukrainian military, and including the rebel areas' own far-from-inconsequential military forces. I'm always ready to entertain
competing theories, though; be sure to bring your evidence. Meanwhile, the Ukrainian Constitution prohibits using the country's military
forces against its own citizens. The logic of 'Have cake, and eat it" cannot apply here – either the Ukrainian state is in direct
and obvious violation of its own constitution or the people of the breakaway regions are not Ukrainian citizens.
Anyway, back to the Buk system. And not a moment before time, either – I just re-read that
sanctimonious stab above, again; " having armed the militants without due thought as to the consequences " What, exactly,
is the ridiculous nature of the accusation being presented here? That the Russians gave an anti-aircraft system to the 'militants'
without considering they might use it to shoot down an aircraft? How did they not see that coming? The Ukrainian Army
shot down a civilian airliner in October of 2001
, and lied about it for as long as it could – interestingly, it took place during joint Ukrainian-Russian air defense exercises
on the Crimean peninsula, and Russia tried hard to avoid assigning blame to Ukraine, while at least one Israeli television station
claimed the Russians had shot down their own aircraft. This disaster and subsequent lying did not prevent the USA from giving the
Javelin missile to Ukraine – did it not occur to them that they might use it to shoot tanks? No due thought to the consequences,
obviously.
The Buk air-defense system normally consists of at least
4 TELAR launchers , each with 4 missiles on the launch rails, a self-propelled acquisition radar designated by NATO nomenclature
as Snow Drift (the radar on the nose of the TELAR unit itself is designated Fire Dome), and a self-propelled command post, for a
minimum of 6 vehicles. Also usually part of the system is a mobile crane, to reload the launchers. If you were going to supply an
air-defense system to militant rebels, why wouldn't you give them the whole system? In a pinch, you might be able to get away without
the command post vehicle, although it is the station that collates all the input from the sensors and makes the decision to assign
targets for acquisition, tracking and engagement. If you didn't give them the crane vehicle, and perhaps a logistics truck with some
reloads, they would be limited to the missiles that came already mounted – once those were fired, they'd have to abandon the system,
because they couldn't reload it. Seems a little wasteful, don't you think?
What about the acquisition radar? Because acquiring targets is all about scanning capability and situational awareness. We're
going to assume for a moment that you don't use an air defense system exclusively to hunt for airliners, but that you want to defend
yourself against ground-attack aircraft like the Sukhoi SU-25. Because, when you think about it, who is more likely to be trying
to kill you ? A Malaysian Airlines Boeing 777, or an SU-25? The latter is not quite as fast as an airliner at its cruising
height of 30,000 ft+, but it is very agile and will be nearly down in the treetops if it is attacking you. You need to be able to
search all around, all the time.
That's where the acquisition radar comes in. A centimetric waveband search radar, the
Snow Drift (called the 9S18M1 by
its designer) has 360-degree coverage and from 0 to 40 degrees of height in a 6-second sweep in anti-aircraft mode, with a 160 km
detection range, obviously dependent on target altitude. An airliner, being a large target not attempting to evade detection, and
at a high altitude, would quite possibly be detected at the maximum range of which the system is capable. But then the operators
would certainly know it was an airliner. And the narrative says whoever shot it down probably did so by accident.
Maybe if it was his first day on the job. Let's talk for a minute about air-defense deconfliction. It would be nice if your Command
parked you somewhere that there was nothing around you but enemies. Well, not as nice as parking you across the street from a pulled-pork
barbecue joint with strippers and cold beer, but from a defense standpoint, it'd be nice to know that anything you detected, you
could shoot. Know something? It's never like that. Your own aircraft are flying around as if they didn't even know you are dangerous,
and as everyone now knows, civilian airliners continue their transport enterprises irrespective of war except in rare instances in
which high-flying aircraft have been shot down by long-range missiles. That rarely happens. Why? Because an aircraft flying a steady
course, at 30,000 ft+ and not descending, is no threat to you on the ground. From that altitude it can't even see you in the ground
clutter, and it'd be quite a bombardier that could hit a target the size of a two-car garage with a bomb dropped from 30,000 ft while
flying at 400 knots.
And unless you are an idiot, you know it is an airliner. When you are deployed into the field in an air-defense role, you know
where the commercial airlanes are that are going to be active. You know what a commercial-aviation profile looks like – aircraft
at 30,000 ft+ altitude, flying at ≥400 knots on a steady course, squawking Mode 3 and Charlie = airliner. Might as well take a moment
here to talk about
IFF ; Identification
Friend or Foe. This is a coded pulse signal transmitted by all commercial aircraft whenever they are in flight unless their equipment
is non-functional, and you are not allowed to take off with it in that state. Mode C provides the aircraft's altitude, taken automatically
from its barometric altimeter. All modern air search radars have IFF capability, and a dashed line just below the raw video of the
air track can be interrogated with a light-pen to provide the readout. You already know how high the plane is if you have a solid
radar track, but Mode C provides a confirmation.
Military aircraft have IFF transponders, too; in fact, most of the modes are reserved for military use. But military aircraft
often turn off their IFF equipment, because it provides a giveaway who and where they are. In Ukraine, which uses mostly Soviet military
aircraft, both sides are capable of reading each other's IFF, so all the more reason not to transmit. Foreign nations typically cannot
read each other's IFF except for the modes which are for both military and civilian use, other than those nations who are allies.
Anyway, the point I wanted to make is that the Snow Drift acquisition radar has IFF, and if it detected an airliner-like target at
160 km., the operator would have that much more time to interrogate it and determine it was an airliner. Just to reiterate, the western
narrative holds that the destruction of the airliner was a mistake.
I'm going a little further with my inexpert opinion, to say that the Buk system was selected as the 'murder weapon', because it
provides a limited autonomous capability. To be clear, the Fire Dome radar on the nose of the TELAR does have a limited search capability,
and once the radar is locked on to a target, the TELAR vehicle is completely autonomous. The purpose of the surveillance radar is
to detect the target from far beyond the Fire Dome's range, assign it to a TELAR and thereby direct it to the elevation and bearing
of the target so that the TELAR's radar knows exactly where to look, and continue to update its position until the TELAR to which
it was assigned has locked on to the target.
That autonomous capability is probably what made it attractive to those building the scenario; consider. A complete Buk system
of 6, maybe 7 vehicles could hardly get all the way inside Ukraine to the firing position without being noticed and perhaps recorded.
But perhaps a single TELAR could do it. The aircraft could be shot down by an SA-11 missile and blamed on Russia – Ukraine has access
to plenty of SA-11's. But it is a weapon in the Russian active-service inventory. Further, Galeotti's commitment to the allegation
that the single TELAR was provided by Russia's 53rd Air Defense Brigade tells us he supports the crackpot narrative offered by Bellingcat,
the loopy citizen-journalist website headed by failed financial clerk Eliot Higgins. Bellingcat claims the Buk TELAR was trucked
into Ukraine on the back of a flatbed, took the shot that slew MH-17, and was immediately withdrawn back to Russia.
Ummm .how was that an accident? The Russians gave the Ukrainian militants a single launcher with no crane or reload missiles,
so it was limited to a maximum of four shots. Its ability to defend itself from ground attack was almost nil, since the design purpose
of mounting a Fire Dome radar
on each TELAR is not to make the launcher units autonomous; it is to permit concurrent engagements by several launchers, all
coordinated by the acquisition radar and command post. Without a radar of its own on the launcher, the firing unit would have to
wait until each engagement was completed before it could switch to a new target, but with a fire-control guidance radar on each TELAR,
multiple targets can be assigned to multiple launchers, while the search radar limits itself to acquisition and target assignment.
The Fire Dome radar mounted on the TELAR can search a 120-degree sector in 4 seconds, at an elevation of 6 to 7 degrees. Its search
function is maximized for defense against ground attack aircraft, and a single launcher is not looking at 240 degrees of potential
air threat axis during each sweep. It is not looking high enough to see an airliner at 30,000 ft+. More importantly for a system
which was not designed to shoot down helpless airliners, it leaves two-thirds of a circle unobserved all the time it is searching
for a target. And the Russians provided this to the 'militants' for air defense? They should be shot.
A single TELAR with no reloads and no acquisition radar would have to be looking directly at the target when it was activated
in order to even see it; it takes 15 seconds for the launcher to swing into line and elevation even when that information is transmitted
to it from the acquisition radar. It takes 4 seconds for a scan to be completed when there is a whole two-thirds of a circle that
it is not even looking at, and you have to manually force it to search above 7 degrees because it is not designed to shoot down airliners.
All this time, the target is crossing the acquisition scope at 400 knots+. Fire Dome has integrated IFF, so if it did by some miracle
pick up an airliner in its search, the operator would know from transmitted IFF that he was looking at an airliner. A single TELAR
with no reload capability sent on an air-defense mission would have its ass ripped in half by ground-attack aircraft that it never
saw – if the autonomous capability is so good, why don't the Ukrainians use them as a single unit? Think of how much air-defense
coverage they could provide! Do you see the Ukrainian air-defense units employing the Buk that way? Never. Not once. Four TELARS,
acquisition radar vehicle, command vehicle, just the way the system was designed to operate.
Just because it has a limited capability to function in a given capacity should not suggest you would employ it that way. You
can use a hockey stick to turn off the bedroom light, and you won't even have to get out of bed. Would you do that? I hope not.
A one-third effective capacity in the air defense role together with the covert delivery and immediate withdrawal suggests that
the Russians provided the 'militants' with a single TELAR for the express purpose of shooting down a defenseless airliner. Except
nobody is saying that. It was a mistake. Well, except for Head of the Security Service of Ukraine Valentyn Nalyvaichenko, who claimed
"Terrorists and militants have planned a cynical terrorist attack on a civilian aircraft Aeroflot AFL-2074 Moscow-Larnaka that was
flying at that time above the territory of Ukraine." He further claimed that this was motivated by a desire to 'justify an invasion'.
I'm pretty sure if any western authority could prove anything even close to that, we would not have had to wait 6 years for a trial.
Which brings us to the covert delivery and extraction. As part of his personal investigation, Max van der Werff drove the route
Bellingcat claimed was the extraction route by which the single TELAR, on its flatbed, was returned to Russia. He verified that there
is a highway overpass on the route which is too low for a load that tall to pass underneath. When he pointed this out to Higgins,
he was told there is a bypass spur which goes around it, which would allow the flatbed to regain the road beyond without having gone
through the overpass. Max drew his attention to the concrete barriers which blocked that road at the top of the hill, and which locals
claimed had been in place long before the destruction of MH-17. And that was the end of that conversation. I cannot say enough about
the quality of Max's work and his diligent, patient dissection
of the evidence . His diagrams of the entry and egress routes as provided by Bellingcat illustrate how little sense they make.
It was imperative the guilty Russians get the fuck out of Dodge with the greatest possible dispatch so they drove 100 kilometers
out of their way? Don't even terrorist murderers have GPS now?
Similarly, the simpleminded flailing of the Ukrainian investigators suggests they do not even have much of a grasp of how Surface-To-Air
missiles work. In excited posts like this one , the
BBC discloses that an exhaust vent from the tail section of a 'Buk missile' (the missile is actually the SA-11, while Buk is the
entire system) was found in the wreckage of the crashed plane, while
this one
even shows terminally-stunned head prosecutor Fred Westerbeke standing next to what is allegedly part of the rocket body of an
SA-11, including legible inventory markings, also 'found at the crash scene'.
Do tell.
Let me review for you how an SA-11 missile shoots down an aircraft. Does it pierce it like a harpoon, blow up in a thunderous
explosion, and ride the doomed aircraft down to the crash site? It certainly does not. The missile blasts out of the launcher and
flies to the target via semiactive homing, which means it has an onboard seeker that updates the missile trajectory, while the radar
on the launcher also communicates with it and the missile and the target are brought together in intercept. When the proximity fuse
of the missile – this is the important part – senses that the missile's warhead is close to the target, the internal explosive detonates,
and a shower of prefragmented shrapnel pierces the area of the plane near where the missile detonated, usually the front, because
the missile is constantly adjusting to make sure it stays with the target until intercept.
MH-17 traveled on, mostly intact, for miles before it crashed into the ground; the crash site was some 13 miles from where the
plane was hit. The missile self-destructed miles away from the crash site, and the only parts of it which accompanied the plane to
its impact point were the shrapnel bits of the exploded warhead. The body of the missile, together with the exhaust vent, fell back
to the ground somewhere quite close to where the plane was hit, not where it fell. Once the missile's fuel is exhausted, either because
it ran out or because it was consumed in the explosion triggered by the proximity fuse, the missile parts do not fly around in formation,
seeking out the wreckage and coming gently to rest in it where they can later be found by investigators. I don't know how many times
I have to say this, because this is certainly not the first, but there would not be any missile parts in the wreckage of MH-17
because the missile would have blown up in front of the plane without ever touching it. The missile does not hit the plane.
The pieces of the warhead do. But reality has to take a back seat to making out an airtight case.
There is no telling what kind of ordnance might be found in the wreckage itself, as the Ukrainian Army
continued to shell the site
for days after the crash; doubtless various artillery shells could be found at the crash site, as well, but it would be quite
a leap of faith to suggest a Boeing 777 was shot down by artillery. What you would not find is pieces of the SAM that shot it down.
Several witnesses claimed to have seen an SU-25 near the plane before it exploded. They quite possibly did – the Ukrainian Air
Force was observed to be using civilian airliners as cover to allow them to get close to Eastern-Ukrainian villages which might be
protected by hand-held launchers known as MANPADS (for Man-Portable Air Defense System), reasoning the defenders would not shoot
if they were afraid they might hit a civil aircraft. Once they were close enough to the village or other target to make an attack
run, they would then return to the vicinity of the airliner for protection while withdrawing; the rebel side complained about this
illegal and immoral practice a month before the destruction of MH-17. But there is no evidence I am aware of linking the destruction
of MH-17 to an attack by aircraft.
It may no longer be possible to look at the shooting-down of the Malaysian Boeing objectively; the event has become a partisan
rush to judgment which was rendered immediately, after which an investigation began which plainly had as its goal proving the accusations
already made. Means and motive clearly favour the accusers rather than the accused, and opportunity is mostly irrelevant as a consideration.
Ukraine obviously had to be a suspect – the destruction of the aircraft occurred over Ukraine while Ukraine was in control of it
and the airspace in which it traveled. Yet Ukraine was allowed to lead the investigation, and to gather and safeguard evidence, while
the owner of the aircraft – Malaysia – was excluded until the investigation had been in progress for four months. Russia was not
allowed any part in it save to yield whatever evidence the investigators demanded, while all its theories were widely mocked. Demonstrations
set up by Almaz-Antey, the designers and builders of the SA-11, were unattended by any investigating nation – small wonder they do
not have Clue One how the missile works, and believe they are going to find big chunks of it in the wreckage, perhaps with Putin's
passport stuck to one of them. If any of these conditions prevailed in an investigation which favoured Russia, NATO would scream
as if it were being run over with spiked wheels – if the Boeing had been shot down over Russia, who thinks Russia would have been
heading the investigation, and custodian of the evidence?
Nor is that by any means all. The Dutch investigation which concluded with the preliminary report
implied that nothing of any investigative value was found on the Cockpit Voice Recorder (CVR) or the Flight Data Recorder (FDR).
Nothing to indicate what might have happened to the aircraft – just that it was flying along, and suddenly it wasn't. How likely
is that? No transcript was provided, and I guess that would be expected if there was no information at all. Funny how often that
happens with Malaysian airliners; they really need to look at their quality control. Oh; except they don't build the aircraft. Boeing
does. I could see there not being any information after the plane began to break up, because
both the CVR and the FDR are in the
tail , and that broke off before the fuselage hit. But the microphones are in the ceiling of the cockpit and in the microphone
and earpiece of the pilots' headsets, which they wear at all times while in flight. The last audio claimed to have been recorded
was a course alteration sent by Ukrainian ATC.
According to the Malaysian government, there was an early plan by NATO for a military operation involving some 9000 troops to
'secure the crash site', which was
forestalled by a covert Malaysian operation which recovered the 'black boxes' and blocked the plan. I have to say that given
the many, many other unorthodox and bizarre happenings in the conduct of what was supposed to be a transparent and impartial international
investigation, it's getting so nothing much is unbelievable. The Malaysian Prime Minister went on record as believing that the western
powers had already concluded that Russia was responsible, and were mostly just going through the motions of investigating.
The telephone recordings presented by the SBU as demonstrating Russian culpability were analyzed by OG IT Forensic Services, a
Malaysian firm specializing in forensic analysis of audio, video and digital materials for court proceedings, which
concluded the recordings were cut, edited and fabricated . Yet they are relied upon as important evidence of guilt by the Dutch
and the JIT.
The conduct of the investigation has been all the way across town from transparent, and in fact seems to represent a clique of
cronies getting their heads together to attempt nailing down a consistent narrative, which is in the judgment of forensic professionals
based upon clumsy fabrications. The investigators plainly have no understanding of how the weapons systems involved perform, or they
would not claim confidently to have discovered pieces of the very missile that destroyed the plane in the wreckage of it. But rather
than take an objective look at how this flailing is perceived, they continue to rely on momentum and the appearance of getting things
done while being scrupulously impartial, all the while that more mountains of evidence are collected, which they cannot disclose
to the public, although it is all right to let the prime suspect keep it safe under wraps.
Make of that what you will.
" Bullshit is unavoidable whenever circumstances require someone to talk without knowing what he is talking about. Thus the
production of bullshit is stimulated whenever a person's obligations or opportunities to speak about some topic exceed his knowledge
of the facts that are relevant to that topic. "
"... This was Bellingcrap's bread-and-butter function, to use satellite photos and make them say whatever Bellingcrap had been tasked to say they were, relying on the fact that mainstream media organisations rarely employ people expert in interpreting satellite imagery, before people outside the MSM environment started voicing suspicions about how the "evidence" for the official MH17 narrative was being worked and whipped into shape to fit that narrative. ..."
" The point is that we often tend to believe satellite photography shows what its
presenters say it shows because we do not have the skill to interpret it ourselves "
This was Bellingcrap's bread-and-butter function, to use satellite photos and make them
say whatever Bellingcrap had been tasked to say they were, relying on the fact that
mainstream media organisations rarely employ people expert in interpreting satellite imagery,
before people outside the MSM environment started voicing suspicions about how the "evidence"
for the official MH17 narrative was being worked and whipped into shape to fit that
narrative.
It's my understanding that there is a company in Colorado, called Digital something or
other, that supplies a huge amount of satellite imagery to the US government and other big
clients.
Incidentally not long after China slapped anti-dumping tariffs on Australian barley (and
switched to buying barley from the US) and suspended beef imports from four Australian
abattoirs, Australia's foreign minister Maryse Payne phoned her Russian counterpart
apparently to request that Russia send more tourists to Australia and buy more Australian
products. Imagine Sergei Lavrov's initial reaction before he went straight into his
diplomatic persona. As John Helmer
bluntly puts it :
" Lavrov replied that Australia should stop fabricating evidence of Russian involvement
in the shoot-down of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17, and withdraw from the Dutch show trial
which is scheduled to resume hearings in Amsterdam next month "
" Russian Foreign Minister [Lavrov] informed [Payne] that Russia will disseminate in the
UN a comprehensive document with the facts revealing the serious problems in the operation
of the Netherlands-established Joint Investigative Team (JIT).
Mr Sergey Lavrov criticised the JIT and said their activities fail to conform to the
high standards set by UN Security Council Resolution 2166.
"Russian experts are ready to hold consultations with their Australian and Netherlands
colleagues to clear up answers to the numerous questions put during their cooperation with
the JIT", he maintained "
Looks like Australia is now between a rock and a hard place. Payne must be really thick to
think that she could play Russia off China.
Nobody seems to catch on that it's always Washington, manipulating and meddling and getting
its poodles to yap for it, and it is the poodles who bear the consequences, while nothing
much accrues to the manipulator. It will be the same with the Huawei affair, mentioned
elsewhere here; it is looking more like Washington will get its way and all its allies will
cave and reject all Huawei gear, whereupon they will all end up with a less-capable and
more-expensive 5G network which meets with American approval, and the allies will pay the
cost in trade reprisals by China.
Mmmm .right. His first name is Vladimir, but everyone calls him Andrei on the phone. The
middle name "Ivanovich" is so unusual in Russia as to have led the investigators straight to
him. Like if I was doing an investigation in America, and the people on the phone kept
referring to a 'William Donald", and my team and I decided to accuse Roscoe Donald Peterson
because he also has the middle name "Donald". Brilliant investigative work. Remind me to make
a donation.
Maybe The Atlantic Council's algorithm that runs through the Moscow telephone-book database
needs replacing. I'm sure it would be pretty worn out after identifying Ruslan Boshirov as
Anatoly Chepiga and Alexander Petrov as Alexander Mishkin and is now prone to making mistakes
such as confusing a name like "Vladimir" with "Andrei". Next thing you know, Bellingcrap will
be telling us that Andrei Kozyrev is the current Russian
President because his middle name is Vladimirovich too.
Further details on the case were shared by the Deputy Interior Minister Anton Gerashenko on
his Facebook page. The ring involved the head of the clinic, her son, as well as two other
Ukrainian and three Chinese nationals. They were charged with human trafficking that may
lead to 12 years in prison with property confiscation.
The majority of the clinic's clients were single Chinese males of "certain orientation," as
Gerashenko put it. While the exact number of trafficked babies remains unknown, at least
140 more Chinese nationals are under investigation, the official added.
Anton Gerashenko is the person that put early (in the first few hours) MH17 propaganda on
social media. The so called intercepted radio calls between rebels and also photograph
supposedly of BUK launch.
Looks like Gerashenko is doing his bit for the China decoupling.
MH17 was the tool to separate EU and the US west from Russia. Covid-19 is the tool to
separate the US west from China.
Majority of people in the west will believe the anti China - China dunnit crap that is
being pumped out by the US and all MSN.
Reuters running an article on Iran speed boats harassing US coast guard vessels When they
were innocently conducting helicopter integration exercises. I guess Iran moved its country
to close to the US.
Trump regime says it wants to have discussions with Iraq in June about moving out. I guess
that means Trump will be making his move on Persian gulf oil before June.
Whatever is coming this covid bullshit is just the beginning - a planned move setting the
stage for what is to come.
The judge in the MH17 trial has issued an order for the US satelite data showing images of
the Buk missile being launched to be made available. If the prosecution is unable (or
refuses) to produce these images then this would strongly indicate that:
1. There was no Buk and MH17 was shot down by a Ukrainian jet (which the very first, on
the ground, eyewitnesses indicated).
I tend to think US does have sat recording of the missile. It will show launch flare and
rocket burn. It was quite clear by what Kerry said that this is what their sats pick up.
Launch flare will show launch position to within a few meters.
Robert Parry did a piece on it a few weeks after the shootdown. His contact in the US
intel thought sat pics of the position were showing Ukraine military.
This is what Kerry said within a few days of the MH17 downing:
"We saw the take-off. We saw the trajectory. We saw the hit. We saw this aeroplane
disappear from the radar screens. So there is really no mystery about where it came from and
where these weapons have come from."
But still, nearly 6 years later, no evidence has been provided? Surely you can see how
inauthentic Kerry's statement is? Perhaps, Kerry could clear the matter up by being a witness
at the MH17 trial?
Robert Parry's CIA source feels like an authorised leak and psyop exercise that reinforces
the idea of a Buk and expresses concern about the possibility of Ukrainian military
involvement (the true purpose of which is to create distance and absolve the US) whilst at
the same time being meaningless and of no real value.
You "tend" to believe Kerry and a CIA leak and discount what ordinary Ukrainians witnessed
on the day of the shootdown? Why????
Apparently the Dutch are actually going ahead with a trial over the MH-17 plane shootdown,
seeking to convict in absentia three Russians and a Ukrainian. It is my understanding that a
Dutch military report effectively ruled out exactly the scenario proposed for this trial, and
did so several years ago.
Malaysia has provided the dissent to the MH-17 investigation to date, although a newly
elected government may seek to pull back from overt criticism in the future. A Malaysian
diplomat who has been involved has rather pointed things to say about the politicization of
the investigation and the questionable motivations of the Ukrainians, and claims the court
case is based on hearsay and a voice recording with no provenance. https://asiatimes.com/2020/03/is-malaysias-position-on-mh-17-tragedy-shifting/
"These records show that at their meeting on February 12, 2016, the JIT officials agreed
that the "requested information" identified in the December 4, 2015, meeting and including
the US satellite data, was "yet to be completed."
Instead, the only civilian satellite evidence which the JIT later said it has used, comes
from the European Space Agency. In the JIT report of September 28, 2016, the Dutch said "the
European Space Agency (ESA) has aided the investigation team extensively in the search for
relevant images from satellites. This has shown to be of great value: Not only did ESA obtain
images of all relevant civilian satellites, but they also have experts who have assessed
these images. The conclusions drawn by ESA confirm the conclusions of the investigation team
with regard to the launch site."
Note that the JIT refers here to civilian satellites.
The leak last month from the JIT files of two reports from MIVD, the Dutch military
intelligence agency, both dated September 21, 2016, has identified US and NATO military
satellite intelligence ("partner informatie") as the source for MIVD's conclusions that no
Russian BUK missile radar and launch units had crossed the border into Ukraine before or on
July 17, 2014; no BUK missile radar targeting or firing on MH17 had been detected; and no
identified Russian units on the Russian side of the border had launched missiles."
If the US and military satellite images contradict the ESA images, then one set of images
is a fabrication. We
can deduce that the ESA images are almost certainly fabrications because if no Russian buk
crossed the border then
all those photos and videos the jit lynch mob have been trumpeting are fake, essentially
reducing the jit's credibility to zero.
"... Yet the mass media, freakishly, has had absolutely nothing to say about this extremely newsworthy story. ..."
"... The mass media's stone-dead silence on the OPCW scandal is becoming its own scandal, of equal or perhaps even greater significance than the OPCW scandal itself. It opens up a whole litany of questions which have tremendous importance for every citizen of the western world; questions like, how are people supposed to participate in democracy if all the outlets they normally turn to to make informed voting decisions adamantly refuse to tell them about the existence of massive news stories like the OPCW scandal? How are people meant to address such conspiracies of silence when there is no mechanism in place to hold the entire mass media to account for its complicity in it? And by what mechanism are all these outlets unifying in that conspiracy of silence? ..."
"... This is the FOURTH leak showing how the OPCW fabricated a report on a supposed Syrian 'chemical' attack," tweeted journalist Ben Norton. "And mainstream Western corporate media outlets are still silent, showing how authoritarian these 'democracies' are and how tightly they control info." "Media silence on this story is its own scandal," "Media silence on this story is its own scandal," "Media silence on this story is its own scandal," tweeted journalist Aaron Maté. ..."
This is getting really, really, really weird. WikiLeaks has WikiLeaks has
published yet another set of leaked
internal documents from within the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) adding even more material to
the mountain of evidence that we've been lied to about an alleged chemical weapons attack in Douma, Syria last year which resulted
in airstrikes upon that nation from the US, UK and France.
Another strong nail in the
coffin cover of the official version of the "investigation" of the MH-17 crash in Ukraine in
2014.
However, liars will bring this six-year farce to the end. Soon the so-called "court" will
take place, and we will see another funny performance of the clowns (aka
"investigators").
Was anyone aware that in 1991 in the Ukraine almost 100% of the population had indoor running
water, but as of 2014 that was down to 87%? I'm talking of the western portion of the Ukraine
here and not the part being attacked by neo-Nazis where it is unsurprising that
infrastructure is being destroyed.
I was curious what happened to the Ukraine's infrastructure since the Soviet Union was
dissolved so I asked some Ukrops what was up. Apparently Putin himself has been sneaking into
the Ukraine at night and stealing the plumbing right out of people's houses. I kid thee not!
Putin did it! Ukrops wouldn't lie about that, would they?
If you think what Putin is doing to America is bad, then just be thankful you are not in
Ukropistan! Over there Putin causes people to stub their toes on the furniture when they get
out of bed to take a leak at night. He tricks people into not bringing their umbrellas on
days that it rains. He even causes babies to foul their diapers right after they were
changed. Putin's evil knows no bounds!
Poroshenko has asked the US for help with criminal cases in the Ukraine, writes
media
05:31
MOSCOW, 1 Jul – RIA Novosti.The former President of the Ukraine Petro
Poroshenko is in Istanbul, where he has turned to American companies to lobby for protection
from criminal cases, reports "
Ukraine News " with reference to sources.
It has been noted that in the Ukraine changes have been made as regards the criminal
cases against Poroshenko. In particular, in May 2019, the former-president's lawyer Igor
Golovan stated that these criminal cases would not entail any legal consequences, but now
Poroshenko's entourage realizes that the criminal prosecution of the former president has
noticeably intensified and may have consequences.
Therefore, according to the newspaper, in Turkey Poroshenko has started to lobbying
U.S. companies, in particular, the BGR group, for assistance in resolving these
cases.
"He is well aware that everything that happens in the RRG (State Bureau of
investigation – trans. ed.) is taken very seriously, and he intends to defend himself
against attacks. He can, for example, be expecting public support in Washington if there is
an attempt made to arrest him", said the source.
In addition, the publication cites the words of Ukrainian political scientist Alexei
Yakubin, who has noted that Poroshenko could repeat the "Saakashvili scenario".
"For example, he'll leave for treatment in London, where part of his entourage has
entrenched itself. But this model complicates the public protection of his business assets
within the country, which assets might be seized", he said.
The case against Poroshenko
Poroshenko has previously been involved in eleven criminal cases, in particular, as regards
his abuse of power and his official position in the distribution of posts in "Tsentrenergo",
his treason in connection with the incident in the Kerch Strait, his usurpation of judicial
power and his misappropriation of the TV channel "Direct", his falsification of documents in
the formation of Deputy factions in 2016, and his illegal appointment of a government, and
the seizure of power.
In addition, as a witness, he was questioned about civilian deaths during the
Euromaidan protests in 2014.
Poroshenko himself, speaking at the party congress of "European Business", said that he
is responsible only before the Ukrainian people and is not afraid of persecution.
Quite right, old man; keep your chin up. I daresay they're staying in quite prestigious digs
in Istanbul, as befits visiting royalty. He seems to be labouring under a misapprehension
that he is valuable somehow to Washington, whereas that would only be true if Washington were
unwilling to work with Zelenskiy, and wanted him out of the way. So far as I can see,
Washington is quite satisfied with Zelenskiy so far, while the people would not countenance a
Poroshenko return. So he's not really much use, is he? Especially if the USA wishes to
publicly support Zelenskiy's supposed battle with official corruption.
I could see them having a quiet word with Zelenskiy, maybe leave the old man out of it,
what do you say? But Washington is already accused – with substantial justification, I
would say – of running the show in Ukraine, and there are limits to how much obvious
interfering it can do; especially after Biden's bragging about getting the state prosecutor
fired.
Yes, I was sort of getting at the probability that Clan Poroshenko is just installed in a
very nice hotel. I doubt he will want to be plunking down money for an actual property so
long as the status of his assets still in Ukraine is still up in the air. I should imagine
the Ukrainian government will take steps, if it has not already, to prevent his simply
withdrawing their cash value.
The thing about the pindosi, though, is that they always hedge their bets .
I vangize that they will pressure Zel to pardon Porky. So that they have a spare.
I hope I am wrong, but I don't think I am.
I doubt it, simply because it would kick the timbers right out from under Zelenskiy's
anti-corruption platform, which is the issue on which he was voted in, and there would be no
way to do it under the radar. The Ukrainian people must be following Porky's flight with
great interest, and inferring that it means he has something to hide. Therefore an abrupt
discontinuing of the pursuit, and a refocusing elsewhere, would tell them accountability is
not attributed to the powerful and wealthy. Which is uhhh exactly the opposite of Zelenskiy's
message.
The present Dutch PM Rutte is more of a CIA poodle than Tony Blair was. MH17 a case in point.
The Dutch judicial set up is populated with similar drones: the assassin of prominent Dutch
politician Pim Fortuyn is walking free after less jail time than other criminals. Holland is
gone to the dogs.
Kevin Smith: "Higgins is currently frantically trying to prop up the Douma narrative against a mountain of evidence disproving
his conclusions. For those who’ve followed his story, it’s clear that Higgins is an intelligence asset, set up to take the fall
when the currently collapsing narratives take hold in the mainstream.
"You didn't think that one through, did you, @eliothiggins sweetie? You're not in the
ladies' lingerie trade now. This discussion is about truth, which endures, is not held together
by elastic, and is not for sale." ~Peter Hitchens responding to Eliot Higgins of Bellingcat over the OPCW scandal on
Twitter – 2 January 2020.
"... I believe more people nowadays recognise that the devastating wars in Iraq and Libya and events in Syria were pushed by our governments and media. They can even accept, when you explain, that we've been assisting terrorists to unseat governments for years. But they seem hesitant of taking the next step and we need to encourage them on this path. ..."
"... This path leads to recognising the sheer evil in our midst and getting out of this mindset that criminal behavior and lying in governments and in our media is normal or should in any way be tolerated. Perhaps some people appreciate this already but don't want to address it out of concern to what they might find. Maybe some people dread the thought of a global conflict so ignore it. But we need to hammer home the consequences of simply doing nothing. ..."
"... I've been trying to think of an analogy to try to get this point across. I sometimes say to people, we wouldn't have released a serial killer like Harold Shipman from prison and appointed him Foreign Secretary. Therefore, why do we tolerate a long line of Foreign Secretaries complicit in laying waste to the world? Sadly, with this analogy most people usually look back at me blankly so I have been searching for one more complete and rooted in history which people can relate better to events today. ..."
"You didn't think that one through, did you, @eliothiggins sweetie? You're not in the
ladies' lingerie trade now. This discussion is about truth, which endures, is not held
together by elastic, and is not for sale."
Peter Hitchens responding to Eliot Higgins of Bellingcat over the OPCW scandal on
Twitter – 2 January 2020.
Like many, I've been following the Douma scandal for some time and particularly since the
OPCW whistleblowers and leaked emails blew the lid off the official narrative that Assad used
chemical weapons there.
For the past few weeks he's been debating the topic with Eliot Higgins of Bellingcat, Scott Lucas and various Middle East based journalists
who created and then pushed the false narrative.
In fact, it's not really a debate. Peter Hitchens is quite literally slaughtering these
narrative managers – his logic and clear thinking – and wit exposing the numerous
gaps in their story and their desperate deflections.
Hitchens position is not exactly the same as many of us here hold – that Douma was a
clear false flag. What he is saying is the evidence points to there being no chemical attack by
the Syrian government, the pretext used for the attack on Syria. He doesn't wish to speculate
on matters which aren't conclusively proven, for example precisely on what did actually
happen.
I respect that position in many ways and his refusal to comment on the dead civilians in the
Douma images makes sense from a journalist in the mainstream. I think by having a position
which is clear and unassailable enables him to easily brush off his online detractors and not
allow them to deflect to other issues.
While I don't agree with everything he says, Hitchens has a calm and rational argument for
all the issues he covers. This puts clear ground between him and his online opponents who often
resort to childish abuse.
My 80-year old mum admires him too. She describes him as 'frightfully posh'. Perhaps someone
who might have belonged in a previous age – but I'm glad we have him in this one.
Anyway, I think we can be sure that Hitchens will continue his important work within the
remit he's chosen and others will investigate the unanswered questions which arise from the
Douma incident.
Ultimately the question about the dead civilians in the images is simply too dreadful to
ignore.
This is because if a chemical attack did not take place and Assad was not responsible it
seems highly likely that the civilians including children were murdered to facilitate a
fabrication.
And were our own intelligence agencies involved in a staged event, considering the refusal
to even establish the basic facts in the days following?
And then, of course, the resulting air strikes nearly caused us to go to war with Russia,
with all that would entail.
While these investigations continue, I think it's timely to see where these events fit into
the way the general public think and perceive wrongdoing and to try to radically to change
this.
I believe more people nowadays recognise that the devastating wars in Iraq and Libya and
events in Syria were pushed by our governments and media. They can even accept, when you
explain, that we've been assisting terrorists to unseat governments for years. But they seem
hesitant of taking the next step and we need to encourage them on this path.
This path leads to recognising the sheer evil in our midst and getting out of this mindset
that criminal behavior and lying in governments and in our media is normal or should in any way
be tolerated. Perhaps some people appreciate this already but don't want to address it out of
concern to what they might find. Maybe some people dread the thought of a global conflict so
ignore it. But we need to hammer home the consequences of simply doing nothing.
I've been trying to think of an analogy to try to get this point across. I sometimes say to
people, we wouldn't have released a serial killer like Harold Shipman from prison and appointed
him Foreign Secretary. Therefore, why do we tolerate a long line of Foreign Secretaries
complicit in laying waste to the world? Sadly, with this analogy most people usually look back
at me blankly so I have been searching for one more complete and rooted in history which people
can relate better to events today.
So, here follows an analogy of a character who lived in the 17th century. His traits, his
crimes, the political climate and peoples misguided perceptions in response can be compared to
recent events and one particular individual causing havoc in the world today.
Of course I refer to Eliot Higgins of Bellingcat.
Eliot ( 'suck my balls' ) Higgins and
Titus Oates1. Eliot Higgins and Bellingcat
Higgins probably doesn't need much of an introduction here. It seems he has no specific
qualifications relevant to his role and a bit of a drop-out in terms of education.
Before the Arab spring I knew no more about weapons than the average Xbox owner. I had no
knowledge beyond what I'd learned from Arnold Schwarzenegger and Rambo."
But this didn't prevent him blogging about world events and then setting himself up and his
site as investigator for several incidents most notably the shooting down of the MH17 passenger
plane over Ukraine and allegations of chemical weapons use in Syria. It's now known that
Bellingcat is funded by pro-war groups including the Atlantic Council
Higgins has been accused by chemical weapons experts, academics and independent journalists
on the ground of fabricating evidence to reach a predetermined outcome decided on by his
funders.
His rise to prominence was fast and apparently some media editors now refer their
journalists to Bellingcat fabrications rather than allowing them to do any journalism
themselves.
For those who've followed his story, it's clear that Higgins is an intelligence asset, set
up to take the fall when the currently collapsing narratives take hold in the
mainstream.
2. Titus Oates and the Popish Plot
Oates was a foul-mouthed
charlatan , serial liar and master of deception who lived in the 17th century. His earlier
life included being expelled from school and he was labelled a 'dunce' by people who knew him.
He became a clergyman and later joined the Navy. His career was plagued by various sex scandals
and charges of perjury.
In the 1670s during the time of Charles II, religious tensions threatened to spill over into
civil war but the pragmatic King, by and large, kept a lid on it.
However, along with Dr Israel Tonge an anti-Catholic rector, Oates started writing
conspiracy theories and inventing plots and later began writing a manuscript alleging of a plan
to assassinate King Charles II and replace him with his openly Catholic brother.
When the fabrication started to gather momentum, the King had an audience with Oates and was
unconvinced and was said to have found discrepancies in his story.
However, the tense political and religious climate at that time was ideal for conspiracy
theories and scaremongering. The King's ministers took Oates at his word and over a dozen
Catholics were executed for treason. This story created panic and paranoia lasting several
years taking the nation to the brink of civil war.
Over time Oates lies were exposed and when the Catholic King James II came to the throne, he
tried Oates with perjury and he was whipped and placed in the pillory.
After James II fled England during the so-called 'Glorious Revolution' King William and
Queen Mary pardoned Oates and gave him a pension.
For me, this whole episode has many obvious parallels with Higgins, the long-running Russia
and the anti-Semitism witch-hunts in the media and the false narratives over Iraq, Libya and
Syria. Like those in power today, Oates had a knack for getting away with it. And I guess we
can all relate this to Julian Assange – the victims or whistleblowers being punished and
the perpetrators getting off.
I had wondered why James II, often ruthless and unforgiving had not executed Oates. But
apparently the crime of perjury even then didn't carry the death sentence. The judge who
convicted Oates was said to have tried his best to finish him off through the whipping, though
he survived.
But perhaps even the King and judiciary in failing in this or not using other means at their
disposal, couldn't comprehend the enormity of his crimes. Oates was after all a rather absurd
character, open to ridicule.
Perhaps this is a bit similar to people today when discovering that Eliot Higgins is also a
foul-mouthed fraud – but they can't reconcile this comical ex-lingerie employee as a
menace to humanity.
3. Modern day
In the past few weeks I've read various older articles on Iraq and Syria. US troops
shooting people for fun from a helicopter . The perpetrators are still free – the
whistle-blowers who exposed that, and other events in prison or exile.
Last year we learned about a shocking massacre of Syrian children,
unreported in the mainstream media . Mainstream journalists through their one-sided
distortions of the conflict and silence, perpetuating the myth that the terrorists who carried
out this mass murder are freedom fighters.
And as I've mentioned, we've seen firmer evidence of what many of us knew along – that
Douma was a staged fabrication as a pretext for air-strikes and dangerously escalating the
Syrian war. The likes of Eliot Higgins and others in the media, colluding in the cover-up of
mass murder which likely facilitated this event. And for those honest journalists and experts
who bring the truth of these staged events to us,
smears will no doubt continue .
Higgins and others in the media who lie, misinform or remain silent are no better than those
shooting civilians from helicopters or starting these wars in the first place. In fact, they
have killed more and keep killing.
This modern-day Titus Oates, and others share a big responsibility for death and destruction
in the Middle East and a dangerous new Cold War.
As I say, I think people are waking up to the distorted narratives and misdirections which
have inflicted war on others. Now they need to take the next step and grasp the sheer enormity
of the crimes and the risks of global conflict if we don't act.
So, how do we achieve this and get in a position of holding the criminals and war
propagandists to account?
By confronting them directly and mercilessly. As Jeremy Corbyn should have done over the
anti-Semitism hoax. Perhaps we should adopt some of the tactics they use against the
truth-tellers and whistle-blowers. I don't mean by lies or smears. Maybe even ridiculing these
people and their nonsense might have the effect of trivialising the crimes they have
committed.
No, I think it is time for plainer, no-holds-barred language describing these people for the
true evil they are – until the truth and label sticks.
We need to recognise more the seriousness of the crimes. This commentary from the usually
measured Piers Robinson about the staged event in Douma reflects the true gravity of the
situation in
terms of the OPCW complicity .
4. The hijacking of OPCW
The cover-up of evidence that the Douma incident was staged is not merely misconduct. As
the staging of the Douma incident entailed mass murder of civilians, those in OPCW who have
suppressed the evidence of staging are, unwittingly or otherwise, colluding with mass
murder."
We need to now apply this strong language to all crimes committed, be it from the soldiers
on the ground, the governments starting these wars or supplying terrorists or the media which
promote mass murder through their lies, distortions and silence when presented with the true
facts.
We need to go on the offensive and call out the criminals and spell out in no uncertain
terms what we are dealing with. With the evidence and fact-based analogies or arguments we
publish we should be using more commentary such as 'mass murderer', 'traitor' or 'terrorist
propagandist'.
This is particularly important in light of events in recent days. The assassination of
General Qasem Soleimani has been normalised in both mainstream and on social media. The people
legitimising state-sponsored murder in offices thousands of miles away from Iran, woefully
ignorant of the potential of this causing a chain of events which could visit our door
soon.
Above all, we should specifically name and shame the individuals promoting war. This needs
to be relentless. The official war narratives which have crumbled so far are ample evidence of
wrongdoing on a vast scale. So, we can be confident in doing this with the truth firmly on our
side.
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wardropper ,
No, I think it is time for plainer, no-holds-barred language describing these people for the
true evil they are – until the truth and label sticks.
Yes indeed.
I was, however, reminded today of the huge mountain we yet have to climb before it can be
normal again NOT to be corrupt and wicked. The scenario was a session of acrimony in a US
Senate chamber, and according to the NYTimes, "Tensions grew so raw after midnight that Chief
Justice Roberts cut in just before 1 a.m. to admonish the managers and the president's
lawyers to "remember where they are" and return to "civil discourse." "
"Remembering where you are", when dealing with Titus Oates and other vulgar frauds is perhaps
not entirely appropriate ?
wardropper ,
Apologies, I forgot to set the first sentence in quotes
Thom ,
Hitchens may be on the level on this particular issue but it is part of a wider deception
where Hitchens poses as a friend to critical thinkers and then tells them they are helpless
and/or can do nothing about it. If he really had journalistic integrity he wouldn't be taking
a salary from the Mail on Sunday, a newspaper that relentlessly lied for the Tories at the
last election, with the help of the itelligence agencies.
Koba ,
As good as Hitchens has done here he's still at heart a Trotskyist he lives a good split and
a toothless display just like the Trotskyists he used to side with. His brother went from
Trotskyist to soft neocon and peter went from Trotskyist to an ardent Christian Conservative
in a veeeeeery short space of time. Plus there dad was deeeeep in with the establishment and
his mum Jewish. So .
Bellingcrap is just another scam like Dupes (Snopes) and Politi"facts". All of them are
funded by the Atlantic Council and the CIA front National Endowment for "Democracy". Their
cover as an "independent objective fact checking service" is about as transparent as Saran
Wrap.
tonyopmoc ,
I really liked this when I read it this morning, before the grandkids came round, but I
thought some of the comments a bit severe..
I mean this photo is of some 40 year old kid, who lives in Leicester, and his
Mum/wife/sister or whatever works in the local Post Office .
I personally had never heard of Brown Noses, and I have never personnally succeeded in
getting anything I wrote, posted above our below the line, since The Manchester Guardian
moved from Manchester to London, and whilst I do love reading some of the posters' comments
well look face it.
Even though Rhys probabaly doesn't like what this kid writes – Elliot is it? he is
hardly going to come round with a chainsaw, to cut his head off is he? He probably never even
thought of it.
He did say he is small fry, and he probably is still a virgin (been brainwashed – so
he actually belives the model doll is better. What has he got to compare it to?)
So I can't blame any of them.
There are alternatives as well as Facebook, Youtube, Instagram, and all those Dating
Websites, when almost everything you write gets deleted.
Just go down the local pub when there is a good band on. Even I can pull there, but I am
better looking than both Rhys and Elliot
I Like Girls.
I am a man. It's Normal
Just keep fit dancing and smiling, and you will be O.K.
Tony
paul ,
The prime importance of these endless hoaxes, smears, lies, fabrications and official
approved conspiracy theories, lies not so much in the events themselves as what it says about
the nature of the people who rule over us and their courtiers and handmaidens in the MSM.
It would take a whole forest of trees merely to catalogue all their lies over the years,
whether it's the Iraq Incubator Babies, the black Viagra fuelled rape gangs in Libya, the
Syrian Gas Hoaxes, 9/11, Iraq's WMD, Iran's non existent nuclear weapons, Skripal,
Russiagate, Ukrainegate, or the communist spy/ terrorist/ anti semitic smear campaign against
Corbyn. And that is only the tip of a very large iceberg. You could go back further to
Gladio, Operation Northwoods, Tonkin Gulf, the "Holocaust", Zinoviev Letter, Bayonetted
Belgian Babies, Raped Belgian Nuns, Human Bodies Made Into Soap. The list is endless.
We have been lied to consistently for years, decades, and generations. And these lies have
been peddled endlessly in the MSM, no matter how ludicrous and transparently false they are.
In the absence of direct personal knowledge or very convincing evidence to the contrary, you
just have to assume that everything we have ever been told, are being told, and will be told,
and most of the accepted historical record, are simply false. Nothing, nothing at all, can
ever be taken at face value.
And those who rule over us and who are responsible for these lies are psychopathic
subhuman filth devoid of any moral values or any redeeming features whatsoever. They are a
thousand times worse than the worst mass murderers or child killers who have ever been
through our courts. The Moors Murderers, the Ted Bundys, the Jeffrey Dahmers, were seriously
damaged individuals who killed a handful of victims. And they did their own dirty work. The
Blairs, the Campbells, the Straws, the Bushes, the Cheneys, the Rumsfelds, the Allbrights,
the Macrons, the Camerons, the Netanyahus, the Trumps, have the blood of millions on their
hands. They and their wire pullers are responsible for the death, starvation and misery of
tens and hundreds of millions.
So when Blair, or Johnson, or Trump or whoever is interviewed on television, you have to
remember that individual is a thousand times worse than the Moors Murderers, and we would
actually be that much better off if Brady or Hindley were ruling over us. They deserve no
respect or deference or legitimacy. They plot the murders of millions and the starvation of
tens of millions – and laugh and giggle as they do so. They should be simply recognised
for what they awe – psychopathic subhuman filth.
I do agree with you Paul and of course all you say is true. One of the main problems is that
these people have the power to build artificial constructs sufficient for the masses to
believe and perpetuated through their bought and paid for MSM whose journalists are mere foot
soldiers and wish only to get their pay checks. They have no reason to question the lies and
distortions pedaled to them by TPTB – they merely repeat the false narrative:
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not
understanding it!" – Upton Sinclair
And we, the great 99%, have little power to change things except within our local network.
We can shout all we like on social media but it changes nothing until the great crisis
reoccurs and perhaps the masses will rise and demand a just and equitable system. Until that
day perhaps this little video will provide an understanding:
The business of the MSM throughout the ages has been to traumatise or at least just generally
worry the public with headlines focused on fear, envy, anger, revenge, and hate. Include all
five in your story and you're well on the way to a Pulitzer Prize, bestowed on the profession
by one of the great muckrakers of all time. It's not incidental that there have been a
disturbing number of winners that have turned out to be dissembling frauds. Add to this the
fact that 'journalism' training apparently does not teach entrants to distinguish the
difference between opinion and news, and the die is cast: propaganda as news.
Dungroanin ,
Here is what BellEndScat supporting Rusbridger is moaning about.
"For some years now – largely unreported – two chancery court judges have been
dealing with literally hundreds of cases of phone hacking against MGN Ltd and News Group, the
owners, respectively, of the Daily Mirror and the Sun (as well as the defunct News of the
World).
The two publishers are, between them, forking out eye-watering sums to avoid any cases going
to trial in open court. Because the newspaper industry lobbied so forcefully to scrap the
second part of the Leveson inquiry, which had been due to shine a light on such matters, we
can only surmise what is going on.
But there are clues. Mirror Group (now Reach) had by July 2018 set aside more than
£70m to settle phone-hacking claims without risking any of them getting to court. The
BBC reported last year that the Murdoch titles had paid out an astonishing £400m in
damages and calculated that the total bill for the two companies could eventually reach
£1bn."
"Because the newspaper industry lobbied so forcefully to scrap the second part of the
Leveson inquiry, which had been due to shine a light on such matters, we can only surmise
what is going on."
-- --
Completely ignoring that the Integrity Iniative infested Guardian ITSELF objected to the
recommendation of Levesons thoroughly public Inquiry and opposition to a independent press
regulator!
It would have been a building block and certainly stopped most of the continued press
misbehaviour over the last 5 years.
Neither Fish nor Fowl Mr Rusbridger. More sinner that saint, more like.
Hugh O'Neill ,
Going to the heart of what Bellingcat, MI6 and CIA is Pompeo's: "We lie, we cheat, we steal."
These evil filth are devoid of any moral code and have no respect whatsoever for the laws of
God or Man. At which point, consider Moses' (how apt) Ten Commandments. There among them is:
"Thou shalt not bear false witness". Think what you will of these Ten, but as a moral code,
they were quite useful.
Richard Le Sarc ,
Would that all these scum could share the fate of their progenitor, Streicher-without the '
necktie party'. Life at hard labour would do the lot of them much good.
Brianeg ,
I looked at the Veterans Today link and it all sounds very plausible'
However in today's world nothing makes sense especially when the questions arise.
Is it possible to change the signal of an aircrafts transponder remotely. Can the target
acquisition radar on the missile be spoofed remotely. Just why did the flight control officer
sanction the take off of this plane in the middle of a war unless they were party to the
whole thing.. Just what were the six Israeli F-35 jets doing flying close to the Iranian
border?
Okay there is a lot of smoke but just where is the fire.
Just as interesting is that none of the twelve Iranian missiles was intercepted and there
are rumours that the Iranians were able to take out of action American air defences.
I am sure that like with Douma when the majority of NATO missiles were intercepted by
missiles that were decades old, you wonder what might happen when most of the middle east is
covered by the S-300 and later versions.
This is a story that has got a long way to run and we might never hear the ending.
Dungroanin ,
Facts are inconvenient.
Many planes took off.
This one was delayed by the pilot 'to remove overloading'.
Reports of Cruise missiles heading in.
The thing about 'chips' is they could easily be identified by putting them in a black box
and watching what they do using a chip which only does that!
The whole bs about it's THEM not US crap falls away. Just need some open source simple
'custodian' chip manufacturer to make that available. If it can be made a 'gate keeper' than
we are all safe.
Mucho ,
"It sounds a bit MAGA. "
After this, I will never, ever read any of your comments ever again. Get lost!
Mucho ,
You talk so much crap. Please, keep it to yourself
Dungroanin ,
I ain't saying that is your opinion am I?
The bit I watched was him being gung-ho about getting back 'control of microprocessors'
!!!
There is a big difference between designing chips and 'manufacturing' facilities'.
Have you never wondered why most actual building of small electrical component equipment
takes place in Asia?
I don't care wherher you read my comments- i am free to post what I want on whatevet
article and whoevers comment. And stick to facts.
Mucho ,
"The bit I watched ".
Honestly, I am so tired of people who comment on things they know nothing about. Everything
you say is wrong, because you are speaking from a position of total ignorance, because you
haven't watched the films.
Watch 1 to 3. Watch 22 and 23 ALL THE WAY THROUGH, not skimming. Then comment. Every
inaccurate comment you make is covered in detail. Honestly it's no wonder we're so fucked.
From 2005 after one google search, time spent on this, 10 seconds:
"While Yona was developed in partnership with one of Intel's California centers, the 65nm
microprocessor product is the first to be developed in its entirety, both the architecture
and strategy, by Intel engineers at its Israel plants in Haifa and Yakum. " https://www.israel21c.org/intels-new-chip-design-developed-in-israel/
You know zilch, you understand nothing, you make assumptions, you don't watch or read the
material, and then in your total ignorance, you spew your feeble thoughts on this forum.
Moron
Mucho ,
You define the phrase "ignorant Brit"
Dungroanin ,
Mucho since you FAILED instantly in your promise to ignore me – i will respond to your
toy throwing out of the parambulator.
First just telling people to WATCH something without explaining what the salient point to
be learnt – is not the way to influence or educate.
I prefer reading an argument- I definitely do not spend hours watching TV or listening to
propaganda by msm / indy or 'shock jocks' – that last was the personality I saw and
didn't feel the need to hear anymore as I don't when Nigel Farage and his ilk do on the radio
here.
If you want to inform or prove something to me or anyone else kindly post a link to a
written piece.
Second, chips are designed eveywhere there is such competence. Chip manufacturing mainly
improved theough research in top universities.
The UK was a lead chip designer too.
None of that means the Israelis haven't monopolosed tech and own many patents. The fact is
the Israelis ARE part of the 5+1 eyed world Empire – they are the plus one. Snowdens
whistleblowing makes absolutely clear that the +1 gets a higher clearance than the +4.
That's as nice as I am prepared to be, so finally, that last paragraph is what is known as
PROJECTION. Look it up and learn that it comes from your fav bogeymen brainfuckers.
That is some serious self-hate you have going on – work on it.
Take it easy ok?
Mucho ,
Number 23 is totally relevant too, going deep into chips, backdooring and kill switch usage
Koba ,
So the mocking of maga is what set you off? Fuck maga and it's idiot supporters great nations
don't slaughter civilians for capital
chris morris is very funny has a fine body of twisted comedick works
for all his charm his role is too destroy society degrade
he is khazar after all
sacha baron co hen the names speaks for itself an empty cruel tool
never trust a coen cohen khan or cowen or co they cookoo
eliot mcfuck higgins is not oirish
he is not certainly related to snooker loopy or is it darts i cannot remember hero alex
higgins.
eliot"s dad is rita katz from site intel group amaq news
his mom barbera lerner spector
or is it vice versa
versa vice
whatever
shirley you
get my the friends of the oirish israel drift
so to speaks
or sum such
Mucho ,
Brilliant, insightful, logical hypothesis of the recent plane downing over Iran by Jeremy
Rothe Kushel. Ignore the video, this is about the written article.
For further info about Israeli tech domination, what it is, where it comes from and the
implications of this, go to Brendon O Connell's YT channel. Number 22 in his list is very
important.
Mucho ,
Jeremy Rothe-Kushel is a very important member of the truth community, in no small part due
to the fact that he is an Ashkenazi Jew. My personal belief is that in the end, the Jewish
community will play a pivotal role in weeding out the evil that rules over us. I wish we
didn't have these labels, that we could have true freedom to play our chosen role in our God
created realm, but at this stage in the game, we're stuck with our divide and rule labels and
systems of control.
Jeremy's style is to the point, he has great depth of knowledge, an encyclopedic knowledge of
his field and is a highly astute commentator. He presents a lot of complex information in
fairly easy to digest chunks with his co-host, Greg McCarron, on their show "The Antedote" on
YT, as well as doing a lot of guerilla style activism in US politics. Highly recommended.
norman wisdom ,
i met elliot many years ago
the chap on the 8 year old lap top above
we called him fat face down the synagogue ohh how we laughed
he laughed as well everytime someone said it
such fun
are rabbi one day organised a trip and lecture tour of chatham house the belly of the
beast.
we learnt all about how tough regime change was and how difficult it is to do on a bbc size
budget.
what we learnt was that having are people everywhere really helped
scripted up to speed influencer roles in media in public on track on page working cog
like.
a kind of khazar collective non semites only for security reasons of course.
we could work from a very low pound dollar and shekels base and still be very effective.
never under estimate the benjamins or elliots it is folks like this that are the real hero
of the oded yinon
yes sir
already my life
fat face eliot boy done good
and like all khazar he hates the sephardim jewisher and the unclean arab which is shirley
a bonus is it not
George Mc ,
First off, if folks haven't a clue who Harold Shipman is, you're not going to get far with
Titus Oats. At the most they might think it's a character from Gormenghast.
Second, I initially misread the article and thought that the figure from the 17th century
actually WAS Higgins of Bellingcat. And if that seems an absurd assumption to make, even
temporarily, it doesn't seem much more absurd than some of the stuff he says e.g.
I had no knowledge beyond what I'd learned from Arnold Schwarzenegger and Rambo.
The point has been raised that there are psyops perpetrated with a malicious sense of
humour as if to say, "These suckers will swallow anything". Higgins with his "education" from
Arnold and Rambo may be an example of one of those jokes.
Third, and to end on an optimistic note, I like the 17th century sentencing and recommend
we bring it back:
and he was whipped and placed in the pillory.
Dungroanin ,
Admin – a suggestion on keeping recent articles available from the top of the page.
Problem: As you add new aricles at top left the ones on the very right drop away! Almost
as if being binned into a memory hole.
Solution: allow a scroll at the right hand edge so that these older links are easily
available to readers. Only a minor coding change without any change to your front page.
Tallis Marsh ,
I concur! I'm sure many of us will appreciate a scroll on the right hand edge so we can
access the older articles. Thanks in advance, OffG!
Oliver ,
HM Armed Forces operations in Syria follow the doctrine of Major General Sir Frank Kitson who
learnt his stuff in Kenya in the 1950s. Murder, torture, rape the staples of the British
military's modern terrorist ability. NATO doctrine too.
This is an important article: one of the few that dares to express that Douma et al are not
mere false flags they a darkly psychotic form of 'snuff propaganda porn' (including the
recycling and rearanging of 'props' that were until recently animate human souls with a
lifetime of possibility abnegated for ideology). The Working Group on Syria is part of a
small counter-narrative subset – along with Sister Agnes Mariam, Vanessa Beeley, RT (on
occasion), UK Column, The Indicter, Prof. Marcello Ferrada de Noli – who are willing to
state plainly that this is child murder. Now I wholeheartedly commend Kevin that we should
name and shame the culprits and their supporters.
"No, I think it is time for plainer, no-holds-barred language describing these people
for the true evil they are – until the truth and label sticks."
I had a similar epiphany in early 2016. The barbaric of murder of starved and thirsty
children at Rashidin – Syrian innocence lured by much needed sweets and drinks only to
be blown apart in front of their mothers. Anyone who supports the White Helmets terrorist
construct and their NATO-proxy child-murderers needs to be exposed. But what if that trail of
exposure leads back to the leader of the Labour party: who had just personally endorsed the
charity funding of the White Helmets? And continued to support the Jo Cox Foundation of
Syrian humanitarian bombers and R2P interventionists? Which itself is a front for the dark
money web of 'philanthrocapitalism' that is the shadow support network for regime change
crimes against humanity. This is when righteous indignation meets the dark wall of silence
around the social construction of reality. Especially if you put Jeremy Corbyn in the
frame.
What this means is the ability to frame dark actors for the true evil they are has to be a
two-way flow. Meaning is created across networks, not just by naming but by naming and
agreeing across narrative communities. Again, this is not abstruse: it is social reality.
Social reality is not reality: it is a consensual constructivism. Significant numbers of
others have to be in a position of consensual agreement in order to challenge the dominant
narrative(s). So I echo the sentiment that many can see that the dominant narrative –
especially concerning Syria – is deeply flawed. But they are as yet unwilling to admit
that the depth of the flaw is in fact a tear in social reality that cannot be easily
healed.
This is the aspect of social reality called 'universe maintenance'. Doxa is the reality
constructing belief set – the episteme of interacting beliefs. The narrative has two
main aspects: ortho-doxa and hetero-doxa – the orthodox maintaining and heterodox
subverting discourses. In order to truly subvert the hegemonic orthodoxy – there has to
be a social moment of criticality when the heterodox is no longer deniable. To reach that
point: the intrajecting true has to be believable to the hegemonic orthodoxy. Now we have a
third mode: para-doxa when the true 'state of affairs' is not believable – it is easily
rejected as paradoxical to the reigning consensus covenant of the true. This is universe
maintaining: whereby the the totality of the dominant discourse actually subsumes or repels
any paradox as a half-truth or ameliorated, disarmed less-than-true ('conspiracy theory').
This is known as 'recuperation'. Anything that meets the dominant discourse has to be
explained in the terms of the dominant discourse accommodative and recommending itself to the
dominant discourse. Which then becomes a part of the dominant universe of discourse.
A moment of the true is like a barb to a bubble. It has to be contained and wrapped in
narrative that describes and explains it into a consumable form. The full realisation of the
propagandic child murder in Syria – tacitly supported by the Labour Party and Jeremy
Corbyn in particular – would destroy the symbolic universe of social reality. Of which
it is my personal experience no one really wants to do. The correlations, direct and indirect
links, and universally maintained orthodoxy of narrative discourse point to an accomodation.
An explanation or multivariate set of explanations that problem shift and ascribe blame to
imaginary actors. To deflect or defend the personal self. Because the personal self is
independently situated outside the social sphere. Or is it?
Seeing the real event as it happens requires the perspicacity of social inclusion. We all
create social reality together: with our without layers of dualising exclusion that protects
us from the way the world really is. Who would vote to legitimise the supporters of NATO and
the child-murderers of Syria? 31 million legitimising independent social actors just did. Do
you suppose they did so in full knowledge that it is child-murder they were supporting? Or
did they create universe maintaining accommodations to the truth? That is how powerful the
screening discourses and legitimising orthodoxic narrative mythology is. It is not that it
cannot be subverted: its just that calling out the true evil has to be heard in unison by
large or social small assemblages willing to totally change everything – including
themselves. In order to transition to a different social reality one that accommodates the
truth. One which will look nothing like the social reality we choose to maintain as is.
Francis Lee ,
My first attempt didn't get through. Herewith second.
It seems to me that the internal affairs of the Russian Federation, although they may have
some impact on external geopolitical issues, are a matter for them. At the present time the
relevant question regarding the RF is as follows: Question 1. Is Russia a revionist state
intent on an expansionist foreign policy? Answer NO. But it is not going to tolerate NATO
expansion into its own strategic zones, namely, Ukraine, Georgia and the North Caucusas.
Question 2. Is the Anglo-Zionist empire in open of pursuit of a world empire intent on
destroying any sovereign state – including first and foremost Russia – which
stands in its way? Answer YES. This really is so blatant that anyone who is ethnically
challenged should seek psychiatric help. In Polls conducted around the world the US is always
cited as the most dangerous enemy of world peace, including in the US itself. Thus a small
influential (unfortunately deranged) cabal based in the west has insinuated its way into the
institutions of power and poses a real and present danger to world peace.
This being the case it is imperative to push all and any 'normal' western governments and
shape public opinion and discourse (except the nut-jobs like Poland and the Baltics) into
diplomacy. Wind down NATO just as the Warsaw Pact was wound down. that will do for starters.
Of course the PTB in all the western institutions – the media (whores) the deep state,
the Atlantic Council, the Council on Foreign Relations, Chatham House the Arms merchants, the
security services GCHQ, the CIA, Mossad and the rest will oppose this with all the power at
their command. This is the present primary site of struggle, mainly propagandistic, cultural
and economic, but with overtones of kinetic warfare.
Similar diplomatic initiatives must be directed at China. Yes, I know all about China's
social credit policy, I don't particularly like the idea of 24 hour system of surveillance,
and I wouldn't want to live there, but is already a virtual fait accompli in the west. Again
it bears repeating that sovereign states should be left to their own devices. After all
'States have neither permanent friends of allies, only permanent interests. (Lord Palmerston,
19 century British Statesman). No more 'humanitarian interventions' thank you very much. How
about Mind our own Business non-interventions.
I make no apologies for being a foreign policy realist – if that hasn't become
apparent by this stage!
BigB ,
Francis:
The Russian Federation is involved is strategic partnership with China in consolidating
the Eurasian 'supercontinent' into the world island. One which is slowly being drawn together
into a massive market covering 70% of the world's population, 75% of energy resources, and
70% of GDP. I'd call that expansionist, wouldn't you?
Market mechanisms and methodology are exponentially expansionist, extractivist, and
extrapolative. Market propaganda is free and equal exchange coupled with mutual development
through comparative advantage. Everyone benefits, right?
No: markets operate as vast surplus value extractors that only operate unequally to
deliver maximum competitive advantage to the suprasovereign core. Surplus value valorises
surplus capital which cannot be contained in a single domestic market: so it seeks to exploit
underdeveloped foreign markets setting up dependencies and peripheries in the satellite
states. Which keeps them maldeveloped. In short: Russia and China's wealth is not just their
own.
Russia and China are globalisation now. Globalist exponential expansionism, extractivism,
and extrapolation is the repression of humanism and destruction of the biosphere. It can't
stop growing in the cancer stage of hyper-capitalism. We are currently consuming every
resource at a material throughput increase of 3% per annum year on year. That's a 23 year
exponential doubling of material resources. And a 46 year doubling of the doubling. How long
before globalisation uses everything? How far into the race to the bottom will the market
collapse?
It would be really nice to return to a Westphalian System of non-expansionist,
non-extractivist sovereign nation states. It is just not even plausible under market
mechanisms of extraction. There can be no material decoupling and development remains
contingent on an impossible infinity: because development remains parallel and assymetrically
maintained. And all major resources are depleting exponentially too. Including the nominative
renewable and sustainable ones.
Degrowth; self-sufficiency; localised 'anti-fragility', steady-state; asymmetric
development of the marginalised and the peripheralised; regenerative agroecological
agriculture; human development not abstract market development; are just some of the
pre-requisites of a return to sovereign states. Russia 'sovereigntist' globalisation is the
expansionist opposite to that. The RF is part of the biggest market in the world that hoovers
up as much surplus value as it can before sending a large tranche of it to London. As much as
$25bn a year in capital flight into the offshore nexus of secrecy jurisdictions. It's a
globalist expansionist market mechanism that hoovers all vitality out of the life-ground.
That: I call expansionist and imperialist of which Russia and China are now the major
part.
Francis Lee ,
"The Russian Federation is involved is strategic partnership with China in consolidating the
Eurasian 'supercontinent' into the world island. One which is slowly being drawn together
into a massive market covering 70% of the world's population, 75% of energy resources, and
70% of GDP. I'd call that expansionist, wouldn't you?"
No, I wouldn't actually. Building roads, rail connections and other trade routes doesn't
strike me as imperial expansion. No-one is being forced to join the Shanghai Cooperation
Organization (SCO) or into reconfiguring their internal political and economic structures, as
the US does in Latin America or as the British did in India and Southern Africa. (East India
Company and the British British South Africa Chartered Company). The SCO is a voluntary
arrangement. Uzbekistan for example has decided not to join the central Asian Eurasian
Economic Union – well that's its prerogative. No-one is going to send any gun-boats to
force them. (I am aware that Uzbekistan is a landlocked country, but I was talking
figuratively.)
The EEU's genesis has along with the SCO and BRI has been forced upon the China/Russia
axis as part of an emerging counter-hegemonic alliance against the US's imperial
aggrandisement with its kowtowing vassals in tow. Russia has no claims on any of its
neighbours since it is already endowed with ample land and mineral deposits. China is a key
part of this essentially geopolitical bloc quite simply because the US imperial hegemon is
determined to stop China's development by all means necessary including the dragooning of
contiguous military bases in US proxy states around China's maritime borders.
A distinction should be made between rampant imperialism of the Anglo-zi0nist empire, and
the response of an increasingly bloc of states who find both their sovereignty and even their
existence threatened by the imperial juggernaut. What exactly did you expect them to do given
the hostility and destructive intent of the Empire? Defence against imperialism is not
imperialism. The defence of autonomy and sovereignty of international society and the
creation of an anti-hegemonic have the potential to finally create a transformative new world
order (and goodness knows we need one) announced at the end of the Cold War in 1991. This
ambition finds support not only in Russia and China but in other countries ready to align
with them, but also in many western countries. I obviously need to put the question again.
Who is and who is not the greatest threat to world peace? Surely to pose the question is to
answer it.
Dungroanin ,
Agree Francis.
There is a move to suggest that the Old Empire retains a 'maritime' world and the SCO
confines itself to the Eurasian land mass.
Dream on.
The Empire is DEAD. Long live the new Empire!
BigB ,
Who is the greatest threat to world peace and to the world itself? We are. The global carbon
consumption/pollution bourgeoisie. It is the global expansionist mindset that is increasing
its demands for growth – as the only solution to social problems, maldevelopment, and
maldistribution caused by excessive growth. Supply has to be met by exponentially expanding
markets. Whether this is voluntaristic or coerced makes very little difference to the market
cancer subsuming the globe. Benign or aggressive forms of cancer are still cancer. And the
net effect is the same.
Russia and China – the 'East' – uphold exactly the same corporate model of
global governance that the 'West' does. Which has been made clear in every joint communique
– especially BRICS communiques. I have made the case – following Professor
Patrick Bond – that BRICS in particular (a literal Goldman Sachs globalist marketing
ploy) – are sub-imperial, not anti-imperial. All their major institutions are dollar
denominated for loans; BRI finance is in dollars; BRICS re-capitalised the IMF; Contingency
Reserve Arrangements come with an IMF neoliberalising structural adjustment policy; etc. It
is the same model East and West. One is merely the pseudo-benign extension of the other. The
alternative to neoliberal globalisation is neoliberal globalisation. This became radiantly
clear at SPIEF 2019: TINA there is no alternative.
The perceived alternative is the reproduction of neoliberalism – which has long been
think-tanked and obvious – and its transformation from 'globalisation 3.0' to
'globalisation 4.0' trade in goods and services, with the emphasis on a transition to
high-speed interconnectivity and decoupled service economies. Something like the
Trans-Eurasian Information Super Highway (TASIM)? With a sovereigntist and social inclusivity
compact. So the neoliberal leopard can change its spots?
No. Whilst your argument is sound and well constructed: it is reliant on the early 20th
century Leninist definition of 'imperialism' as a purely militarist phenomena. Imperialism
mutated since then – from military to financial (which are not necessarily exclusive
sets) – and is set to metastasise again into 'green imperialism' of man over man (and
it is an andrarchic principle) and man (culture) over nature. Here your argument falls down
to an ecological and bio-materialist critique. Cancer is extractivist and expansionist
wherever it grows.
Russia is the fourth largest primary energy consumer on the planet. Disregarding hydro
– which is not truly ecological – it has a 1% renewable penetration. It is a
hydrocarbon behemoth set to grow the only way it knows how – consuming more
hydrocarbons. They cannot go 'green': no one can. And a with a global ecological footprint of
3.3 planets per capita, per annum, this is not sustainable. Now or ever.
So a distinction needs to be made between the old rampant neoliberal globalisation model
(3.0) – the Anglo-Zionist imperialist model – and the emergent neoliberal
globalisation model (4.0) of Russia/China's rampant ecological imperialism? And a further
distinction needs to be made about what humanity has to do to survive this distinction
between aggressive and quasi-benign cancer forms. Because we will be just as dead, just as
quick if we cannot even identify the underlying cancer we are all suffering from.
Koba ,
Big B sit down ultra! China and Russia rent empires and have no desire to be! If you're a
left winger you're another poor example of one and more than likely a Trotskyist
Richard Le Sarc ,
Love the nickname, Josef.
Louis Proyect ,
This is because if a chemical attack did not take place and Assad was not responsible it
seems highly likely that the civilians including children were murdered to facilitate a
fabrication.
And were our own intelligence agencies involved in a staged event, considering the refusal
to even establish the basic facts in the days following?
-- -
This is the sort of conclusion you must come to if you are into Islamophobic conspiracy
theories. The notion that this kind of slaughter took place to "facilitate" a false flag is
analogous to the 9/11 conspiracism that was on display here a while back and that manifested
itself through the inclusion of NYU 9/11 Truther Mark Crispin Miller on Tim Hayward's
Assadist propaganda team.
Sad, really.
Harry Stotle ,
Go on Louis, remind us about the 'terrorist passport' miraculously found at the foot of the
collapsed tower with a page coveniently left open displaying a 'Tora Bora' stamp – I
kove that bit.
I mean who, apart from half the worlds scientific community is not totally convinced by
such compelling evidence, especially when allied to the re-writing of the laws of physics in
order to rationlise the ludicrous 2 planes 3 towers conspiracy theory?
Next you'll be telling us it was necessary for the US to invade Afghanistan and Iraq for
reasons few American'srecall beyond the neocon fantasy contructed on 11th Septemember,
2001.
Dave Hansell ,
It's clear to a blind man on a galloping horse from this comment of yours Mr Proyect that
concepts such as objective evidence, logical and rational deduction, the scientific method
etc are beyond your ken.
Faced with the facts of a collapsing narrative of obvious bullshit and lies you have
bought into, which you are incapable of facing up to, it is unsurprising that you are reduced
to such puerile school playground level deflections.
So come on, try getting out of the gutter and upping your game. Because this fare is
nothing short of sad and pathetic.
We know from the evidence of those who actually know their arse from their elbow on these
matters that the claims of an attack using chemical weapons on this site are
unsustainable.
Which leaves the issue of the bodies at the site. Given they did not lose their lives as a
result of the unscientific bullshit explanation you desperately and clearly want to be the
case the question is how did those civilians lose their lives? How did their corpses find
their way to that location?
Did Assad and his "regime" murder them and move the bodies to that site (over which they
had no control) in order to create a false flag event to get themselves falsely accused of an
NBC attack Louis? Because that's the only reasonable and rational deduction one can imply
from your argument and approach.
It is certainly more reasoned, rational and in keeping with the scientific method (you
might want to try it sometime) to surmise that the bodies on site, having not been the result
of the claimed and unsustainable narrative you have naively committed to, either died on site
from some other cause or were brought to the site for the purpose of creating your fantasy
narrative.
In the latter case it is further a matter of rational and reasoned deduction that such an
occurrence could only be carried it in circumstances in which whoever carried it out had
actual, effective and physical control of a geographical location and area situated within a
wider conflict zone.
Again, it remains a piece of factual reality that this location was not under the control
of the Assad 'regime.' Not least because otherwise there would be no logical or rational
military reason for the de facto Syrian Government and it's armed forces to waste resources
attacking it.
Unless of course he buys I to the conspiracy theory and hat they somehow organised a false
flag implicating themselves?
I'm sure everyone else here in the reality based community is waiting with bated breath
for you to 'explain' how they did this Louis.
I know I am. I could do with a good laugh.
George Mc ,
This is the sort of conclusion you must come to if you are into Islamophobic conspiracy
theories.
Umm – the assumption that Muslims DIDN'T do it is "Islamophobic"? Even on your own
terms you're not making much sense these days, Louis.
Hi I'm Louis an unrepentant Marxist and I willfully refuse to use block-quotes.
Richard Le Sarc ,
More proyectile vomitus in defence of child-murdering salafist vermin. How low can this
creature descend?
Louis Proyect ,
Richard, such abusive language only indicates your inability to discuss the matter at hand.
In general, a detached sarcasm works much better in polemics. You need to read Lenin to see
how it is done. I should add that I am referring to V.I. Lenin, not John Lenin who wrote
"Crippled Inside".
Richard Le Sarc ,
You defended the salafist butchers with lies, proyectile-do you not even comprehend your own
sewage? Or did someone else write it and you just appended your paw-print?
Dave Hansell ,
Apologies here. There is an open goal and the ball needs to be put in the back of the net:
Seems that Louis here is well ahead of the curve in terms of Fukuyama's well known
observation about the end of history.
For Louise history, in terms of the progress and development of human knowledge, stopped
around a century ago with whatever Lenin wrote.
But that's what happens to those who only read one book.
Sad really.
Dungroanin ,
You come across more as Yaxley – Lenin mr Tommy Proyect – but he is a MI5 stooge
unlike you cough cough.
Koba ,
Lenin hates Trotsky! Trotsky was a power mad maniac who wanted a permanent war state to
somehow spread his specific brand of "ahem" socialism, which won't win you friends! "Hi yeah
sorry we killed your family in a war we started to save you but yippee Trotsky is now in
charge so stop complaining"! You're just a bunch of liars the trots
Maggie ,
learn to use the internet which has the information you need to learn the truth:
Maggie don't take jimmy bore as some truth teller he's a bland progressive with revolutionary
slogans like proyect! He also has a habit of equating Stalin with Hitler in that god awful
nasal accent of his
Richard Le Sarc ,
Thems White Helmets is always so neat and tidy. Their mammies must have insisted that they
always look their best.
paul ,
The British taxpayer funded head choppers and throat slitters in Syria routinely committed
massacres and filmed their victims. The resulting footage was passed off by tame media hacks
as "evidence" of regime atrocities.
Koba ,
Death to the Trotskyists
Fuck proyect your name calling says it all!
Islamophobes indeed?! What an idiot
Harry Stotle ,
The alternative media, and a smattering of truth tellers are locked in an asymmetrical
information-war with the establishment – with an all too obvious 'David & Goliath'
sort of dynamic underlying it.
The question asked at the heart of this article is how to break the vice like grip
information managers hold over various geopolitical narratives, referencing events in Douma
in particular.
Alnost reflexively 9/11 comes to mind – a fairly unambiguous example of mass murder
for which the official account does not withstand even the most cursory form of scrutiny.
Professionals even went so far as to purger themselves while the investigating committee
admitted they were 'set up to fail' (to quote its chairman).
Yet the public, instead of shredding Bush, limb from limb (for the lies that were told)
rolled onto their back while the neoncons tickled their collective belly as you might do with
a particulalrly adorable puppy,
So if we can't even get to the bottom of events in the middle of New York what realistic
chance of doing so in a hostile war zone like Douma?
On balance racism, together with other forms of collective loathing is the most likely
reason why this unsatisfactory state of affairs is unlikely to change.
A collective 'them and us' mindset makes it far easier for information managers to
manipulate a visceral hatred and fear of 'the other'.
Today it is Qasem Soleimani westerners are taugyt to despise, yesterday it was Bashar
al-Assad, before that Vladimir Putin, Saddam Hussein, Muammar al-Gaddafi, Nicolás
Maduro . the list just goes on and on.
Information managers simply wind the public up so that collective anger can be directed
toward governments or individuals they are trying to bring down – recent history tells
us that the public are largely oblivious to this process, so thus never learn from their
mistakes.
Perhaps one thing western leaders, and the US in particular can always rely on, is the
ease with which the public can be persuaded to believe that certain bogeymen pose a grave
threat to 'our way of life' while failing to notice that it is in fact our own leaders who
are carrying out the worst atrocities.
harry law ,
Harry Stotle, .."Perhaps one thing western leaders, and the US in particular can always rely
on, is the ease with which the public can be persuaded to believe that certain bogeymen pose
a grave threat to 'our way of life'. That's true Hermann Goring had it about right with this
quote
"Why of course the people don't want war. Why should some poor slob on a farm want to risk
his life in a war when the best he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one
piece? Naturally the common people don't want war: neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for
that matter in Germany. That is understood. But after all it is the leaders of a country who
determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is
a democracy or fascist dictatorship, or a parliament or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no
voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you
have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peace makers for lack of
patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."
@JimDandy Hpw did the instruction to "Fly direct" prove fatal to MH 17
MUMBAI: The ministry of civil aviation's claim that there was no Air India flight near the
ill-fated Malaysia Airlines Boeing 777 when it was shot down over Ukraine on Thursday appears
misleading.
An Air India Dreamliner flight going from Delhi to Birmingham was in fact less than 25km away
from the Malaysian aircraft,
Minutes before the crash caused by a missile strike, the AI pilots had also heard the
controller give the Malaysian aircraft MH17 what is called "a direct routing". This permits
an aircraft to fly straight, instead of tracking the regular route which is generally a
zig-zag track that goes from one ground-based navigation aid or way point to another. "Direct
routing saves fuel and time and is preferred by pilots. In this case, it proved fatal," said
an airline source.
1 Was India pressurized to deny the close proximity and 2 was it under pressure to deny
that it heard the controller giving the instruction to MH 17????
"... The infrastructure they inherited from the USSR mostly is now fully amortized. For example railway park in in complete ruin. Central heating pipeline communications in cities like Kiev are in ruins too. In the USSR they tried to reuse the heat from electric stations and have elaborate hot water delivery networks from each, which provided heat to a large city blocks. Now pipes are completely rusted (which in 30 years is no surprise) and are in the state of constant repair. ..."
"... But when the standard of living dropped to such extent as it dropped after 2014 sentiments toward even slightly different ethnic groups turn hostile too. This is the case in Ukraine. In this sense you are wrong. There is no more unity now then existed before 2014. I would say there is less unity now. ..."
"... Sentiments turned against both Donbass dwellers and Ukrainians from Western Ukraine. In Kiev the derogatory term for both categories is "ponaekhali" ("come to overcrowd the place and displace us", or something along those lines; it's difficult to translate, but the term carries strong derogatory meaning) ..."
"... The nationalistic hysteria of 2014-2017 now mostly changed into deep depression: how a tiny group of far right nationalist and football hooligan gangs managed to get to power against the will of the majority of the country and destroy its economy. That's why Zelensky was elected and most far right parliamentarians lost their seats. Most of Western Ukraine voted for him, which is telling you something. ..."
"... The problem for Ukraine is that with the cut of economic ties with Russia the natural path for economics is probably down. De-industrialization, Baltic style, is raining supreme. Many enterprises survived the period from 1991 to 2014 only due to orders from Russia. Especially remnants of military industrial complex and manufacturing industry. Now what? Selling land (like Zelensky is trying to do) ? ..."
I feel like robber barons in Kyiv have harmed you more through their looting of the country than impoverished Eastern Ukrainians,
who were the biggest losers in the post-Soviet deindustrilization, have harmed you by existing and dying of diseases of poverty
and despair.
It reminds me of how coastal shit-libs in America talk about "fly-over" country and want all the poor whites in Appalachia
to die. I'm living in a country whose soul is totally poisoned. A country that is dying. While all this is happening, whites have
split themselves into little factions focused on political point scoring.
I doubt people like Zelensky, Kolomoisky, Poroshenko and all the rest are going to turn Ukraine into an earthly paradise. They're
more likely to be Neros playing harps, while Ukraine burns.
Looks like your understanding of Ukraine is mostly based of a short trip to Lvov and reading neoliberal MSM and forums. That's
not enough, unless you want to be the next Max Boot.
Ukraine is a deeply sick patient, which surprisingly still stands despite all hardships (Ukrainians demonstrated amazing, superhuman
resilience in the crisis that hit them, which greatly surprised all experts).
The infrastructure they inherited from the USSR mostly is now fully amortized. For example railway park in in complete ruin. Central
heating pipeline communications in cities like Kiev are in ruins too. In the USSR they tried to reuse the heat from electric stations
and have elaborate hot water delivery networks from each, which provided heat to a large city blocks. Now pipes are completely rusted
(which in 30 years is no surprise) and are in the state of constant repair.
And, what is really tragic Ukraine now it is a debt state. Usually the latter is the capital sentence for the county. Few managed
to escape even in more favorable conditions (South Korea is one.) So chances of economic recovery are slim: with such level of parasitic
rent to the West the natural path is down and down. Don't cry for me Argentina.
And there is no money to replace already destroyed due to bad maintenance infrastructure, but surprisingly large parts of Soviets
era infrastructure still somehow hold. For example, electrical networks, subway cars. But other part are already crumbling.
For example, in Kiev that means in some buildings you have winter without central heating, you have elevators in 16-storey buildings
that work one or two weeks in month, you have no hot water, sometimes you have no water at all for a week or more, etc). Pensioners
have problem with paying heating bills, so some of them are forced to live in non-heated apartments.
And that's in Kiev/Kyiv (Western Ukrainians love to change established names, much like communists) . In provincial cities it
is a real horror show when even electricity supply became a problem. The countryside dwellers at least has its own food, but the
situation for them is also very very difficult.
Other big problem -- few jobs and almost no well paid job, unless you are young, know English and have a university education
(and are lucky). Before 2014 approximately 70% of Ukrainian labor migrants (in total a couple of million) came from the western part
of the country, in which migration had become a widespread method of coping with poverty, the absence of jobs and low salaries.
Now this practice spread to the whole county. That destroyed many families.
The USA plays its usual games selling vassals crap at inflated prices (arms, uranium rods, coal, locomotives, cars, etc) , which
Ukrainians can't refuse. Trump is simply a typical gangster in this respect, running a protection racket.
The rate of emigration and shrinking population is another fundamental problem. Mass emigration (
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Ukraine
) is continuing even after Zelensky election. Looting by the West also continues unabated. This is disaster capitalism in action.
Add to those problems inflated military expenses to fight the civil war in Donbass which deprives other sectors of necessary funds
(with the main affect of completely alienating Russia) and "Huston, we have a problem."
May be this is a natural path for xUSSR countries after the dissolution of the USSR, I don't know.
But the destiny of ordinary Ukrainians is deeply tragic: they wanted better life and got a really harsh one. Especially pensioners
(typical pension is something like $60-$70) a month in Kiev, much less outside of Kiev. How they physically survive I do not fully
understand.
There are still pro-Russian areas but being free of Crimea and Donbass means Ukraine can no longer be characterized as "split."
I agree that there is a substantial growth of anti-Russian sentiments. It is really noticeable. As well as growth of the usage
of the Ukrainian language (previously Kiev, unlike Lvov was completely Russian-language city).
And in Western Ukraine Russiphobia was actually always a part of "national identity". The negative definition of national identity,
if you wish. See popular slogan "Hto ne skache toi moskal" ("those who do not jump are Moskal" -- where Moskal is the derogatory
name for a Russian). Here is this slogan in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6rfqr9afMc
;-)
But when the standard of living dropped to such extent as it dropped after 2014 sentiments toward even slightly different
ethnic groups turn hostile too. This is the case in Ukraine. In this sense you are wrong. There is no more unity now then existed
before 2014. I would say there is less unity now.
Sentiments turned against both Donbass dwellers and Ukrainians from Western Ukraine. In Kiev the derogatory term for both
categories is "ponaekhali" ("come to overcrowd the place and displace us", or something along those lines; it's difficult to translate,
but the term carries strong derogatory meaning) .
"Donetskie" (former Donbass dwellers, often displaced by the war) are generally strongly resented and luxury cars, villas, etc
and other excesses of neoliberal elite are attributed mostly to them (Donbass neoliberal elite did moved to Kiev, not Moscow)
, while "zapadentsi" are also, albeit less strongly, resented because they often use clan politics within institutions, and often
do not put enough effort (or are outright incompetent), as they rely on its own clan ties for survival.
This sentiment is stronger to the south of Kiev where the resentment is directed mainly against Western Ukrainians, not against
"Donetskie" like in Kiev. And I am talking not only about Odessa. Western Ukrainians are now strongly associated with corrupt ways
of getting lucrative positions (via family, clan or political connections), being incompetent and doing nothing useful.
What surprise me is that this resentment against "zapadentsi" and "Poloshenko clan" is shared by many people from Western Ukraine.
The target is often slightly more narrow, for example Hutsuls in Lviv (
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hutsuls )
The nationalistic hysteria of 2014-2017 now mostly changed into deep depression: how a tiny group of far right nationalist
and football hooligan gangs managed to get to power against the will of the majority of the country and destroy its economy. That's
why Zelensky was elected and most far right parliamentarians lost their seats. Most of Western Ukraine voted for him, which is telling
you something.
The problem for Ukraine is that with the cut of economic ties with Russia the natural path for economics is probably down.
De-industrialization, Baltic style, is raining supreme. Many enterprises survived the period from 1991 to 2014 only due to orders
from Russia. Especially remnants of military industrial complex and manufacturing industry. Now what? Selling land (like Zelensky
is trying to do) ?
Ukraine will probably eventually lose a large part of its chemical industry because without subsidies for gas it just can't complete
even taking into account low labor costs. And manufacturing because without Russian market it is difficult to find a place for their
production in already established markets, competing only in price and suffering in quality (I remember something about Iraq returning
Ukrainians all ordered armored carriers due to defect is the the armor
https://sputniknews.com/military/201705221053859853-armored-vehicles-defects-extent
/). Although at least for the Ukrainian arm industry there is place on the market in countries which are used to old Soviet armaments,
because those are rehashed Soviet products.
Add to this corrupt and greedy diaspora (all those Jaresko, Chalupas, Freelands, Vindmans, etc ) from the USA and Canada (and
not only diaspora -- look at Biden, Kerry, etc) who want their piece of the pie after 2014 "Revolution of dignity" (what a sad joke)
and you will see the problems more clearly. Not that much changed from the period 1991-2014 where Ukraine was also royally fleeced
by own oligarchs allied with Western banksers, simply now this leads to quicker deterioration of the standard of living.
None of Eastern European countries benefited from a color revolution staged by the USA. This is about opening the country not
only to multinationals (while they loot the county they at least behave within a certain legal bounds, demonstrating at least decency
of gangsters like in Godfather), but to petty foreign criminals from diaspora and outside of it who allies with the local oligarchs
and smallernouveau riche and are siphoning all the county wealth to western banks as soon as possible. Greed of the disapora is simply unbounded.
https://neweasterneurope.eu/2016/08/26/the-ukrainian-diaspora-as-a-recipient-of-oligarchic-cash/
Of course, Ukrainian diaspora is not uniform. Still, outside well-know types from the tiny Mid-Eastern country, the most dangerous
people for Ukraine are probably Ukrainians from diaspora with dual citizenship
"... What no one is mentioning is: the US airstrikes on Iraqi military bases, and Soleimani's murder contributed greatly to the hair trigger response of Iran's air defense forces. If Washington did not turn the heat up on both Iraq and Iran there would have been no need for Iran's retaliation, and thus the level of Iran's domestic defense forces would not have been so nervous as to pull the trigger downing the airliner. ..."
"... Former CIA high-ranking official accidentally reveals the type of the false flag operation that the US imperialists will orchestrate to start a war with Iran https://failedevolution.blogspot.com/2020/01/former-cia-high-ranking-official.html ..."
"... It reminds me too much of MH-17, which was not hit with a BUK but with bullets. Iran should have closed its airspace because such tricks are to be expected, irrespective of the cause of the current accident. ..."
When the Pentagon confirmed the assassination of Iranian Major General Qasem Soleimani, U.S.
President Donald Trump took to social media to post a single image of the American flag to the
adulation of his followers. Unfortunately, most Americans are ignorant of the other flag
synonymous with U.S. foreign policy, that of the 'false flag' utilized to deceive the public
and stir up support for endless war abroad. While the chicken hawk defenders of Trump's
reckless decision to murder one of the biggest contributors in the defeat of ISIS salivated
over possible war with Iran, their appetite was spoiled by Tehran's retaliatory precision
strikes of two U.S. bases in Iraq that deliberately avoided casualties while in accordance with
the Islamic Republic's right to self defense under Article 51 of the United Nations charter.
The reprisal successfully deescalated the crisis but sent a clear message Iran was willing to
stand up to the U.S. with the backing of Russia and China, while Washington underestimated
Tehran which forewarned the Iraqi government of its impending counterattack so U.S. personnel
could evacuate.
In the hours following the ballistic missile strikes, reports came in that a Boeing 737
international passenger flight scheduled from Tehran to Kiev, Ukraine had crashed shortly after
takeoff from Imam Khomeini International Airport, killing all 176 passengers and flight crew on
board. Initial video of the crash of Ukrainian International Airlines Flight 752 (PS752) showed
that the aircraft was already in flames while descending to the ground, leading to speculation
it was shot down amid the heightened political crisis between Iran and Washington. In the days
following, a second obscure video surfaced which only increased this suspicion. Meanwhile,
Western governments quickly concluded that an anti-aircraft surface-to-air missile brought
PS752 down and were eager to point the finger at Iran before any formal investigation. Many
people, including this author, were admittedly skeptical as to how a plane taking off from
Tehran could have been mistaken five hours after the strikes in Iraq.
Nevertheless, those with reservations turned out to be wrong when days later the Islamic
Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) came clean that its aerospace forces made a "human error" and
accidentally shot the passenger plane down after mistaking it for a incoming cruise missile
when it flew close to a military base during a heightened state of alert in anticipation of
U.S. attack. Many have noted that Iran's honorable decision to take responsibility for the
catastrophe is in sharp contrast with Washington's response in 1988 when the U.S. Navy shot
down Iran Air Flight 655 scheduled from Tehran to Dubai over the Strait of Hormuz in the
Persian Gulf, killing all 290 occupants, after failing to cover it up. Just a month later, Vice
President George H.W. Bush would notoriously state he would " never apologize for the United
States of America. Ever. I don't care what the facts are ." Although he was not directly
referring to the incident, one can only imagine what the reaction would be if Iranian President
Hassan Rouhani were to say the same weeks after shooting down the Ukrainian plane, let alone an
American one. Predictably, Tehran's transparency has gone mostly unappreciated while the Trump
administration is already trying to use the disaster to further demonize Iran.
Oddly enough, Ukrainian International Airlines is partly owned by the infamous
Ukrainian-Israeli oligarch, politician and energy tycoon Igor Kolomoisky, who was notably one
of the biggest financiers of the anti-Russian, pro-EU coup d'etat which overthrew the
democratically elected government of Viktor Yanukovych in 2014. Kolomoisky is also a principal
backer of current Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky whose dubious phone call with Trump
resulted in the 45th U.S. president's impeachment last month. In another astounding
coincidence, Kolomoisky's Privat Group is believed to control Burisma Holdings, the
Cypress-based company whose executive board 2020 presidential candidate Joe Biden's son Hunter
was appointed to following the Maidan junta. The former Vice President admitted that he bribed
Ukraine into firing its top prosecutor who was looking into his son's corruption by threatening
to withhold $1 billion in loan guarantees.
Kolomoisky, AKA "the Chameleon", is one of the wealthiest people in the ex-Soviet country
and was formerly appointed as governor of an administrative region bordering Donbass in eastern
Ukraine following the 2014 putsch. He has also funded a battalion of volunteer neo-Nazi
mercenaries fighting alongside the Ukrainian army in the War in Donbass against
Russian-speaking separatists which the military aid temporarily withheld by the Trump
administration that was disputably contingent upon an investigation of Biden and his son goes
to. In 2014, another infamous plane shootdown made international headlines when Malaysian
Airlines Flight 17 (MH17) scheduled from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur was shot down over the
breakaway Donetsk People's Republic (DPR) in eastern Ukraine, killing all 298 passengers and
crew.
From the get-go, the Obama administration was adamant that the missile which shot down the
Boeing 777 came from separatist rebel territory. However, Malaysian Prime Minister Mahathir bin
Mohamad denounced the charges brought against the Russian and Ukrainian nationals indicted in
the NATO-led investigation, dismissing the entire probe as a politically motivated effort
predetermined to scapegoat Moscow and exclude Malaysian participation in the inquiry from the
very beginning. Mohamad is featured in the excellent documentaryMH17: Call for Justice
made by a team of independent journalists which contests the NATO-scripted narrative and
reveals that the Buk missile was more likely launched from Ukrainian Army-controlled territory
than the DPR. One of Kolomoisky's hired guns could also have been responsible.
Shamefully, Iran's admission of guilt in the PS752 downing is already being used by
establishment propagandists to discredit skeptics and conflated with similar contested past
events like MH17 in order to intimidate dissenting voices from speaking up in the future. The
Bellingcat 'investigative journalism' collective which made its name incriminating Moscow for
the MH17 tragedy are the principle offenders. Bellingcat bills itself as an 'independent'
citizen journalism group even though its founder Eliot Higgins is employed by the Atlantic
Council think tank which receives funding from NATO, the U.S. State Department, the National
Endowment for Democracy (NED), George Soros' Open Society Foundation NGO, and numerous other
regime change factories. Despite its enormous conflict of interest, Bellingcat remains highly
cited by corporate media as a supposedly reputable source. At the outset, nearly everything
about the PS752 tragedy gave one déjà vu of the MH17 disaster, including the rush
to judgement by Western governments, so it was only natural for many to distrust the official
narrative until more facts came out.
None of this changes that the use of commercial passenger jets as false flag targets for
U.S. national security subterfuge is a verifiable historical fact, not a 'conspiracy theory.'
In 1997, the U.S. National Archives declassified a 1962 memo proposed by the Joint
Chiefs of Staff and Department of Defense for then-Secretary of State Robert McNamara entitled
" Justification for U.S. Military Intervention in Cuba ." The document outlined a series
of 'false flag' terrorist attacks, codenamed Operation Northwoods, to be carried out on a range
of targets and blamed on the Cuban government to give grounds for an invasion of Havana in
order to depose Fidel Castro. These scenarios included targets within the U.S., in particular
Miami, Florida, which had become a haven of right-wing émigrés and defectors
following the Cuban Revolution. In addition to the sinking of a Cuban refugee boat, one
Northwoods plan included the staging of attacks on a civilian jet airliner and a U.S. Air Force
plane to be pinned on Castro's government:
"8. It is possible to create and incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban
aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner enroute from the United States
to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama or Venezuela. The destination would be chosen only to cause the
flight plan route to cross Cuba. The passengers could be a group of college students off on a
holiday or any grouping of persons with a common interest to support chartering a
non-scheduled flight.
9. It is possible to create an incident which will make it appear that Communist Cuban
MIGs have destroyed a USAF aircraft over international waters in an unprovoked attack."
Although Operation Northwoods was rejected by then-U.S. President John F. Kennedy which many
believe was a factor in his subsequent assassination, Cuban exiles with the support of U.S.
intelligence would later be implicated in such an attack the following decade with the bombing
of Cubana Airlines Flight 455 in 1976 which killed all 73 passengers and crew on board. In
2005, documents released by the
National Security Archive showed that the CIA under then-director George H.W. Bush had advanced
knowledge of the plans of a Dominican Republic-based Cuban exile terrorist organization, the
Coordination of United Revolutionary Organizations (CORU), at the direction of former CIA
operative Luis Posada Carriles to blow up the airliner. The U.S. later refused to extradite
Carriles to Cuba to face charges and although he never admitted to masterminding the bombing of
the jet, he publicly confessed to other attacks on tourist hotels in Cuba during the 1990s and
was later arrested in 2000 for attempting to blow up an auditorium in Panama trying to
assassinate Castro.
In 1962, the planners of Operation Northwoods concluded that such deceptive operations would
shift U.S. public opinion unanimously against Cuba.
"World opinion and the United Nations forum should be favorably affected by developing the
international image of Cuban government as rash and irresponsible, and as an alarming and
unpredictable threat to the peace of the Western Hemisphere."
The same talking points are used by the U.S. government to demonize Iran today. Initially,
some Western intelligence sources also
concluded that it was a malfunction or overheated engine that brought PS752 down in
corroboration with the Iranian government's original explanation until the narrative abruptly
shifted the following day. That they were so quick to hold Iran accountable without any
investigation gave the apparent likelihood that PS752 could have fallen prey to a
Northwoods-style false flag operation designed to further isolate Iran and defame its leaders
after they took precautions to avoid U.S. casualties in their retaliatory strikes for the
killing of Soleimani. Maintaining the image of Iran as a nefarious regime is crucial in
justifying hawkish U.S. policies toward the country and Iran's noted restraint in its
retaliation put a dent in that impression, so many were suspicious and rightly so.
It was also entirely plausible that U.S. special operations planners could have consulted
the Northwoods playbook replacing Cuba with Iran and the right-wing gusanos who were to assist
the staged attacks in Miami with the Iranian opposition group known as Mujahedin e-Khalq
(MEK/People's Mujahedin of Iran) to do the same in Tehran. In July of last year, Trump's
personal lawyer and former New York City Mayor Rudolph Giuliani gave a paid speech at the
cult-like group's compound in Albania where he not only referred to the group as Iran's
"government-in-exile" but stated
the U.S's explicit intentions to use them for regime change in Iran. The MEK enjoys high level
contacts in the Trump administration and the group was elated at his decision to murder
Soleimani in Baghdad.
From 1997 until 2012, the MEK was on the State Department's list of terrorist organizations
until it was removed by the Obama administration after its expulsion from Iraq in order to
relocate the group to fortified bases in Albania and the NATO protectorate of Kosovo. The
latter disputed territory is a perfect fit for the rebranded group having been founded by
another deregistered foreign terrorist organization, the al-Qaeda linked Kosovo Liberation Army
(KLA), whose leader, Hashim Thaçi, presides over the partially-recognized state. The MEK
are no longer designated as such despite the State Department's own account of its
bloody history:
"During the 1970s, the MEK staged terrorist attacks inside Iran to destabilize and
embarrass the Shah's regime; the group killed several US military personnel and civilians
working on defense projects in Tehran. The group also supported the takeover in 1979 of the
US Embassy in Tehran. In April 1992 the MEK carried out attacks on Iranian embassies in 13
different countries, demonstrating the group's ability to mount large-scale operations
overseas."
Declassified documents revealing the sinister plans in Operation Northwoods which shockingly
made it all the way to the desk of the president of the United States and the foreknowledge of
Cubana Airlines Flight 455 are just two examples of solid proof that false flag attacks against
civilian passenger planes are a part of the Pentagon's modus operandi as disclosed in its own
archives and there is no reason to believe that such practices have been discontinued. That the
U.S. is still cozy with "former" terror groups like MEK seeking to repatriate is good reason to
believe its use of militant exiles for covert operations like those from Havana has not been
retired. If there were jumps to conclusions that proven serial liars could be looking for an
excuse to stage an attack to lay the blame on Iran, it is only because the distinct probability
was overwhelming. Even so, a stopped clock strikes the right time twice per day and that is
all Iran's acknowledgment of its liability proves -- that even the world's most
unreliable and criminal sources in Washington and Langley can be accurate sometimes
What no one is mentioning is: the US airstrikes on Iraqi military bases, and Soleimani's
murder contributed greatly to the hair trigger response of Iran's air defense forces. If
Washington did not turn the heat up on both Iraq and Iran there would have been no need for
Iran's retaliation, and thus the level of Iran's domestic defense forces would not have been
so nervous as to pull the trigger downing the airliner.
But, if's a huge word.
Israel has had control of Iran's Russian middle systems for years. Russia gave them the
codes.
I think Israel blew up the aircraft. I can't find a link but I heard a huge number of
Soleimani loyalists were arrested in Iran. Someone should have a link to that from Twitter or
somewhere.
I think that there was some kind of collaboration between Khamenei, Israel and the US to
remove Soleimani who had designs on a coup.
I don't know if this is a good or bad thing.
I also don't know who was on that plane. So it's unclear if it was good or bad it was
destroyed. Who knows who those 176 dual Iranian Nationals were.
I just know that if Israel had control of those missile units and it would embarrass Iran
for that to be revealed it makes sense for Iran to claim the lesser of two deep shames.
Particularly if there has been some kind of tacit acceptance of a status as a vassal state
to either the US or Israel behind the scenes to preserve the regime.
Perhaps the MEK or a different vassal ruler who is really crypto Jewish will be appointed
in Solemeinis place, and Iran will hence offer a symbolic enemy to justify the continuation
of the military industrial complex in both Israel and the US.
Even a blind squirrel, even a broken clock twice a day.. The Empire's statements and blind
accusations could have been for any tragedy in a country they were psyopsing, only a matter
of chance for them to be right at some time. In any case, it wasn't intentional on Iran's
part.
Only if accidental means a joint Russian/Iranian hit on a Ukrainian plane carrying fleeing
cia/mossad agents.
This whole situation has once again displayed how easy it is for the zio-media to control
what we see and hear and believe. Disturbingly, that means that things like metoo and
"believe all women" are operations too.
@the grand wazoo I wouldn't be surprised it the FDR shows that the plane strayed off its
registered Flightpath and was involved in a covert recon mission that went bad.
It reminds me too much of MH-17, which was not hit with a BUK but with bullets. Iran should have closed its airspace
because such tricks are to be expected, irrespective of the cause of the current accident. There is no immediate reason
for Iranians to fly to Ukraine, or anywhere else. It may sound silly but flying is still a special and dangerous thing and
should not be taken for granted.
For someone who doesn't watch television or read Iranian newspapers it was only reported
on Twitter and then repeated by PressTV and others on internet. Which parts of the story are
real?
Of course, it was a huge and most regrettable mistake. Doubtless, the Iranians will
compensate the victims for what that is worth. Most of the passengers were Iranians. I
suspect that many of the "Canadians" Trudeau is on about are of Iranian descent. They would
certainly be considered to be Iranians in Iran.
The series of coincidences highlighted in this article are remarkable. It has
synchronicity splashed all over it.
I worked at Tehran airport for some years prior to the Revolution. After the Revolution, I
volunteered to return on behalf of Raytheon (of all companies) to get some money owing. No
one else was prepared to go there. Iran Air personnel were delighted to meet me again and
they promptly paid the bill. I took a holiday to the Caspian with my ex-girlfriend.
A further piece of synchronicity is that I am currently visiting Kiev. The world is a
truly incestuous place.
Set aside the beatup of two operations that neither the CIA or any American agency carried
out the author has apparently failed to see the obvious. That is that the Iranians had no
possibility of covering up the missile strike. Or did he imagine that everyone who might tell
the truth could be kept permanently separated from plane parts and bodies which would have
shown unmistakeable and undeniable evidences of the strike.
Another leak (ukr) from the
Ukrainian side of the investigation gives some hints on how the plane came down (machine
translation):
"We took up the restoration of fragments of the aircraft. It was necessary to determine how
these pieces of metal dumped into a huge pile should be interconnected.
The intrigue remained until late. The fact is that there were no damages on most parts of
the aircraft. There was no explosion and no fire in the engines or on the wings. It is
possible that the plane could fall almost intact. Unlike the remains of the Boeing MN-17,
there were no immediately visible signs of defeat by combat elements on the fuselage and
wings. A lot of damage to the case is the result of a fall. But after laying out all the
fragments of the aircraft, it became obvious that the bottom of the cockpit was missing.
Among the wreckage, fragments of the upper part of the cabin were identified. And then the
find finally took place - at about 22 hours. On a fragment of the cockpit, we found holes in
the damaging elements of the warhead of the rocket, which pierced the skin. We found! For the
first time, direct evidence appeared in this case, which made it possible to prove what
caused the death of the aircraft. For us it was a turning point.
So what we now understand:
Russian anti-aircraft missile "Tor" hit the liner in the lower part of the front of the
fuselage, directly under the cockpit.
A direct hit and the cabin flared up inside. Instantly turned off the transponder of the
aircraft, which gives signals about the flight. Instantly lost contact.
While there is no data, one or two missiles have caused such damage. It is possible that
the second missile also hit the fuselage from below close to the first. But all this remains
to be clarified.
We continue to lay out fragments of the aircraft until the complete collection of all
surviving parts.
We expect that today we will gain access to all objective control data.
In cooperation with Iranian colleagues, we get the impression that those who contact us
sincerely want to help themselves and figure it out, in general, there are no problems. Let's
hope that such a mood and working contacts remain with us now."
They really are able to turn white into black and black into white.
Notable quotes:
"... 1) Occurs as Iran is on brink of war with USA?; 2) Indications of USA using info war tactics; 3) airliner owner by Kolomoisky? 4) No communication with tower? 5) USA and Israel history of duplicity and narrative management (example: MH-17). ..."
"... NATO has weaponized aircraft accident investigations. Lawfare in combination with state terrorism. ..."
"... The Ukies know how to obliterate a debris field. MH-17 -- They used artillery for months to keep OSCE and Dutch officials away, and despite the locals working to protect the deceased and the debris, body parts have been found years later. ..."
There were also clear sightings of a missile to bring down TWA 800. Except it didn't. As an
Navy Pilot , flight instructor and 737 captain this does not at 1st or 2nd glance appear to
be a missile strike. Catastropic engine failure is my bet. They made most of the turn back to
the airport before losing integrity or loss of thrust.
On Wednesday, Boeing's shares plummeted by 2.3 percent ($3.4bn) after the Ukrainian Boeing
737-800 aircraft crashed in Tehran due to encountering a technical glitch.
On Thursday, the stock rose by 3 percent after unnamed Pentagon officials claimed that
the Ukrainian passenger plane was most likely brought down by anti-aircraft missiles, and
US President Donald Trump implicitly supported the claim. This has been read by analysists
as an attempt to manipulate the stock market; a measure that would both overshadow Trump's
failure in Iraq and save Boeing from bankruptcy.
I didn't find the article on TASS. Maybe it was in its Russian version, or in its
TV/Radio/Podcast version.
I don't discard a terrorist attack from the inside, or sabotage of the plane by the
Ukrainian government. What I think is missile attack can be pretty much discarded: the
evidence the Iranians already have through their air control data discard any possibility, by
sheer logic alone, that that was the case.
Unless, of course, the Iranians are lying. But then there isn't any cui bono for Iran to
lie about it (if it was a mistake they wanted to cover, they could blame a random independent
militia so as to give plausible deniability) with the technical malfunction argument, and now
Russia's foreign minister Ryabkov is on the boat with it - so I don't see the cui bono for
Russia either.
Perseus wore a magic cap so that the monsters he hunted down might not see him. Some of
you choose to draw the magic cap down over your eyes and ears so as to make-believe that
there are no monsters in Iran.
"Some of you choose to draw the magic cap down over your eyes and ears so as to
make-believe that there are no monsters in Iran."
No, it is a lot easier than that.
Most of us dont get paid to post bs about the imperial enemies like you, and most off us
still know how to use our brain.
That is it, nothing more nothing less.
[email protected] - What do you make of the loss of ADS-B? Could a catastrophic engine failure take out
both power buses? The ADS-B transceiver? I know a the turbine blades turn into little missile
blades when they decide to leave the engine, but I have no idea of the way power is
transferred when either bus or the standby goes down. I assume automatic? Are the transfer
switches anywhere near the engines? Does the APU automatically fire up? I assume the ADS-B
box is in the electronics bay, but where is the antenna?
Thanks b! As I commented towards the end of the previous thread on this topic, the mundane
evidence has already been shown. IMO, if a missile or bomb was employed, the Iranians would
be yelling louder than anyone and the denials would be coming from BigLie Media instead of
accusations. And as I answered psychohistorian, the massive coverage by BigLie media serves
as narrative distraction from what's being obfuscated--casualties taken by Outlaw US Empire
troops and the BDA presented by Iranian Military.
In that regard, The
Saker's update sticks to the important facts of the now escalated ongoing war between
Iran and the Evil Empire.
Sorry, but there's good reasons to suspect foul play - as I and others have explained on the
last thread.
1) Occurs as Iran is on brink of war with USA?; 2) Indications of USA using info war
tactics; 3) airliner owner by Kolomoisky? 4) No communication with tower? 5) USA and Israel
history of duplicity and narrative management (example: MH-17).
<> <> <> <>
Also: IMO it's dangerous for Iran to invite experts from a group of Western countries.
What is likely to happen is that all the Western experts will be pressure to disagree with
Iran's findings. CIA knows that people will believe the "group of experts!" over Iran.
I don't know how anal Iran is about keeping track of ordinance but they must be pretty
certain as to whether they downed the plane or not! Looks like they are being transparent and
open. If they come out of this proving engine failure or something else then this could be a
great pr coup.
There would be a lot of egg on many faces trying to explain how the intelligence is wrong yet
again. I look forward to watching trudeau walk that back. Hopefully!
One explanation is the Boeing was used as a human shield, a military plane hides behind a
slow moving plane when detected. The ukrainians did it with the MH17 and the israeli with the
russian plane and tried it with the attack on damascus. In both cases there was a lot of
dis-info and blaming right away. But the iranian would have known what the target was, and
mentioned it, so very unlikely.
Another question is the possibility a smaller missile only damaged the plane, also very
unlikely.
Head of Iran Civil Aviation Organization Ali Abedzadeh exaggerates: "From a scientific
viewpoint, it is impossible that a missile hit the Ukrainian plane."
"We can say that the airplane, considering the kind of the crash and the pilot's efforts to
return it to Imam Khomeini airport, didn't explode in the air. So, the allegation that it was
hit by missiles is totally ruled out," the official noted.
Dude, when you're in Wyoming and see critter tracks down by the creek, you would assume it
was Martians rather than antelope? Get real. The Ukie blew a crappy GE engine...they have
this characteristic...
Stay real, use Occam's Razor + physical evidence. Otherwise it's distraction and
TBS...
Craig Murray has been tracking a propagandist Wikipedia editor called "Philip Cross", here
is the main article, but there are others on his site The Philip Cross
Affair
ICAO is in contact with the States involved and will assist them if called upon. Its
leadership is stressing the importance of avoiding speculation into the cause of the tragedy
pending the outcomes of the investigation ...
ICAO may be a worthy organization (some staff changes seem to be warranted), but isn't it
a bit too much?! If this is a sincere wish of democratically elected heads of democratic
nations that they want to form a harmonious chorus and speculate, then no mundane power can
stop them. BTW, what is wrong with Zelensky that he did not join? PTSD after the brutal
telephonies calls? I would add it to the list of proven damages to the security of those
several states that will be debated in the Senate. [end of snark, "several states" is the
entity named in the so-called Constitution of The United States of America].
The flight originated in Teheran, bound for Kiev, but where was it before it arrived in Iran?
It could have been sabotaged anywhere; then easy, right, to set off an onboard bomb by remote
control from the ground? I'm sure Iran is crawling with Mosssad/MI6/CIA spooks.
So you turn a blind eye to atrocities committed by other countries or peoples because the
US government is responsible for the most? Did you even complete your high school education
with that sort of reasoning? I never absolved the US or any other country. Simpletons like
you seem to live in a black and white world in which one side must be chosen over the other.
I feel unfortunate for b or anyone else who frequents this blog who does not view the world
in such a profoundly problematic way.
I am far more informed about Iranian politics, history, culture and religion than most
people here. Please don't allow your hate for the USA, well justified, to cloud your
judgment.
NATO has weaponized aircraft accident investigations. Lawfare in combination with state
terrorism.
It's time for new rules and regulations. ICAO Annex 13 was drafted in different times. A
rule based order is ancient history.
People should be able to chose their destination, route and carrier based on personal
preferences like price and comfort, not on factors like the latest or next conflict zone,
corruption in the countries along the route, military and political adventurism, etc.
- As said before: I didn't believe for one second that that ukrainian plane was shot down. It
would have given the US simply another stick to beat up the iranian government. I assume the
iranians are smart enough to know that. They simply don't want to escalate the situation
more. Although Iran has now the "moral high ground" it is still (very) vulnerable in a number
of ways.
- I think the ukrainian tourists were small traders. I.e. buy stuff e.g. clothing and other
"merchandise" in Teheran, bring it into the Ukraine and then sell that "merchandise" in
Ukraine with a (big) profit.
We have a distinguished professor in our midst! Quite unlike the lowly regular
professors or inconsequential adjunct instructors that normally grace these pages. Let me
kick back and get a tan from the brilliance pouring out of this one! Us high latitude types
have to get our Vitamin D wherever we can.
As for my lack of criticism of Iran's government, that's the business of the Iranian
people and none of my own. The Evil Empire attacking Iran? That, unfortunately, is everyone's
business whether they want it to be or not.
Why is it that these wise guys from the West (Americans mostly) feel it is their duty to
criticize everyone else's governments and cultures when the examples they are setting
themselves are so appallingly bad? Maybe these distinguished critics of other peoples'
ways of life feel that it is easier to fix those other peoples' societies than it is to fix
their own. After all, they apparently feel that fixing other countries just requires some
number of bombs, while fixing their own country... where do they even start? How do you fix
perfection?
I'd be curious to know whether the flight crew on board Flight PS752 had had sufficient rest.
Three hours of resting do not seem like sufficient time but that depends on the journey the
plane made to Tehran, the duration of that journey and where it started. Was the plane also
checked for signs of wear and tear during the three-hour-plus pause?
Are UIA's owners (among them Ihor Kolomoisky) working their employees and hardware assets
too hard and too cheaply as well?
Yes. I think so too. Looks like the engine ran at reduced thrust as they turned, and then
failed entirely at below minimum control speed, with the expected result, asymmetrical stall,
yaw, roll, bang.
There are pictures of severe erosion of what looks like compressor wheel from, presumably,
ingestion of foreign material. Crap on the runway probably, and pencil-whipped maintenance, I
should imagine.
[email protected] - Kiev is Ukrainian Airlines main hub. The 737 arrived from Kiev earlier that
morning and was returning there.
[email protected] - No reason to do anything but a cursory safety check at Tehran. The airline's
mechanics are in Kiev - anything beyond a normal pre-flight check involving maintenance would
be done there, not Tehran. I doubt the crew was rested. That's not how UAI rolls on it's hub
round-trips.
UAI is also bleeding money like crazy. They're nearly bankrupt and stole the money they
collect from passengers for the Ukraine Civil Aviation Authority fees. Tens of millions USD.
The new CEO promises to fix everything somehow. I guess by overworking crews, skipping
maintenance and crappy service. Those are always money-savers for cheap, poorly-run airlines
(prior to bankruptcy). Too bad. Supposedly it wasn't that bad of an airline when they first
added passenger service to their existing cargo ops a decade ago, but has been going downhill
ever since.
"Some real gems you got following your blog b." So why are you here?
Ocams razor... bookies odds... planes fall out o the sky from time to time for all sorts of
reasons not related to malicious activity. What are the odds of this occurring in Iran
shortly after an Iran strike on a US base.
The US has and does use terrorist tactics such as shooting down passenger jets. Trump
threatened Iran with retribution against cultural sites and so forth (terrorist actions).
Fifty two targets of fifty two ways of getting back at Iran.
What are the odds US would down a passenger jet in Iran within hours of Iran's strike against
their base.
I have to go with US terrorist actions for that one. Similar to the protests in Iraq. The
people had genuine grievances as do all good color revolutions but the were just too
advantageous for the US for it not to be a made in the US color revolution style protest. We
now know from the Iraq PM that is exactly what it was.
The odds are unrelated unless there's agency. No agency has been credibly proposed. You know
this is so, as the probability maths in se have been discussed previously @ MoA.
But of course, the US does murder all over the place, so if there is agency, then I tend
to agree with the idea that "they" or their cohort in zionishland may be causative. What are
the "odds" that the engine shown has severe blade erosion? Again 100% . Engine swallows scrap
off the tarmac...a dependent relation, drop junk in engine, blades damaged, run at 100%, 100%
"chance" of engine failure.
Repeating the essence of the matter of odds>
"Two events are independent, statistically independent, or stochastically independent if
the occurrence of one does not affect the probability of occurrence of the other
(equivalently, does not affect the odds). Similarly, two random variables are independent if
the realization of one does not affect the probability distribution of the other."
ie without a dependent relationship the odds are whatever the odds are for engine failure
and crash. And the other odds don't exist, because those events, the shooting, was not random
or accidental. The odds of Iran firing rockets in reprisal was dependent on the US attacks,
ie 100%
But if you're building engines at GE, or obsolete defective airplanes in Seattle, then of
course the odds are that you devoutly wish it was a rocket up the tailpipe... Pay-day's come
Friday, and all of that...
I know NYT is a sham, and believe me I held my intellectual nose as I went into its site.
It's not somewhere I frequent at all.
I did think about the point you made too, but there are 2 issues:
1) In the other 2 videos we see the plane as it's already burning, we don't see it in its
"before" state. For me it's reasonable to imagine the hit on the impact caused some initial
burning which was extinguished due to wind, and then started back up again a few moments
after the NYT video ended and before the other 2 videos began.
2) If the NYT video is indeed doctored (and for me it would be a pretty convincing
doctor), why wouldn't the creator simply keep the light going until the end of the vid?
Iran will announce the cause of the Ukrainian Boeing 737 crash after the accident
investigation commission meeting on Saturday, the Fars News agency reported on Thursday,
citing a source familiar with the matter.
"Tomorrow, after the meeting of the civil aviation accident investigation
commission, the cause of the crash of the Ukrainian passenger plane will be announced", the
source said.
Domestic and foreign parties, whose citizens died in the crash, will take part in the
Saturday meeting, the outlet added. They will announce the reason for the accident after
reviewing the preliminary report.
[.]Foreign Minister Vadym Prystaiko asked that the media not spread "unconfirmed"
information on Friday, pleading with reporters to "reduce the level of speculation" while
the probe continues. The experts are still analyzing evidence, looking at the bodies of the
victims and the wreckage in hope of gaining insight into what took down Ukraine
International Airlines Flight PS752, killing all 176 people on board.[,]
If no one had engaged with nine-drongos the thread would not have been disrupted and perhaps
a useful dialog about the plane crash could have ensued. Those who did swallow the hook are
just as guilty the original whatabouter of making this thread useless - good job. I would say
exercise some discipline but that would be a waste of breath given the insecurities about
their beliefs too many here apparently have. Letting some arsehole spout uninterrupted is a
better indication of your point of view than anger, hysteria or ad hominem. Your stupidity
has caused a thread to fail.
The Ukies know how to obliterate a debris field. MH-17 -- They used artillery for months to
keep OSCE and Dutch officials away, and despite the locals working to protect the deceased
and the debris, body parts have been found years later.
#57 posted by Poor Ramin Mazaheri who works for Press TV and has had many articles published
on The Saker. He would describe the Iranian economy as socialist with Iranian charters. The
link to the article below is an excellent source for information on Iran's economy.
What comes as a surprise to me is ICAO seems to have some integrity. It seems the US and
friends haven't completely taken it over.
You can judge someone by their friends. NATO and the terrorists in Idlib have backed the
killing of Soleimani. Who seems to enjoy killing civilians? The US just droned killed 60
civilians in Afghanistan. Information provided by the Iraqi prime minister showed the US is
willing to use snipers and paid protesters to tear Iraq apart. They utterly destroyed Mosul
and Raqqa without regard for civilians. The Syrian government has tried to avoid civilian
deaths, which is why those who want to cause chaos in the region always accuses them of
targeting civilians. So the US would have no problem getting MEK to or some other group to
shoot the plane down but I'm leaning against that scenario.
The US has been planning to control oil for a long time. In 1975 a feasibility study was
prepared for the Special Subcommittee on Investigations of the Committee on International
Relations on "Oil fields as military objectives", better described as bringing Democracy to
the Middle East. Well, they did that sorta in Iraq, and now the Iraq government has politely
asked the US to leave and the Iranians have demonstrated to them why they should leave. I'm
not sure if the Ukrainian plane crashing is the next move the US has made in this great game,
but I would put my money on shoddy management of the Ukrainian plane. Why not, the country is
barely functioning. I doubt the plane was hit with a missle. More likely the US can't pass up
an opportunity for stirring trouble and the MSM has no problem memory holing another lie.
Jen Flight PS752 passenger
list shows that the huge majority of passengers carrying Iranian, Canadian and EU passports
were Iranian.
These people were most likely visiting relatives in Iran over Christmas / New Year and were
returning home. They were using UIA because the airline offers cheap flights between North
America, Europe and western Asia with Kiev as a stop-over. Most of these people would have got
off in Kiev and flown back to their home countries on other connecting flights.
Also as far as I know, the plane crashed not long after take-off. That, er, might suggest a
problem with the plane itself. But the Boeing plane is not of the same model as the two Boeing
737 MAX 8 planes that crashed in Indonesia in 2018 and Ethiopia in 2019.
Incidentally there is a new documentary "MH-17: In Search of Truth"
doing the rounds of online alternative news media. The fellow who made the documentary, Vasily
Prozorov, is a former SBU security officer. It makes an interesting claim about the involvement
of Western intelligence agencies and the SBU in creating and carrying out an incident and
distraction, and in controlling and shaping the narrative and the disinformation.
I'm now starting to wonder if there may be a link between the MH17 shoot-down and the
Skripal poisoning incident in March 2018. 3 -1 Reply Jan 9, 2020 9:42 PM
richard le sarc ,
No visual sighting of missile tracks, I see, and the video of the explosion then crash does
not appear to show any. Details, mere details-the presstitute vermin are in full vilification
propaganda mode already.
richard le sarc ,
I'm sorry-Iran ' refuses to hand over the black boxes'???!! To whom? To Bibi Nuttyyahoo,
perhaps? Iran leads the investigation, so they decipher the 'black boxes'. The case of MH17
where the black box information has simply disappeared, tells you what you could expect if
the West ever got their hands on these.
Never mind 9/11 where any blackbox data was most likely fabricated like the planes
themselves.
Yonatan ,
Iran is apparently refusing to hand over the black boxes from the crashed plane.
should be
Under ICAO rules, Iran has no obliation to pass on the black boxes from the crashed plane
to the maker. All it need do is pass them on to any laboratory of its chosing that has ICAO
certification.
Eyewitnesses saw one engine on fire before the crash, the plane still on a glide, but the
737-800 can fly on one engine, others have done so and landed safely.
This leads one to believe this was not a simple "engine on fire" situation.
If indeed it was a shoot-down, it was far enough away from the security-protected area of
the airport, but not so high that a simple manpad-type weapon would be ruled out.
Another option is a small bomb placed in an engine cowl, which could be activated by
altitude sensing or remote control (the plane wasn't very high, and the probable flight path
well known). Big enough device to damage the engine and start a fire and maybe knock out the
shut-off and fire suppression systems, but not big enough to be obvious. The engine fails,
spits out turbine blades which damage the wing and puncture fuel tanks, damage the avionics
for the whole plane. Rotor speeds will be in the multiple-10,000s RPM, so a LOT of kinetic
energy when these things come apart.
Cui bono? The obvious answer is the Deep State Zionists in Israel and the US, so this may
have been a Mossad operation, with or without the knowledge of the CIA or US military.
The fact Trumpty Dumbdy is playing the "deescalation card" so strongly could indicate he
didn't authorize it and hopes to stop Nuttyyahoo/Mossad from frog-marching him into a war
that would lose him the next election for being a flip-flopper on his last election "end the
endless proxy wars" rhetoric.
"By deception shall you do war"... the Mossad mission statement.
If US officials claim they are "confident", that actually means they don't have a shred of
evidence. Intelligence lingo.
It's too early to call but POTUS claims Iran shot down the Ukrainian 737 near Tehran. On
CBS fake News they suggest that the US have satellite imagery showing two SAM launches right
before the crash.
Almost six years down the road we are still waiting for the MH17 satellite imagery that
exist according to John Kerry. He was lying or the images and the narrative don't match.
Hint: the second option.
To prevent crashing airliners, PSYOPS, sanctions, fake trials etc. steer well clear of the
Ukraine, Ukrainians, Ukrainian airspace, the Ukrainian army, Ukrainian missiles and Ukrainian
planes. You don't want to touch the Ukraine, not even with a very long stick.
We can be confident (in the normal sense of the word) that Bellingcat will be involved.
Those NATO sponsored citizen propagandist will spend countless hours doctoring "evidence" and
spinning neocon lies to their heart's content.
It must have been a Russian BUK that was driven on the back of a trailer by Putin's niece
all the way from Kursk to Tehran, a direct order from the Kremlin!
In Turkey the trailer almost overran Bana Alabed and evil Assad provided some Novichok
along the way to coat the throttles of the 737 in case the missile wouldn't hit its intended
target. Boeing 737's don't fall from the sky on their own.
A fact finding mission from the OPCW has left The Hague for Tehran, they might even find
some cannisters containing chlorine in the wreckage. It looks like they dropped from the air,
they were not placed there manually.
The Dutch Safety Board is 100% independent from NATO influence and could conduct the
accident investigation in an impartial way. No conflict of interest whatsoever.
The Ukraine will be part of the Joint Investigation Team that does the criminal
investigation and to assure everything will be done according to law they will even get a
veto right over the investigation.
Iran can be confident that justice will be served.
The Ukraine wants to do the 737 accident investigation. Why? To delegate it to the Dutch, get
Bellingcat involved and blame it on Russia?
I am sure Bellingcat will find some shitty video online of a Russian Buk that backed up
all the way from Kursk to Tehran without nobody else noticing it. Putin's niece was driving
it by direct order from the Kremlin!
Mike Pence will blame Iran for MH17 and Iraq will be sanctioned for it. Don't you just love the rule based order?
Ukraine is now a pawn in a big geopolitical game against Russia. Which somehow survived 90th when everybody including myself has
written it off.
That's why the USA, EU (Germany) and Russia pulling the country in different directions. But the victory of Ukrainian nationalists
is not surprising and is not solely based on the US interferences (although the USA did lot in this direction) pursuit its geopolitical
game against Russia. Distancing themselves from Russa is a universal trend in Post-Soviet space. And it often takes ugly forms.
So Ukraine in not an exception here. It is part of the "rule". Essentially the dissolution of the USSR revised the result on WWII.
And while the author correctly calls Ukrainian leader US stooges, they moved in this direction because they feel that it is necessary
for maintaining the independence. In other words anti-Russian stance is considered by the Ukrainian elite as a a pre-condition for mainlining
independence. Otherwise people like Parubiy would be in jail very soon. They are tolerated and even promoted because they are useful.
It repeats the story of Baltic Republics, albeit with a significant time delay. There should be some social group that secure independence
of the country and Ukrainian nationalists happen to be such a group. That's why Yanukovich supported them and Svoboda party (with predictable
results).
Notable quotes:
"... The ideological fissures that are growing in the United States are beginning to resemble the warring camps that characterize the Ukrainian political world. The divide in Ukraine pits groups who are described as "right wing" and many are ideological descendants of real Nazis and Nazi sympathizers against groups with a strong affinity to Russia. This kind of gap cannot be bridged through conventional negotiations. ..."
"... Jump ahead now to the April 2014 "uprising" of anti-Russian forces in the Ukraine (Maidan 2). The US was firmly on the side of the protesters, who ultimately succeeded in ousting the elected President. And who were helping lead this effort? ..."
"... The US support, both overt and covert, for Ukrainian politicians is grounded in an anti-Soviet (now anti-Russian) ideology. We have convinced ourselves that Russia is hell bent on world domination. Therefore we must do whatever is necessary to stop Russia, which includes uncritical, blind support for elements in Ukraine that also detest the Russians. But in doing so we have closed our eyes to the filthy underbelly of the virulent anti-Semitism that lurks in western Ukraine. ..."
"... US meddling in the Ukraine is astonishing in its breadth. It ranges from the fact that the wife of former President Viktor Yuschenko was an American citizen and former senior official in the US State Department. Do you think there would be no complaints if Melania Trump was born in Russia and had served in the Russian Foreign Ministry? Yet, most Americans are happily ignorant of such facts. ..."
"... US interference was not confined to serendipitous relationships, such as the Yushchenko marriage. It also included the open and active funding of certain political groups and media outlets. The US State Department sent money through a variety of outlets. One of these was the Consortium for Elections and Political Process Strengthening aka CEPPS. ..."
"... This is : ..."
"... Count me as one of the people who is outraged by the hypocrisy and stupidity now on display in the United States. I am not talking about Trump. I am referring to the Republicans and Democrats and pundits and media mouthpieces who are fuming about Russian citizens writing on Facebook as one of the worst catastrophes since Pearl Harbor or 9-11. ..."
"... There clearly is meddling going on in America's political landscape. But it isn't the Russian Government. No. There are foreign and domestic forces aligned who are keen on portraying Russia as a threat to world order that must be opposed by more defense spending and tougher sanctions. That is the propaganda that dominates the media in the United States these days. And that is truly dangerous to our nation's safety and freedom. ..."
"... A CIA guy recently said the US only interferes to 'promote democracy' - tell that to Australia, Vietnam, Mexico, Chile, Congo, Russia, Ukraine...it's a long long list. ..."
"... An independent Ukraine was also a project of German foreign policy after the Brest-Litowsk Treaty (the equivalent of the Versailles Treaty, only aimed at Russia) SO I have o wonder how much of the enthusiasm for Vicky Nuland's Israel friendly Nazi state-let (oh what irony!) is a product of Germany wanting to reassert itself in the east, using NATO solidarity as a fig leaf. Maybe they will make Ukraine import a lot o Africans "refugees" so that Soros' project of creating a brown Europe will be advanced in the Slavic sphere as well as the west. ..."
"... The liberal party - who provides the prime-minister - EU leader Hans van Baalen and Belgian ex-prime minister Guy Verhostad held a controversial speech on the Maidan square in support of the protesters that the EU will support them. ..."
"... I wouldn't put to much stress on Bandera having been a bad guy. His enemies were no better. They just won the war and the victors write history. The deeper problem of Ukraine is the fact that in the East of the country (and maybe even the majority of the country) Bandera is indeed regarded as a villain. But in the West he is a hero to this day. Even in Soviet times people from Western Ukraine were regarded as "fascists" by much of the rest of the country. No wonder as there were anti soviet partisans until late in the fifties. ..."
"... "Prorussian" Kutshma turned into a Ukrainian "patriot" (such is the logic of statehood) and the same thing happened with Yanukovich. People forget that he would have signed an association agreement with Europe had Europe not refused because he was insufficiently "democratic". ..."
"... But the West wanted it all. They wanted Ukraine firmly in the "Western" camp. Thereby they ripped the country apart. As a good friend of mine who has studied in Kiev in Soviet times remarked: to ask Ukraine to choose between East and West is like asking a child in divorce proceedings who it liked more: daddy or mummy? ..."
"... A very interesting conversation between Victoria Nulland and ambassador Geoffrey Pyatt, caught at picking the future rulers of liberated Ukraine : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QxZ8t3V_bk This is not meddling. This is a defensive (preemptive?) action against Russian agression. ..."
"... I've never seen such an intense barrage of propaganda before in my life. America is fracturing apart like Ukraine. This is no coincidence. In both countries, oligarchs have seized power, the rule of law abandoned and there is a rush of corruption. ..."
"... What we did to Ukraine is shameful in every way. A remember a video of a pallet of money being unloaded from a USG place at Kiev during Maidan 2. That's in addition to Nuland's bag of cookies. I always thought that one of the objectives of our meddling in Ukraine was to make Sevastopol into a NATO naval base. ..."
"... Our leaders are the biggest hypocrites on the planet. The Ukraine was almost evenly divided between pro-Western and pro-Russian sides. Our government, rather than waiting for an election, assisted an armed rebellion against the elected pro-Russian government. Among the groups our government allied with in this endeavor were out and out Nazis. ..."
The ideological fissures that are growing in the United States are beginning to resemble the warring camps that characterize
the Ukrainian political world. The divide in Ukraine pits groups who are described as "right wing" and many are ideological descendants
of real Nazis and Nazi sympathizers against groups with a strong affinity to Russia. This kind of gap cannot be bridged through conventional
negotiations.
Who is the United States government and media supporting? The Nazis . You think I'm joking. Here are the facts, but we must go
back to World War II
:
When World War II began a large part of western Ukraine welcomed the German soldiers as liberators from the recently enforced
Soviet rule and openly collaborated with the Germans. The Soviet leader, Stalin, imposed policies that caused the deaths of almost
7 million Ukrainians in the 1930s--an era known as the Holomodor).
Ukrainian divisions, regiments and battalions were formed, such as SS Galizien, Nachtigal and Roland, and served under German
leadership. In the first few weeks of the war, more than 80 thousand people from the Galizien region volunteered for the SS Galizien,
which later known for its extreme cruelty towards Polish, Jewish and Russian people on the territory of Ukraine.
Members of these military groups came mostly from the organization of Ukrainian nationalists aka the OUN, which was founded in
1929. It's leader was Stepan Bandera, known then and today for his extreme anti-semitic and anti-communist views.
CIA documents just recently declassified show strong ties between US intelligence and Ukrainian nationalists since 1946.
Jump ahead now to the April 2014 "uprising" of anti-Russian forces in the Ukraine (Maidan 2). The US was firmly on the side
of the protesters, who ultimately succeeded in ousting the elected President.
And who were helping lead
this effort?
Secretary of the Ukrainian National Security and Defence Council is Andriy Parubiy. Parubiy was the founder of the Social National
Party of Ukraine, a fascist party styled on Hitler's Nazis, with membership restricted to ethnic Ukrainians.
The Social National Party would go on to become Svoboda, the far-right nationalist party whose leader,
Oleh Tyahnybok was
one of the three most high profile leaders of the Euromaidan protests. . . .
Overseeing the armed forces alongside Parubiy as the Deputy Secretary of National Security is
Dmytro Yarosh , the leader of the Right
Sector – a group of hardline nationalist streetfighters, who
previously boasted they were ready for
armed struggle to free Ukraine.
The US support, both overt and covert, for Ukrainian politicians is grounded in an anti-Soviet (now anti-Russian) ideology.
We have convinced ourselves that Russia is hell bent on world domination. Therefore we must do whatever is necessary to stop Russia,
which includes uncritical, blind support for elements in Ukraine that also detest the Russians. But in doing so we have closed our
eyes to the filthy underbelly of the virulent anti-Semitism that lurks in western Ukraine.
US meddling in the Ukraine is astonishing in its breadth. It ranges from the fact that the wife of former President Viktor
Yuschenko was an American citizen and former senior official in the US State Department. Do you think there would be no complaints
if Melania Trump was born in Russia and had served in the Russian Foreign Ministry? Yet, most Americans are happily ignorant of such
facts.
But Viktor Yushchenko is not an American who speaks a foreign language. He is very much a Ukrainian nationalist and steeped in
the anti-Semitism that dominates the ideology of western Ukraine. During the final months of his Presidency, Yushchenko made the
following declaration:
In conclusion I would like to say something that is long awaited by the Ukrainian patriots for many years I have signed a decree
for the unbroken spirit and standing for the idea of fighting for independent Ukraine. I declare Stepan Bandera a national hero of
Ukraine.
Without hesitation or shame, Yushchenko endorsed the legacy of Bandera, who had happily aligned with the Nazis in pursuit of his
own nationalist goals. Those goals, however, did not include Jews. And here is the ultimate irony--Bandera was born in Austria, not
the Ukraine. So much for ideological consistency.
US interference was not confined to serendipitous relationships, such as the Yushchenko marriage. It also included the open
and active funding of certain political groups and media outlets. The US State Department sent money through a variety of outlets.
One of these was the Consortium for Elections and Political Process Strengthening aka CEPPS.
This is :
a USAID program with other National Endowment for Democracy-affiliated groups: the National Democratic Institute for International
Affairs, the International Republican Institute and the International Foundation for Electoral Systems. In 2010, the reported disbursement
for CEPPS in Ukraine was nearly $5 million.
The program's efforts are described on the USAID website as providing "training for political party activists and locally elected
officials to improve communication with civic groups and citizens, and the development of NGO-led advocacy campaigns on electoral
and political process issues."
Anyone prepared to argue that it would be okay for Russia, through its Foreign Ministry, to contribute several million dollars
for training party activists in the United States?
What we do not know is how much money was being spent on covert activities directed and managed by the CIA. During the political
upheaval in April 2014 (Maidan 2), there was this news item:
Over the weekend, CIA director John Brennan travelled to Kiev, nobody knows exactly why, but some speculate that he intends to
open US intelligence resources to Ukrainian leaders about real-time Russian military maneuvers. The US has, thus far, refrained from
sharing such knowledge because Moscow is believed to have penetrated much of Ukraine's communications systems – and
Washington isn't about to hand over its surveillance secrets to the
Russians.
Do you think Americans would be outraged if the head of Russia's version of the CIA, the SVR or FSB, traveled quietly to the United
States to meet with Donald Trump prior to his election? I think that would qualify as meddling.
Count me as one of the people who is outraged by the hypocrisy and stupidity now on display in the United States. I am not
talking about Trump. I am referring to the Republicans and Democrats and pundits and media mouthpieces who are fuming about Russian
citizens writing on Facebook as one of the worst catastrophes since Pearl Harbor or 9-11.
There clearly is meddling going on in America's political landscape. But it isn't the Russian Government. No. There are foreign
and domestic forces aligned who are keen on portraying Russia as a threat to world order that must be opposed by more defense spending
and tougher sanctions. That is the propaganda that dominates the media in the United States these days. And that is truly dangerous
to our nation's safety and freedom.
Good post pt.. thanks... i never knew ''the wife of former President Viktor Yushchenko was an American citizen and former senior
official in the US State Department.'' That is informative.. i recall following this closely back in 2014.. the hypocrisy on display
in the usa at present is truly amazing and frightening at the same time.. it appears that the public can be cowed very easily..
On the twitters, you would be accused of "whatabouttism" - which is the crime of excusing Putin's diabolism by pointing out
American interference with the internal politics an elections of other nations. A CIA guy recently said the US only interferes
to 'promote democracy' - tell that to Australia, Vietnam, Mexico, Chile, Congo, Russia, Ukraine...it's a long long list.
An independent Ukraine was also a project of German foreign policy after the Brest-Litowsk Treaty (the equivalent of the
Versailles Treaty, only aimed at Russia) SO I have o wonder how much of the enthusiasm for Vicky Nuland's Israel friendly Nazi
state-let (oh what irony!) is a product of Germany wanting to reassert itself in the east, using NATO solidarity as a fig leaf.
Maybe they will make Ukraine import a lot o Africans "refugees" so that Soros' project of creating a brown Europe will be advanced
in the Slavic sphere as well as the west.
It's not only the US. The EU borg are also meddling. In my country we had a referendum about Ukraine. The population voted "Against"
on the question: "Are you for or against the Approval Act of the Association Agreement between the European Union and Ukraine?"
This was the only referendum that was done since it was implemented in 2015. A second one is being organized on the Intelligence
and Security Services which has controversial parts with regard to access to internet traffic.
This referendum will take place on March 21, 2018 and will probably be voted against because of the controversial elements
(in part because there is still living memory of our Eastern neighbors in the second world war)
These 2 will probably be the last. Our house of representatives have voted yesterday to end the referendum law (with a majority
vote of 76 out of 150 representatives!)
So much for democracy. The reason stated that the referendum was controversial (probably because they voted against the EU
borg). Interesting is that the proposal was done by the party that wanted the referendum as a principal point. This will almost
certainly ensure that the little respect left for traditional parties is gone and they will not be able to get a majority next
elections.
The liberal party - who provides the prime-minister - EU leader
Hans van Baalen and Belgian ex-prime minister Guy
Verhostad held a controversial speech on the Maidan square in support of the protesters that the EU will support them.
I wouldn't put to much stress on Bandera having been a bad guy. His enemies were no better. They just won the war and the
victors write history. The deeper problem of Ukraine is the fact that in the East of the country (and maybe even the majority
of the country) Bandera is indeed regarded as a villain. But in the West he is a hero to this day. Even in Soviet times people
from Western Ukraine were regarded as "fascists" by much of the rest of the country. No wonder as there were anti soviet partisans
until late in the fifties.
Even in the nineties anybody who travelled in Ukraine could feel the tension between East and West. The Russians were certainly
aware of it and mindful not to rip the country apart they cut the Ukrainians an enormous amount of slack. Of course they supported
"their" candidates and shoveled money into their insatiable throats. Only to be disappointed time and again. "Prorussian"
Kutshma turned into a Ukrainian "patriot" (such is the logic of statehood) and the same thing happened with Yanukovich. People
forget that he would have signed an association agreement with Europe had Europe not refused because he was insufficiently "democratic".
Really the West should have been content with things as they were.
But the West wanted it all. They wanted Ukraine firmly in the "Western" camp. Thereby they ripped the country apart. As
a good friend of mine who has studied in Kiev in Soviet times remarked: to ask Ukraine to choose between East and West is like
asking a child in divorce proceedings who it liked more: daddy or mummy?
Really the West (not only the US -the Eu is also guilty) is to blame. It is long past time to get down from the high horse
and stop spreading chaos and mayhem in the name of democracy,
An informative column. The coup & later developments soured me on the MSMedia. I'm an initiate into modern Russian
history: NATO in the Ukraine = WW3!
Some additional history:
A Ukrainian nation did not exist until after WW1; one piece was Russian, another Polish and another Austrian. The Holodomor
is exaggerated for political purposes; the actual number dead from famine appears to be 'only' 2M. It wasn't Soviet bloody mindedness,
it was Soviet agricultural mismanagement; collectivizing agriculture drops production.
They did this right before the great drought of the 1930s - remember the dustbowl. There was a famine in Kazakestan at the
same time; 1.5M died.
The Nazis raised 5 SS divisions out of the Ukraine. As the Germans were pushed back they ran night drops of ordnance into the
Ukraine as long as they could. The Soviets had to carry on divisional level counter insurgency until 1956. After the war, Gehlen,
Nazi intelligence czar, kept himself out of jail by turning over his files, routes & agents to the US. He also stoked anti Soviet
paranoia.
The Brits ended up with a whole Ukr SS division that they didn't want, so they gave it to Canada. Which is why Canada has such
cranky policy around the Ukraine!
A very interesting conversation between Victoria Nulland and ambassador Geoffrey Pyatt, caught at picking the future rulers
of liberated Ukraine : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QxZ8t3V_bk
This is not meddling. This is a defensive (preemptive?) action against Russian agression.
I'm sure you'd like us to ignore Bandera. I bet he liked children and dogs. Just like Hitler. Bandera was a genuine bad
guy. There is no rehabilitating that scourge on society. Nice try though.
I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that your final comment is sarcasm. When you have two senior US Government officials
who will and will not constitute a foreign government, you have gone beyond meddling. It is worse.
The media is hysterical. Today, Putin's Facebook Bot Collaborator contacted the Kremlin before his mercenaries attacked Americans
in Syria.
I've never seen such an intense barrage of propaganda before in my life. America is fracturing apart like Ukraine. This
is no coincidence. In both countries, oligarchs have seized power, the rule of law abandoned and there is a rush of corruption.
A World War is near. The realists are gone. The Moguls are pushing Donald Trump pull the trigger. Either in Syria with an assault
to destroy Hezbollah (Iran) for good or American trainers going over the top of trenches in Donbass in a centennial attack of
the dead.
Hallelujah and jubilation! We're in full agreement on this subject. What we did to Ukraine is shameful in every way. A
remember a video of a pallet of money being unloaded from a USG place at Kiev during Maidan 2. That's in addition to Nuland's
bag of cookies. I always thought that one of the objectives of our meddling in Ukraine was to make Sevastopol into a NATO naval
base.
I would definitely want to see a full account of what support we provided to the nazi thugs of Svoboda and Pravy Sektor. We
have a long history of meddling, at least twice as long as the Soviet Union/Russia. But that does not mean we should stop investigating
the Russian interference in our 2016 election. Just stop hyperventilating over it. It no more deserves risking a war than our
continuing mutual espionage.
Our leaders are the biggest hypocrites on the planet. The Ukraine was almost evenly divided between pro-Western and pro-Russian
sides. Our government, rather than waiting for an election, assisted an armed rebellion against the elected pro-Russian government.
Among the groups our government allied with in this endeavor were out and out Nazis.
As a result of this rebellion, the Russian majority in Crimea overwhelming voted to leave the Ukraine and rejoin Russia, which
they had been part of for over 150-years. While our government continues to provide military aid to Israel, which used force of
arms take over the West Bank, it imposed sanctions against Russia when the people of Crimea voted to join their former countrymen.
Mind boggling.
Journalist Alexander Petrakov in his article he stated that the Russian Federation is a lot
of evidence of innocence Russia and militias DND in the collapse of the Malaysian "Boeing".
"Your problem is that you have lived your whole life if there are rules. But there are no
rules." Lorne Malvo (series "Fargo", 2014)
Intelligence agencies recruit pornographers to lead their disinformation operations,
apparently because porn purveyors are so lacking in ethics they will tell public lies about
anything
Optimists probably should not read any further, as well as those who think that the higher
you sit the better you know. As well as pacifists, all those for thom "peace, friendship, and
chewing gum" has the absolute value, some kind of religion. I can't convince those types for
sure.
So I address this article to those who like me understand that it's time to start to think
independently, be skeptical. And do not absorb blindly what TV talk heads are saying, no matter
in what country you currently live and you nationality.
After the terrible catastrophe Malaysian liner we can see two major hypothesis, two points
of views and two "truth": one is Russian position and the second version promoted by Ukraine
and supported by the USA (or vice versa).
Which one you should believe more? The one that promoted by MSM of G7 countries or one that
is promoted Russian MSM by and some other from the "the rest of the world". The answer, in
fact, already evident. The "world-at-large" typically assumes that the "truth" is the view
represented by CNN, Fox News and Euronews. The one that is written on the pages of The New York
Times and republished by referring to "an unnamed source in the state Department" (or our very
special Jen Psaki) Washington Post.
I personally am confident that most of as see that despite is growing evidence of innocence
of rebels in the terrible tragedy the rest of the world these days and hours sees and hears
another, "alternative" hypothesis only.
"Civilized world" talk about "persuasive evidence" of the guilt of the Russian Federation
and the rebels of Donbass. Of evidence, however, is weak and contradictive. But it does not
matter. If you repeat a lie clearly and firmly, with honest eyes on a brave face of various and
sundry talking heads let's say one thousand times - people will say it's the fact; that it is
the axiom based on which events need to interpreted. This isan all trick but it works. "Why,
everybody knows about it", "all about this and they say".
This basic factor here is the power of PR. It is like artillery in was and as Napoleon noted
God is firmly on the side of those with better artillery. Repetition lead to adoption of
information and gradually a person begins to perceive it as his/her own point of view.
Especially if the same information is provided by the whole spectrum of media outlets - TV,
radio, Internet, and newspapers.
The average American, European, Japanese or Australian are brainwashed and belave that the
rebels robbed the dead people on the aircraft and then cash credit card dead in Russia. While
adding sure that this is "Russian rebels." As these "Russian rebels" learn or pick up in the
open field access codes, passwords to the cards are for some reason forgotten. And why? In a
democratic and free world video information rules and does not require any critical thinking:
many of wisdom is much grief...
In each of the first CNN necessarily adds that "Russia is hampered the investigation", but
it owes "effective and really help Ukraine," and that it "remained days or even hours, to show
good will".
How can "interfere" investigation on foreign territory nobody elaborates. And why...
everything is clear.
Then this phantasmagoria was added to the story of the companies Dutch and Malay over which
bogumiles... and again refrain is "Russian".
From the first day of Maidan in the focus of the world media was not Ukraine, and Russia -
all of us. Saying "Russia", "Russian" we have formed a new image in the eyes of the whole
world". First it was the image of aggressor, now it is the image of criminal, terrorist. Not
only conqueror, but the murderer.
And we are from the last bum up to the first person in the state did not understand, did not
want to understand that our actions, words, "signals" nothing depends on it. Because no matter
what he says and does Putin. It is important that will show and tell CNN.
Imagine that you are playing chess. On the table is a chess Board, the figures are placed in
the proper order. You sit down and make a move, then another. All as it should be. And your
opponent starts to move the pieces in random order. Then do sweeps them away from the Board and
yells at the whole audience that he won, and you're a cheater and a crook, but when you open
your mouth begins to beat you Board on the head.
So even if the Kremlin together wore embroidered shirts and jumped around the flag "right
sector, the world would have seen more. That will show and tell him free and NeroLive media.
That's why I did not believe and do not believe that our "restraint" someone and something to
"keep" and anybody, and I will convince.
We talked about the inhumanity, the horrors of the moods of Nazism in Ukraine elites in the
US and Europe. Told those who everyone knows and understands. And who simply don't care. This
same "Russians" harness, hammer, rape, blow up, shoot... the "Russian barbarians", not
"civilized people".
Maidan created the project "Banderovskiy-oligarachat" in Ukraine" and far right nationists
were allowed to do this by the west and after the victory pumped hatred to Russia to the skies.
To suspteinit they badly need a flase flag operation like MH17 to present Russians as the
monsters.
Unfortunately Russia was caught by this false flag operation with hands down and initially
tired to play by the rules of the normal world. But that faith that the West will dela tih
Russia bases on common rules applicable in notmal world fell a few days ago from a height of 10
km and shattered into many tiny fragments.
Ukraine IMHO originally I wrote about this in March, April, may and not designed it as a
trap. It might be an unfortunate incident due to decrepit state of Ukrainian air defense forces
(but the question why they moved them to this area remain in this case unanswered). But as soon
the shooing happened the plan emerge to blame it on Russia. To present it as an act of genocide
by Russian mercenaries.
But most importantly, it was to become a stage on which the imagies of the wreckage were
used to project the horror and disgust on Russia. They want to punish, to destroy us any cost
and any methods from economic to military.
We tried to convince ourselves of the last already strength (and many still do)that any -
even the most secret of our intervention, give a reason for the aggression against us. As if it
were a "pretext" for example, you cannot create a virtual, on the computer and then show around
the world. Or not to create artificially: blowing up the plane, the train, the city, nuclear
will dance...
Remember, as Secretary Powell was shaking in the UN powder with Siberian ulcer" from Saddam.
"The plague" was then washing powder. The country was bombed to the stage of democracy, and
Powell... apologized sparingly in his memoirs.
Remember about the plots of terrible Serbian concentration camps in 1994, in Srebrenica.
It's people came out in Europe on the streets and demanded to bomb, to punish, to stop. When
the "bombed, punished, stopped, it became clear that terrible place belonged... to Bosnian
Muslims of Izetbegovica, and dying people were just Serb prisoners. At that time anybody
especially did not even apologize.
Finally, remember about the shocking footage of atrocities troops Gaddafi, killing women,
children and the elderly. Already when Gaddafi was executed so that the footage was dashed
against this background, and Libya drowned in real blood, it turned out that all the
"atrocities" were shot in Qatar at a local Studio. Filmed venerable Hollywood Directors "at the
request of the sheikhs".
Why the attack with "Boeing". No, this is not an excuse to enter NATO troops (it different
enough to sign a bilateral agreement on military assistance, and then to show images of the
"Russian occupation of Kyiv"). This is a PR-move, information technology.
In the history blown up with "Boeing" are three possible answers, but the whole world hears
only one - it blew up "Russians" militias and the Russian Federation, we all are responsible
for that. No matter what the investigation has just begun, which is not examined a "black
boxes". Tube Powell is already lying on the table Obama, and the "free media" ready to show
people the terrible Serbian concentration camp".
Russian experts have already talked about all the falsifications. Posted we have trumps,
evidence. Only the world could see and hear more. About "Russian", nadrugalas over the dead and
robbed them. And about the "Russian" the terrorists of Donbass.
The testimony of our experts, Ministers, diplomats referred to as "doubtful" and "require
additional verification". Brad Avakov, screeching Poroshenko and all the hysteria over the
possessed Yatseniuk called "serious" and "convincing" evidence. It's hard, it's really not want
to believe we are living by the rules that don't exist. But it is a reality. And other reality
and never will.
The verdict is still pending, but already discussed future sanctions and made the first
proposal for "punishing Russia". Began policy - real and cynical, as usual.
What will be after the judgment has already announced the verdict?
Kiev junta now at the level of negotiations with heads of state and official requests of the
international organization requires to recognize the militias and their educated patterns -
terrorist network. As soon as the version on the guilt of the rebels is recognized by the
Western countries, LNR and DND declared outside the law from the point of view of the
international law.
Then Ukraine will likely together with one of the permanent members of the UN security
Council (USA, France or the United Kingdom) requests to enter into the conflict zone "blue
helmets of the United Nations, but not for peace, and for "police" transactions - by analogy
with African countries, where the UN staff often help governments to disarm or destroy
terrorist groups. No "cultivation and separation of the parties in such cases is not
performed.
The composition of the police corps, representatives of Russia, as we all understanding,
will not turn on. We now state - sponsor and accomplice of terrorists." As Iran, for
example.
How many will vote for our country - I don't know and guess not want. If you support a
resolution sadly, the South-East will be cleared by the Ukrainian guards and legalized under
the UN flag armies of Western countries. Around the Crimea they will also be created land and
then Maritime cordon.
If you use the right of veto, the world media will announce that we are "proved" his guilt
and continue to cover terrorists and murderers".
Sanctions against Russia in any of these scenarios would multiply and they will be really
ambitious, hard and long. States sponsoring terrorism "South stream" is not build and Mistral
they do not sell. And we are so seriously to sanctions not prepared, more talked about it on
TV. Of course, we will survive, but we have very hard and difficult.
Ukraine will begin to arm to the teeth as she bids to join NATO despite the fact that NATO
Charter prohibits to NATO countries with unsolved territorial problems from joining. They will
assign the status of associate member bloc.
But nothing is finished. Because first we were framed as aggressors. And the rest of the
world believed. Now we were framed as terrorists. And as soon as the "civilized world" would
believe it will become a logical last move: to put us beasts.
"It remains to figure out how to save the current US administration, while avoiding a world
war
"the Plane was shot down by Ukrainians, shot down by accident, there will be no
investigation, no one needs it
in the blog print version
The expert debate about Boeing will now be about how many demons can fit on the tip of a
needle. Everyone is already clear, it remains to figure out how to save the current US
administration, while avoiding a world war.
All the latest news about the investigation of the disaster over the Donbass say only one
thing: everything is clear, but the problems are still ahead.
The main theses are as follows: the plane was shot down by Ukrainians, shot down by accident,
there will be no investigation, no one needs it. I'll explain in more detail.
A lot has been said about the information war: the Americans started it, and they are now
out of it, sadly. There is no point in sorting through the array of objective evidence –
we must give the American side the opportunity to get out of all this with honor, because if
the United States does not succeed, we will all again face the threat of total war.
One
Never and under no circumstances will the Ukrainian side make public its means of objective
control, if they exist at all. Most likely, they have already been destroyed. Recognition of
the randomness of the shot – however it may be classified-is the last chance for the US
to get out of the dirty Ukrainian swamp. Yes, an accident, it happens in war. But it needs to
be explained to a Western audience.
And if it is impossible to understand, then you just have to remember: the Ukrainian army
shoots where it wants and what it wants to objects. And sometimes nowhere at all.
Let me remind you that in old Yugoslavia for a long time hunted for the officers of the
Serbian artillery, which with a rare drunk once (!) shot in the direction of Croatian
Dubrovnik. They were found ten years later and sent to the Hague. Why? Because the Croatian
side in time declared everywhere where reached, including UNESCO in which list the
city-monument Dubrovnik is entered, about atrocities of the Serbian artillery.
Two
Yes, we are all here at the level of unfunny jokes know that the Ukrainian rocket, if you send
it to the plane, will definitely fly to the tree. And vice versa. For those who were born and
raised in the Soviet Union, this is a given. But the Westerner has to prove it and explain it.
He, a Westerner, used to think that if a guy could speak APE English fluently, even if he had a
strong accent, he was still our local guy. So it was with Saakashvili and Yushchenko. They were
also married to Western ladies. And then with Yatsenyuk Turchynov, tied to both the American
sect. They're twice their own.
The guy from the West used to think that if the missile system is put on combat duty, it is
worth something. He can not explain that for twenty-three years, the Ukrainian army conducted
only one air defense exercise – in 2001. And it ended up being shot down over the Black
sea by a Russian plane. After that, no (!) and never (!) there were no exercises in
Ukraine.
Three
References to the war in South Ossetia, in which it was the Ukrainian crews of "Buks" perfectly
proved themselves by shooting down four Russian objects under the Georgian obscene hooting,
also do not work. Georgians with great difficulty found across Ukraine two crews for all the
same "Buks", whose commanders of calculations were Americans of Polish origin.
Most of these brave Ukrainian anti-aircraft gunners after the war 08.08.08 died under unclear
circumstances, and the survivors were drunk (the city of Stryi, Lviv region, the former air
defense base of the Carpathian military district of the USSR armed forces). And no one has
tried to train the new crews as unnecessary.
Inventory of missiles, by the way, no one held, and it did not make sense, because the missiles
were sold right and left, and that is especially sinful-it is to the left, that is, to
countries that the same US declare "outcasts". Target capture guidance system-a complex thing,
" Buk " is able to simultaneously conduct up to 24 goals, and it is not clear what exactly saw
on the radar specific lad.
Four
The Boeing could give additional signals. It could be untried equipment, which will now be
difficult to admit to the Malaysian airline.
Even if the "Boeing" shone an additional beacon-it could cause the launch of the rocket. And
there were several objects on the radar that were moving towards the war zone – here a
spontaneous launch of a missile is more than possible. During the cold war, passenger planes
were very often used for reconnaissance purposes, loading them with photographic equipment.
This, of course, is not our case, and the times are quite different – satellites fly with
impunity, but still no one has yet shown how perfect was the plane itself, its crew and strange
course.
Five
By the way, the base of American drones working for the Kiev government is located in Kanatovo
near Dnepropetrovsk, just in the area of the flight of the "Boeing". This is an old abandoned
Soviet air force base of those that grew sunflowers by the end of the 90's.
But recently there arrived Americans, all rebuilt, and now this former collective farm field is
called the 66th separate brigade of the air force of Ukraine, although from the Ukrainian there
are only signs and dogs. Live there American military, and are based only American drones, of
which two have already been shot down. The first – in the spring on Perekop Russian
fighter, the second-over Donetsk militia, and it almost entirely fell into their hands.
For the United States, the explanation of all that has happened is a kind of unintentional
accident, or even better-the synergy of many accidents-almost the only way to calmly and
technically get out of the game.
Technically, you just need to "chat" for a couple of weeks. And then the evidence from the
"black boxes" will not be so relevant, and in General the whole story will be erased from
memory, perhaps against the background of other circumstances.
Six
But it will not be possible to talk about the circumstances of what is happening in Novorossiya
at all. Many found this place on the map. Many began to watch the news. And there, for example,
the tone of CNN correspondents radically changed after they got access to Lugansk and Donetsk
on the tail of Malaysian representatives.
No Western journalist had been in the combat zone for three months, and now they were
impartially reporting live that civilians were being killed, that heavy artillery fire was
being fired from Ukrainian positions on residential areas, and, most interestingly, the
presenters in the Studio never interrupted them. And this on CNN and Foxnews do at times. But
now the words are accompanied by a picture of the bodies of apparently civilians torn apart.
And just like that, even Christian Amanpour won't interrupt anyone.
Seven
Most likely, it is the discussion of the set of accidents that led to the missile salvo that
will soon become dominant. A half-trained or even never-learned APE with a grenade sat at the
controls. She didn't identify the objects.
The fighter that accompanied (or whatever he was doing with this "Boeing", did not push out of
the track?), seeing the rocket, was forced to make the same emergency evasion maneuver, which
indicates the objective data of Russian surveillance-he abruptly went up to the limit and even
beyond the height.
Something on several radars, presumably defined as a "small-sized, high-speed flying object",
that is, a fighter, not a UFO, made a routine maneuver to evade a missile salvo from the
ground. So taught in the Soviet flight schools. All Ukrainian pilots came out of the same
greatcoat.
Scholastic dispute about whether it was exactly " Buk " or the old C-200, which is also the
same 25 years of vodka brewed, does not make sense. Good people who are leading this highly
professional dispute, come from some ideal circumstances, forgetting that all this-Ukraine.
The salvo was obviously spontaneous, and this-again-is the only thing that will save the West
now.
* * *
But we will never hear or see this, because no one will drown Poroshenko now, he will drown
himself in two or three months. The American security service is forced to "keep a face",
because Barack Obama first said, and then there was objective tracking data, and how to get out
of this – no one knows.
Further expert debate will be about how many demons can fit on the tip of the needle. Everyone
is already clear, it remains to figure out how to save the current US administration, while
avoiding a world war.
It is in the interest of world peace to ensure that the investigation into the deaths of nearly
300 people is delayed as long as possible. And then it was forgotten.
Is it possible? Yes, perhaps. We did not see the unfortunate relatives storming the building of
Schiphol airport, although relatively recently the same crowd almost demolished the government
of Malaysia because of the unknown where the disappeared similar "Boeing".
European governments can make sure that the relatives of the victims stop asking questions.
Although they, those who lost loved ones, could be the driving force of the entire
investigation. It's very cynical, Yes. But what other choice is there?."It remains to figure
out how to save the current US administration, while avoiding a world war "the Plane was shot
down by Ukrainians, shot down by accident, there will be no investigation, no one needs it
in the blog print version
The expert debate about Boeing will now be about how many demons can fit on the tip of a
needle. Everyone is already clear, it remains to figure out how to save the current US
administration, while avoiding a world war.
All the latest news about the investigation of the disaster over the Donbass say only one
thing: everything is clear, but the problems are still ahead.
The main theses are as follows: the plane was shot down by Ukrainians, shot down by accident,
there will be no investigation, no one needs it. I'll explain in more detail.
A lot has been said about the information war: the Americans started it, and they are now out
of it, sadly. There is no point in sorting through the array of objective evidence – we
must give the American side the opportunity to get out of all this with honor, because if the
United States does not succeed, we will all again face the threat of total war.
One
Never and under no circumstances will the Ukrainian side make public its means of objective
control, if they exist at all. Most likely, they have already been destroyed. Recognition of
the randomness of the shot – however it may be classified-is the last chance for the US
to get out of the dirty Ukrainian swamp. Yes, an accident, it happens in war. But it needs to
be explained to a Western audience.
And if it is impossible to understand, then you just have to remember: the Ukrainian army
shoots where it wants and what it wants to objects. And sometimes nowhere at all.
Let me remind you that in old Yugoslavia for a long time hunted for the officers of the Serbian
artillery, which with a rare drunk once (!) shot in the direction of Croatian Dubrovnik. They
were found ten years later and sent to the Hague. Why? Because the Croatian side in time
declared everywhere where reached, including UNESCO in which list the city-monument Dubrovnik
is entered, about atrocities of the Serbian artillery.
Two
Yes, we are all here at the level of unfunny jokes know that the Ukrainian rocket, if you send
it to the plane, will definitely fly to the tree. And vice versa. For those who were born and
raised in the Soviet Union, this is a given. But the Westerner has to prove it and explain it.
He, a Westerner, used to think that if a guy could speak APE English fluently, even if he had a
strong accent, he was still our local guy. So it was with Saakashvili and Yushchenko. They were
also married to Western ladies. And then with Yatsenyuk Turchynov, tied to both the American
sect. They're twice their own.
The guy from the West used to think that if the missile system is put on combat duty, it is
worth something. He can not explain that for twenty-three years, the Ukrainian army conducted
only one air defense exercise – in 2001. And it ended up being shot down over the Black
sea by a Russian plane. After that, no (!) and never (!) there were no exercises in
Ukraine.
Three
References to the war in South Ossetia, in which it was the Ukrainian crews of "Buks" perfectly
proved themselves by shooting down four Russian objects under the Georgian obscene hooting,
also do not work. Georgians with great difficulty found across Ukraine two crews for all the
same "Buks", whose commanders of calculations were Americans of Polish origin.
Most of these brave Ukrainian anti-aircraft gunners after the war 08.08.08 died under unclear
circumstances, and the survivors were drunk (the city of Stryi, Lviv region, the former air
defense base of the Carpathian military district of the USSR armed forces). And no one has
tried to train the new crews as unnecessary.
Inventory of missiles, by the way, no one held, and it did not make sense, because the missiles
were sold right and left, and that is especially sinful-it is to the left, that is, to
countries that the same US declare "outcasts". Target capture guidance system-a complex thing,
" Buk " is able to simultaneously conduct up to 24 goals, and it is not clear what exactly saw
on the radar specific lad.
Four
The Boeing could give additional signals. It could be untried equipment, which will now be
difficult to admit to the Malaysian airline.
Even if the "Boeing" shone an additional beacon-it could cause the launch of the rocket. And
there were several objects on the radar that were moving towards the war zone – here a
spontaneous launch of a missile is more than possible. During the cold war, passenger planes
were very often used for reconnaissance purposes, loading them with photographic equipment.
This, of course, is not our case, and the times are quite different – satellites fly with
impunity, but still no one has yet shown how perfect was the plane itself, its crew and strange
course.
Five
By the way, the base of American drones working for the Kiev government is located in Kanatovo
near Dnepropetrovsk, just in the area of the flight of the "Boeing". This is an old abandoned
Soviet air force base of those that grew sunflowers by the end of the 90's.
But recently there arrived Americans, all rebuilt, and now this former collective farm field is
called the 66th separate brigade of the air force of Ukraine, although from the Ukrainian there
are only signs and dogs. Live there American military, and are based only American drones, of
which two have already been shot down. The first – in the spring on Perekop Russian
fighter, the second-over Donetsk militia, and it almost entirely fell into their hands.
For the United States, the explanation of all that has happened is a kind of unintentional
accident, or even better-the synergy of many accidents-almost the only way to calmly and
technically get out of the game.
Technically, you just need to "chat" for a couple of weeks. And then the evidence from the
"black boxes" will not be so relevant, and in General the whole story will be erased from
memory, perhaps against the background of other circumstances.
Six
But it will not be possible to talk about the circumstances of what is happening in Novorossiya
at all. Many found this place on the map. Many began to watch the news. And there, for example,
the tone of CNN correspondents radically changed after they got access to Lugansk and Donetsk
on the tail of Malaysian representatives.
No Western journalist had been in the combat zone for three months, and now they were
impartially reporting live that civilians were being killed, that heavy artillery fire was
being fired from Ukrainian positions on residential areas, and, most interestingly, the
presenters in the Studio never interrupted them. And this on CNN and Foxnews do at times. But
now the words are accompanied by a picture of the bodies of apparently civilians torn apart.
And just like that, even Christian Amanpour won't interrupt anyone.
Seven
Most likely, it is the discussion of the set of accidents that led to the missile salvo that
will soon become dominant. A half-trained or even never-learned APE with a grenade sat at the
controls. She didn't identify the objects.
The fighter that accompanied (or whatever he was doing with this "Boeing", did not push out of
the track?), seeing the rocket, was forced to make the same emergency evasion maneuver, which
indicates the objective data of Russian surveillance-he abruptly went up to the limit and even
beyond the height.
Something on several radars, presumably defined as a "small-sized, high-speed flying object",
that is, a fighter, not a UFO, made a routine maneuver to evade a missile salvo from the
ground. So taught in the Soviet flight schools. All Ukrainian pilots came out of the same
greatcoat.
Scholastic dispute about whether it was exactly " Buk " or the old C-200, which is also the
same 25 years of vodka brewed, does not make sense. Good people who are leading this highly
professional dispute, come from some ideal circumstances, forgetting that all this-Ukraine.
The salvo was obviously spontaneous, and this-again-is the only thing that will save the West
now.
* * *
But we will never hear or see this, because no one will drown Poroshenko now, he will drown
himself in two or three months. The American security service is forced to "keep a face",
because Barack Obama first said, and then there was objective tracking data, and how to get out
of this – no one knows.
Further expert debate will be about how many demons can fit on the tip of the needle. Everyone
is already clear, it remains to figure out how to save the current US administration, while
avoiding a world war.
It is in the interest of world peace to ensure that the investigation into the deaths of nearly
300 people is delayed as long as possible. And then it was forgotten.
Is it possible? Yes, perhaps. We did not see the unfortunate relatives storming the building of
Schiphol airport, although relatively recently the same crowd almost demolished the government
of Malaysia because of the unknown where the disappeared similar "Boeing".
European governments can make sure that the relatives of the victims stop asking questions.
Although they, those who lost loved ones, could be the driving force of the entire
investigation. It's very cynical, Yes. But what other choice is there?
"... Bellingcat is an alleged group of amateur on-line researchers who have spent years shilling for the U.S. instigated war against the Syrian government, blaming the Douma chemical attack and others on the Assad government, and for the anti-Russian propaganda connected to, among other things, the Skripal poisoning case in England, and the downing of flight MH17 plane in Ukraine. ..."
"... The Intercept , along with its parent company First Look Media, recently hosted a workshop for pro-war, Google-funded organization Bellingcat in New York. The workshop, which cost $2,500 per person to attend and lasted five days, aimed to instruct participants in how to perform investigations using "open source" tools -- with Bellingcat's past, controversial investigations for use as case studies Thus, while The Intercept has long publicly promoted itself as an anti-interventionist and progressive media outlet, it is becoming clearer that – largely thanks to its ties to Omidyar – it is increasingly an organization that has more in common with Bellingcat, a group that launders NATO and U.S. propaganda and disguises it as "independent" and "investigative journalism." ..."
In the 1920s, the influential American intellectual Walter Lippman argued that the average
person was incapable of seeing or understanding the world clearly and needed to be guided by
experts behind the social curtain. In a number of books he laid out the theoretical foundations
for the practical work of Edward Bernays , who developed "public relations" (aka propaganda) to
carry out this task for the ruling elites. Bernays had honed his skills while working as a
propagandist for the United States during World War I, and after the war he set himself up as a
public relations counselor in New York City.
There is a fascinating exchange at the beginning of Adam Curtis's documentary, The
Century of Self , where Bernays, then nearly 100 years old but still very sharp, reveals
his manipulative mindset and that of so many of those who have followed in his wake. He says
the reason he couldn't call his new business "propaganda" was because the Germans had given
propaganda a "bad name," and so he came up with the euphemism "public relations." He then adds
that "if you could use it [i.e. propaganda] for war, you certainly could use it for peace." Of
course, he never used PR for peace but just to manipulate public opinion (he helped engineer
the CIA coup against the democratically elected Arbenz government in Guatemala in 1954 with
fake news broadcasts). He says "the Germans gave propaganda a bad name," not Bernays and the
United States with their vast campaign of lies, mainly aimed at the American people to get
their support for going to a war they opposed (think weapons of mass destruction). He sounds
proud of his war propaganda work that resounded to his credit since it led to support for the
"war to end all wars" and subsequently to a hit movie about WWI , Yankee Doodle Dandy
, made in 1942 to promote another war, since the first one somehow didn't achieve its lofty
goal.
As Bernays has said in his book Propaganda ,
The American motion picture is the greatest unconscious carrier of propaganda in the world
today.
He was a propagandist to the end. I suspect most viewers of the film are taken in by these
softly spoken words of an old man sipping a glass of wine at a dinner table with a woman who is
asking him questions. I have shown this film to hundreds of students and none has noticed his
legerdemain. It is an example of the sort of hocus-pocus I will be getting to shortly, the sly
insertion into seemingly liberal or matter-of-fact commentary of statements that imply a
different story. The placement of convincing or confusing disingenuous ingredients into a truth
sandwich – for Bernays knew that the bread of truth is essential to conceal untruth.
In the following years, Bernays, Lippman, and their ilk were joined by social "scientists,"
psychologists, and sundry others intent on making a sham out of the idea of democracy by
developing strategies and techniques for the engineering of social consensus consonant with the
wishes of the ruling classes. Their techniques of propaganda developed exponentially with the
development of technology, the creation of the CIA, its infiltration of all the major media,
and that agency's courting of what the CIA official Cord Meyer called in the 1950s "the
compatible left," having already had the right in its pocket. Today most people are, as is
said, "wired," and they get their information from the electronic media that is mostly
controlled by giant corporations in cahoots with government propagandists. Ask yourself: Has
the power of the oligarchic, permanent warfare state with its propaganda and spy networks
increased or decreased over your lifetime. The answer is obvious: the average people that
Lippman and Bernays trashed are losing and the ruling elites are winning.
This is not just because powerful propagandists are good at controlling so-called "average"
people's thinking, but, perhaps more importantly, because they are also adept – probably
more so – at confusing or directing the thinking of those who consider themselves above
average, those who still might read a book or two or have the concentration to read multiple
articles that offer different perspectives on a topic. This is what some call the professional
and intellectual classes, perhaps 15-20 % of the population, most of whom are not the ruling
elites but their employees and sometimes their mouthpieces. It is this segment of the
population that considers itself "informed," but the information they imbibe is often sprinkled
with bits of misdirection, both intentional and not, that beclouds their understanding of
important public matters but leaves them with the false impression that they are in the
know.
Recently I have noticed a group of interconnected examples of how this group of the
population that exerts influence incommensurate with their numbers has contributed to the
blurring of lines between fact and fiction. Within this group there are opinion makers who are
often journalists, writers, and cultural producers of some sort or other, and then the larger
number of the intellectual or schooled class who follow their opinions. This second group then
passes on their received opinions to those who look up to them.
There is a notorious propaganda outfit called Bellingcat , started by an unemployed
Englishman named Eliot Higgins, that has been funded by The Atlantic Council, a think-tank with
deep ties to the U.S. government, NATO, war manufacturers, and their allies, and the National
Endowment for Democracy (NED), another infamous U.S. front organization heavily involved in
so-called color revolution regime change operations all around the world, that has just won the
International Emmy Award for best documentary. The film with the Orwellian title, Bellingcat: Truth in a Post-Truth World, received its Emmy at a recent ceremony in New
York City.
Bellingcat is an alleged group of amateur on-line researchers who have spent years
shilling for the U.S. instigated war against the Syrian government, blaming the Douma chemical
attack and others on the Assad government, and for the anti-Russian propaganda connected to,
among other things, the Skripal poisoning case in England, and the downing of flight MH17 plane
in Ukraine.
It has been lauded by the corporate mainstream media in the west. Its support for
the equally fraudulent White Helmets (also funded by the US and the UK) in Syria has also been
praised by the western corporate media while being dissected as propaganda by many excellent
independent journalists such as Eva Bartlett, Vanessa Beeley, Catte Black, among others. It's
had its work skewered by the likes of Seymour Hersh and MIT professor Theodore Postol, and its
US government connections pointed out by many others, including Ben Norton and Max Blumenthal
at The Gray Zone. And now we have the mainstream media's wall of silence on the leaks from the
Organization for the Prohibition on Chemical Weapons (OPCW) concerning the Douma chemical
attack and the doctoring of their report that led to the illegal U.S. bombing of Syria in the
spring of 2018. Bellingcat was at the forefront of providing justification for such bombing,
and now the journalists Peter Hitchens, Tareq Harrad (who recently resigned from Newsweek after accusing the publication of suppressing his revelations about the OPCW
scandal) and others are fighting an uphill battle to get the truth out.
Yet Bellingcat: Truth in a Post-Truth World won the Emmy , fulfilling Bernays'
point about films being the greatest unconscious carriers of propaganda in the world today.
Who presented the Emmy Award to the film makers, but none other than the rebel journalist
Chris Hedges . Why he did so, I don't know. But that he did so clearly sends a message to those
who follow his work and trust him that it's okay to give a major cultural award to a propaganda
outfit. But then, perhaps he doesn't consider Bellingcat to be that.
Nor, one presumes, does The Intercept , the billionaire Pierre Omidyar owned
publication associated with Glen Greenwald and Jeremy Scahill, and also read by many
progressive-minded people. The Intercept that earlier this year disbanded the small
team that was tasked with reviewing and releasing more of the massive trove of documents they
received from Edward Snowden six years ago, a minute number of which have ever been released or
probably ever will be. As
Whitney Webb pointed out , last year The Intercept hosted a workshop for
Bellingcat. She wrote:
The Intercept , along with its parent company First Look Media, recently
hosted a workshop for pro-war, Google-funded organization Bellingcat in New York. The
workshop, which
cost $2,500 per person to attend and lasted five days, aimed to instruct participants in
how to perform investigations using "open source" tools -- with Bellingcat's past, controversial
investigations for use as case studies Thus, while The Intercept has long
publicly promoted itself as an anti-interventionist and progressive media outlet, it is
becoming clearer that – largely thanks to its ties to Omidyar – it is
increasingly an organization that has more in common with Bellingcat, a group that launders
NATO and U.S. propaganda and disguises it as "independent" and "investigative
journalism."
Then we have Jefferson Morley , the editor of The Deep State, former Washington
Post journalist, and JFK assassination researcher, who has written a praiseworthy review of the
Bellingcat film and who supports Bellingcat. "In my experience, Bellingcat is credible," he
writes in an Alternet article, "Bellingcat
documentary has the pace and plot of a thriller."
Morley has also just written an article for Counterpunch –
"Why the Douma Chemical Attack Wasn't a 'Managed Massacre'" – in which he disputes
the claim that the April 7, 2018 attack in the Damascus suburb was a false flag operation
carried out by Assad's opponents. "I do not see any evidence proving that Douma was a false
flag incident," he writes in this article that is written in a style that leaves one guessing
as to what exactly he is saying. It sounds convincing unless one concentrates, and then his
double messages emerge. Yet it is the kind of article that certain "sophisticated" left-wing
readers might read and feel is insightful. But then Morley, who has written considerably about
the CIA, edits a website that advertises itself as "the thinking person's portal to the world
of secret government," and recently had an exchange with former CIA Director John Brennan where
"Brennan put a friendly finger on my chest," said in February 2017, less than a month after
Trump was sworn in as president, that:
With a docile Republican majority in Congress and a demoralized Democratic Party in
opposition, the leaders of the Deep State are the most -- perhaps the only -- credible check
in Washington on what Senator Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) calls Trump's "
wrecking ball presidency ."
Is it any wonder that some people might be a bit confused?
"I know what you're thinking about," said Tweedledum; "but it isn't so, nohow."
"Contrariwise," continued Tweedledee, "if it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it
would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic."
As a final case in point, there is a recent book by Stephen Kinzer , Poisoner in Chief:
Sidney Gottlieb And The CIA Search For Mind Control, t he story of the chemist known as
Dr. Death who ran the CIA's MK-ULTRA mind control project, using LSD, torture, electric shock
therapy, hypnosis, etc.; developed sadistic methods of torture still used in black sites around
the world; and invented various ingenious techniques for assassination, many of which were
aimed at Fidel Castro. Gottlieb was responsible for brutal prison and hospital experiments and
untold death and suffering inflicted on all sorts of innocent people. His work was depraved in
the deepest sense; he worked with Nazis who experimented on Jews despite being Jewish
himself.
Kinzer writes in depth about this man who considered himself a patriot and a spiritual
person – a humane torturer and killer. It is an eye-opening book for anyone who does not
know about Gottlieb, who gave the CIA the essential tools they use in their "organized crime"
activities around the world – in the words of Douglass Valentine, the author of The
CIA as Organized Crime and The Phoenix Program . Kinzer's book is good history on
Gottlieb; however, he doesn't venture into the present activities of the CIA and Gottlieb's
patriotic followers, who no doubt exist and go about their business in secret.
After recounting in detail the sordid history of Gottlieb's secret work that is nauseating
to read about, Kinzer leaves the reader with these strange words:
Gottlieb was not a sadist, but he might well have been . Above all he was an instrument of
history. Understanding him is a deeply disturbing way of understanding ourselves.
What possibly could this mean? Not a sadist? An instrument of history? Understanding
ourselves? These few sentences, dropped out of nowhere, pull the rug out from under what is
generally an illuminating history and what seems like a moral indictment. This language is pure
mystification.
Kinzer also concludes that because Gottlieb said so, the CIA failed in their efforts to
develop methods of mind control and ended MK-ULTRA's experiments long ago. Why would he believe
the word of a man who personified the agency he worked for: a secret liar? He writes,
When Sydney Gottlieb brough MK-ULTRA to its end in the early 1960s, he told his CIA
superiors that he had found no reliable way to wipe away memory, make people abandon their
consciences, or commit crimes and then forget them.
As for those who might think otherwise, Kinzer suggests they have vivid imaginations and are
caught up in conspiracy thinking: "This [convincing others that the CIA had developed methods
of mind control when they hadn't] is Sydney Gottlieb's most unexpected legacy," he asserts. He
says this although Richard Helms, the CIA Director, destroyed all MK-Ultra records. He says
that Allen Dulles, Gottlieb, and Helms themselves were caught up in a complete fantasy about
mind control because they had seen too many movies and read too many books; mind control was
impossible, a failure, a myth, he maintains. It is the stuff of popular culture, entertainment.
In an interview with Chris Hedges, interestingly posted by Jefferson Morley at his website, The Deep State , Hedges agrees with Kinzer. Gottlieb, Dulles, et al. were all deluded.
Mind control was impossible. You couldn't create a Manchurian Candidate; by implication,
someone like Sirhan Sirhan could not have been programmed to be a fake Manchurian Candidate and
to have no memory of what he did, as he claims. He could not have been mind-controlled by the
CIA to perform his part as the seeming assassin of Senator Robert Kennedy while the real killer
shot RFK from behind. People who think like this should get real.
Furthermore, as is so common in books such as Kinzer's, he repeats the canard that JFK and
RFK knew about and pressured the CIA to assassinate Fidel Castro. This is demonstrably false,
as shown by the Church Committee and the Assassinations Record Review Board, among many others.
That Kinzer takes the word of notorious liars like Richard Helms and the top-level CIA
operative Samuel Halpern is simple incredible, something that is hard to consider a mistake.
Slipped into a truth sandwich, it is devoured and passed on. But it is false. Bullshit meant to
deceive.
But this is how these games are played. If you look carefully, you will see them widely.
Inform, enlighten, while throwing in doubletalk and untruths. The small number of people who
read such books and articles will come away knowing some history that has no current relevance
and being misinformed on other history that does. They will then be in the know, ready to pass
their "wisdom" on to those who care to listen. They will not think they are average.
But they will be mind controlled, and the killer cat will roam freely without a bell, ready
to devour the unsuspecting mice.
Edward Curtin is a writer whose work has appeared widely. He teaches sociology at
Massachusetts College of Liberal Arts. His website is http://edwardcurtin.com/
"... With Nordstream II becoming operational, Russia can bypass Ukraine completely in supplying gas to EU countries and Ukraine will only receive enough gas for its own needs. Ukraine becomes a liability to the West as that country continues its slow and agonising collapse. Perhaps in 2020 the Donetsk and Lugansk oblasts may officially declare their independence and apply for inclusion into the Russian Federation, or combine into a new nation. Other adjoining oblasts (Kharkiv?) may follow suit. Transcarpathia oblast in the far west of Ukraine may declare independence and then apply to join Hungary. ..."
Nordstream II should be completed in 2020 in spite of the many handicaps and threats of
sanctions the US has applied against Germany if the pipeline project continues. Its
completion is bound to change the geopolitical landscape in central and eastern Europe
considerably.
With Nordstream II becoming operational, Russia can bypass Ukraine completely in
supplying gas to EU countries and Ukraine will only receive enough gas for its own needs.
Ukraine becomes a liability to the West as that country continues its slow and agonising
collapse. Perhaps in 2020 the Donetsk and Lugansk oblasts may officially declare their
independence and apply for inclusion into the Russian Federation, or combine into a new
nation. Other adjoining oblasts (Kharkiv?) may follow suit. Transcarpathia oblast in the far
west of Ukraine may declare independence and then apply to join Hungary.
Volodymyr Zelensky may not last long as President and is likely to be turfed out in a
coup. Civil war will come again to Ukraine but not in its Russian-speaking east.
Belarus should be monitoring its own southern borders. Maybe crunch-time is coming for
President Lukashenko there as to whether he should align Belarus more closely with Russia or
with the EU instead of trying to get the best of both worlds by playing one against the
other.
My predictions for 2020 are that Ukraine's final collapse and fragmentation will start,
that the use of threats and sanctions continues to isolate the US to its detriment, and that
(maybe, just maybe) the collapse of Ukraine will lead to some of the truth of what actually
happened to Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 becoming public with whistleblowers in the
investigation finally coming forward.
Re Jen @37 "With Nordstream II becoming operational, Russia can bypass Ukraine completely in
supplying gas to EU countries and Ukraine will only receive enough gas for its own needs."
I am hoping this is a bad joke, but perhaps not. I suppose, if true, it will prevent a lot
of Ukrainians from freezing to death this winter. But considering the benefits it will
provide to the Ukro-nazis who hate Russia, I have to wonder about the decision-making process
in Moscow.
Bellingcat's transparency model is similar to the Tor Project's. It lists a bunch of
innocuous, little-known non-profits and human rights-type organizations. To understand who
they and why they'd fund an outfit like Bellingcat takes a lot more digging.
"... Why have we supported Nguema, Karimov, and Kagame but not the ones who are thorns in our sides? The reasons are obvious. It's not the lives of their citizens - it's power for the elite class. We intervene abroad because we want to further the interest of the wealthy. ..."
"... America will always pick and choose the leaders it props up and tears down. It never was and never will be for humanitarian reasons -- that is a clever veil. We denounce ethnic cleansing and then fund it. We call for free elections and then support Pinochet, Stroessner, and Videla. ..."
"... Opposing war is a noble and courageous act, and there will always be smears. Opposing war isn't supporting dictators; it's opposing death and destruction in the service of the wealthy. Never believe what they tell you about why they're sending your kids to die. Never. ..."
Idealistic Realist , Apr 27, 2019 1:24:45 PM |
link
Best analysis by a candidate for POTUS ever:
American foreign policy is not a failure. To comfort themselves, observers often say that our leaders -- presidents, advisors,
generals -- don't know what they're doing. They do know. Their agenda just isn't what we like to imagine it is.
To quote Michael Parenti: "US policy is not filled with contradictions and inconsistencies. It has performed brilliantly
and steadily in the service of those who own most of the world and who want to own all of it."
The vision of our leaders as bunglers, while more accurate than the image of them as valiant public servants, is less accurate
and more rose-tinted than the closest approximation of the truth, which is that they are servants of their class interest.
That is why we go to war.
Those who buy the elite class's foreign policy BS, about the Emmanuel Goldsteins they conjure up every three years, are
fools. Obviously Hussein and Milošević were bad; but "government bad" does not mean we must invade. Wars occur for economic,
not humanitarian, reasons.
Teodoro Obiang Nguema, the president of Equatorial Guinea, is a kleptocrat, murderer, and alleged cannibal. This is
him and his wife with Barack and Michelle Obama.
Islam Karimov, the president of Uzbekistan, was said to have boiled political prisoners to death, massacred hundreds
of prisoners, and made torture an institution. This is him with John Kerry.
Paul Kagame, the president of Rwanda, has been involved in the assassination of political opponents, perpetrated obvious
election fraud, and had his term extended until 2034. This is him with Barack and Michelle Obama.
Why have we supported Nguema, Karimov, and Kagame but not the ones who are thorns in our sides? The reasons are obvious.
It's not the lives of their citizens - it's power for the elite class. We intervene abroad because we want to further the interest
of the wealthy.
America will always pick and choose the leaders it props up and tears down. It never was and never will be for humanitarian
reasons -- that is a clever veil. We denounce ethnic cleansing and then fund it. We call for free elections and then support
Pinochet, Stroessner, and Videla.
Opposing war is a noble and courageous act, and there will always be smears. Opposing war isn't supporting dictators;
it's opposing death and destruction in the service of the wealthy. Never believe what they tell you about why they're sending
your kids to die. Never.
"... As the steward-in-chief of the American empire, Obama continued Bush's Afghanistan and Iraq Wars, and extended his "War on Terror" into Libya, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, Pakistan, and elsewhere in Africa and the Middle East. He also became a terrorist himself and a serial killer, weaponized drones and special ops assassins being his weapons of choice. ..."
Barack Obama won the 2009 Nobel Peace Prize -- for not being George W. Bush. This seemed unseemly at the time, but not outrageous.
Seven years later, it seems grotesque.
As the steward-in-chief of the American empire, Obama continued Bush's Afghanistan and Iraq Wars, and extended his "War on Terror"
into Libya, Syria, Yemen, Somalia, Pakistan, and elsewhere in Africa and the Middle East. He also became a terrorist himself and a serial killer, weaponized drones and special ops assassins being his weapons of choice.
ANDREW LEVINE is a Senior Scholar at the Institute for Policy Studies, the author most recently of THE AMERICAN IDEOLOGY
(Routledge) and POLITICAL KEY WORDS
(Blackwell) as well as of many other books and articles in political philosophy. His most recent book is
In Bad Faith: What's Wrong With the
Opium of the People . He was a Professor (philosophy) at the University of Wisconsin-Madison and a Research Professor (philosophy)
at the University of Maryland-College Park. He is a contributor to
Hopeless: Barack Obama and the Politics
of Illusion (AK Press).
My apologies if this has been posted before, but here is a news conference broadcast by
Interfax a few days ago detailing a joint French-Ukrainian journalistic investigation into a
huge money laundering scheme using various shadow banking organizations in Austria and
Switzerland, benefiting Clinton friendly Ukrainian oligarchs and of course the Clinton
Foundation.
The link is short enough to not require re-formatting:
Forgive me for the somewhat redundant post, and again I hope this is not a waste of anyone's
time, but this is the source of the Interfax report I posted just above currently at #56. It
is relevant to the Ukrainegate impeachment fiasco.
The U.S. and lapdog EU/UK media will not touch this with a 10 foot pole.
KYIV. Dec 17 (Interfax-Ukraine) – Ukraine and the United States should investigate
the transfer of $29 million by businessman Victor Pinchuk from Ukraine to the Clinton
Foundation, Ukrainian Member of Parliament (independent) Andriy Derkach has said. According
to him, the investigation should check and establish how the Pinchuk Foundation's
activities were funded; it, among other projects, made a contribution of $29 million to the
Clinton Foundation. "Yesterday, Ukrainian law enforcement agencies registered criminal
proceeding number 12019000000001138. As part of this proceeding, I provided facts that
should be verified and established by the investigation. Establishing these facts will also
help the American side to conduct its own investigation and establish the origin of the
money received by [Hillary] Clinton," Derkach said at a press conferences at
Interfax-Ukraine in Kyiv on Tuesday, December 17.
According to him, it was the independent French online publication Mediapart that first
drew attention to the money withdrawal scheme from Ukraine and Pinchuk's financing of the
Clinton Foundation.
"The general scheme is as follows. The International Monetary Fund (IMF) lent money to
Ukraine in 2015. The same year, Victor Pinchuk's Credit Dnepr [Bank] received UAH 357
million in a National Bank stabilization loan from the IMF's disbursement. Delta Bank was
given a total of UAH 5.110 billion in loans. The banks siphoned the money through Austria's
Meinl Bank into offshore accounts, and further into [the accounts of] the Pinchuk
Foundation. The money siphoning scam was confirmed by a May 2016 ruling by [Kyiv's]
Pechersky court. The total damage from this scam involving other banks is estimated at $800
million. The Pinchuk Foundation transferred $29 million to the Foundation of Clinton, a
future U.S. presidential candidate from the Democratic Party," Derkach said.
started by an unemployed Englishman named Eliot Higgins
Good on him – being able to create a thing that rises to such prominence in such a
short space of time speaks volumes about this Higgins guy's entrepreneurial ability. And if
he wasn't mobbed-up to begin with, he sure as fuck is now – which is a double-
mitzvah (for him).
If he did so starting from being unemployed, then anybody who turned down a job
application from the guy must be kicking themselves. (' Unemployed ' is obviously used
pejoratively in the blockquote; 'Englishman' is purely-descriptive).
.
Also, the entire article accepts Bernays' conclusion, but disagrees as to which objectives
should be pursued.
Bernays' conclusions are hardly controversial: most people are gullible imbeciles .
It's not clear to me how much more empirical evidence we need before that becomes just a
thing that everyone with an IQ above 115 accepts.
So the question then becomes " OK, now what? ".
As usual, the right answer is " Depends " – and not just for those with
bladder control problems.
If you want to do things that are just , exploiting gullible imbeciles would appear
to violate the playing conditions. It would be hors jeu ; not done; just not
cricket .
As the Laconian famously said . " IF ."
For those for whom the 'if' condition returns 'false', it does very little to bleat about
how awful they are. You're not going to cause a little switch in their brain to flick on (or
off?), whereupon they realise the error of their ways and make a conscious decision to leave
the gullible imbeciles unexploited.
It's even unlikely to affect their victims (remember, they're imbeciles) – because
otherwise some infra-marginal imbeciles would have to process their way through quite a bit
of cognitive dissonance, and they're not wired for introspection (or processing).
So the sole real purpose (apart from κάθαρσις
catharsis ) is prophylaxis (προ +
φύλαξις – guarding ). Both good enough aims
obviously the writer is the one who gets the cathartic benefit, but who is going to be on
heightened alert as a result of this Cassandra -ish jeremiad -ing?
Non-imbeciles don't need it; imbeciles won't benefit.
Here's the thing: the gullible imbeciles are going to be exploited by
someone .
.
This is something that people of my persuasion struggle with. It boils down to the
following:
Let's assume that a reprehensible thing exists already, and is unlikely to be overthrown
by my opposition to it. Should I just participate and line my pockets?
The resources used are going to be used whether I participate or not, so it may as well
be me who gets them. After all, I will put them to moral uses – and while inside, I
can do things that are contrary to the interests of the reprehensible thing.
There is no satisfactory counter-argument to that line of reasoning, and yet I reject
it.
Then again: I was dropped on my head as an infant, so YMMV.
@Adrian About Chris Hedges' participation in presenting this award to Bellingcat "News from
Underground" came yesterday up with this:
a friend who knows the background of Chris Hedges' involvement writes that "he was duped
into presenting the Emmy to Bellingcat -- and, from what I hear, he believes it was done
intentionally to smear him."
As this friend is someone I (and many others) quite admire for his integrity and bravery,
and as it's wholly plausible that Hedges would have been set up, I am reserving judgementon
his action, and urge people on this list to do so, too.
@Adrian Hedges would have known who the nominees are just seeing Bellingcat in there and
knowing this is the Emmies well, it's hard to believe otherwise than Hedges is a clever fake as
I have long suspected
Let's recall that Hedges in his previous life was an NYT war correspondent who covered the
Bosnian conflict knowing Yugoslavia quite well from visits there in the 1980s his reports
demonizing Serbs stood out like a sore thumb
I quickly pegged him as a complete liar, like the rest of the MSM propagandists that were
repeating boilerplate canards meant to demonize the hugely successful nation of Yugoslavia
which of course they were trying to tear apart
For instance, 'the Serb-dominated Yugoslavia' was a standard sentence that appeared
literally in every single story repeated ad nauseum literallu dozens of times a day and clearly
meant to convince the reader that dismantling the progressive and ethnically harmonious nation
of Yugoslavia was somehow the right thing to do
But it was pure bullshit anyone who had ever been to Yugoslavia would instantly recognize
that as a 'WTF ?'
There is much much more in Hedges' closet
But then, miraculously, he had a 'Road to Damascus' moment a few years later [we are
supposed to believe] and somehow became a 'good guy'
Bullshit Mr. Curtin nails the sly method here exactly
[The] bread of truth is essential to conceal untruth.
An excellent article
PS Counterpunch is a complete bullshit rag that has been coopted completely Plutocrat Pierre
Omidyar and his little 'Intercept' outfit is similarly continuing in the footsteps of prior
plutocrat propagandists like the Ford foundation Rockefellers and others
The ultimate goal is controlling YOU they need you to be obedient and believing and not ask
any questions
@FB Haven't looked at Bellingcat (not exactly a sophisticated operation if you ever worked
in the ad business) since MH 17 and Putin's Syria pacification, but upon reading this article
it became clear that Hedges must be either an idiot or deeply embedded.
One doesn't exclude the other, of course. The uneducated public wouldn't need to catch up on
so much information, and still get a great head start if they ever found out wtf "cui bono"
even means – but that's not gonna happen.
It's just not how the human mind works.
The blogger Eliot Higgins made waves early in the decade by covering the war in Syria from a
laptop in his apartment in Leicester, England, while caring for his infant daughter. In 2014,
he founded Bellingcat, an open-source news outlet that has grown to include roughly a dozen
staff members, with an office in The Hague. Mr. Higgins attributed his skill not to any special
knowledge of international conflicts or digital data, but to the hours he had spent playing
video games , which, he said, gave him the idea that any mystery can be cracked.
...
Bellingcat journalists have spread the word about their techniques in seminars attended by
journalists and law-enforcement officials. Along with grants from groups like the Open Society
Foundations, founded by George Soros, the seminars are a significant source of revenue for
Bellingcat, a nonprofit organization.
Looks like Brown Noser Eliot Higgins and his Bellingcrap organisation may have finally met
their match in a real investigative journalist, Dilyana Gaytandzhieva, who (some of us may
recall) has done sterling work in tracing movements of weapons from the Balkan countries to
Turkey and Azerbaijan with their ultimate destination being Syria to be used by ISIS jihadis,
and for which she was sacked by her newspaper employer in Bulgaria.
Does anyone imagine that the Brown Noser will have the courage and fortitude to respond to
legal action brought against him and Bellingcrap? Will his Atlantic Council employers support
him or has he passed his use-by date and become a liability?
"... November in Ukraine has been marked by the adoption of the so called 'land reform', in accordance of the demands made by the IMF amongst other international financial organizations. The reform opens the way for the mass privatization of Ukraine's agricultural lands. The IMF has been making these demands for many years but assorted Ukrainian presidents have tried to postpone such an unpopular decision. Recent polls show that the overwhelming majority of Ukrainians of all political persuasions are opposed to land privatization, from far-right to far-left. ..."
"... After an intensive period of deindustrialization, which has taken place in recent years, agricultural land remain the only asset with any value in Ukraine but even so, it may be bought for very little. A remarkable fact is that one of the deputies from the ruling party 'Servant of the people,' Nikita Poturayev , while pressing his colleagues at the Parliament to vote for the bill on land reform, claimed [1] that this would be 'settling scores with maniac V. Lenin', i.e. the purpose of the bill was to abolish the land nationalization carried out following the October revolution. ..."
"... Ukrainian political expert Ruslan Bortnik says that the President of Ukraine Vladimir Zelensky and his team came to power under an obligation to sell out the agricultural land of Ukraine to foreign companies. Those who buy these lands, according to Bortnik, will only be thinking about making the quickest possible buck. "Foreign companies are already operating on Ukrainian soil [renting land]," said Bortnik, ..."
"... "But they are competing with large Ukrainian agricultural holdings. They do not dominate. If the adopted land market model is launched, then only large foreign companies will remain in our market Let's be honest – we are not a sovereign country. At least our government is under external control. And this is a part of the obligations of this government. This is the condition under which they came to power. They are paying the debts through privatization." [2] ..."
"... Ukrainian farmers who still are landowners, formally at least – they just can't sell it – are the same people who are unable to pay their gas and electricity bills, especially after the recent raising of energy prices – another IMF demand. ..."
"... For the most part, it was in the region of $7.4 billion of stolen Ukraine's public money, from which only a "small share" was used to bribe Western politicians, like Hunter Biden. The deputies have stressed that, according to the investigation of Ukraine's general prosecution, the withdrawn and laundered money was then invested back into Ukraine. In particular through the Franklin Templeton Investments, the money was used to buy domestic government bonds (DGB), issued by Kiev at high interest rate. ..."
"... Ukrainian prosecutor Konstantin Kulik recently stated [4] in an interview that Ukraine takes IMF loans to pay out on these debt obligations (DGB). As deputy Aleksandr Dubinsky stressed at the press conference, 40% of the current public budget goes towards the payment of the public debt of Ukraine, including the repayment of DGB at inflated interest rates. ..."
November in Ukraine has been marked by the adoption of the so called 'land reform', in accordance of the demands made by the
IMF amongst other international financial organizations. The reform opens the way for the mass privatization of Ukraine's agricultural
lands. The IMF has been making these demands for many years but assorted Ukrainian presidents have tried to postpone such an unpopular
decision. Recent polls show that the overwhelming majority of Ukrainians of all political persuasions are opposed to land privatization,
from far-right to far-left.
After an intensive period of deindustrialization, which has taken place in recent years, agricultural land remain the only
asset with any value in Ukraine but even so, it may be bought for very little. A remarkable fact is that one of the deputies from
the ruling party 'Servant of the people,' Nikita Poturayev , while pressing his colleagues at the Parliament to vote for the bill
on land reform, claimed [1] that this would be 'settling scores with maniac V. Lenin', i.e. the purpose of the bill was to abolish
the land nationalization carried out following the October revolution.
Ukraine's fertile soil up for grabs
It has long been known that Ukraine's soil is very fertile. Indeed, during WW2 the invading Nazis made a point of appropriating
quantities of it; forcing POWs to collect the top soil and load it onto trains en route to Germany. Now these same lands could fall
into the hands of international agro-holdings.
Ukrainian political expert Ruslan Bortnik says that the President of Ukraine Vladimir Zelensky and his team came to power
under an obligation to sell out the agricultural land of Ukraine to foreign companies. Those who buy these lands, according to Bortnik,
will only be thinking about making the quickest possible buck. "Foreign companies are already operating on Ukrainian soil [renting
land]," said Bortnik,
"But they are competing with large Ukrainian agricultural holdings. They do not dominate. If the adopted land market model
is launched, then only large foreign companies will remain in our market Let's be honest – we are not a sovereign country. At
least our government is under external control. And this is a part of the obligations of this government. This is the condition
under which they came to power. They are paying the debts through privatization." [2]
Ukrainian farmers who still are landowners, formally at least – they just can't sell it – are the same people who are unable
to pay their gas and electricity bills, especially after the recent raising of energy prices – another IMF demand. Obviously,
their financial desperation will mean that many will have to sell their land at a low price, certainly well below the market value.
Meanwhile, Ukraine remains the poorest country on the continent of Europe and Ukrainian agricultural land remains the cheapest. Moreover,
the lands may be bought up as repaying large loans collected by the Kiev government following the Euromaidan coup in 2014.
This scheme of buying up Ukraine's land is connected with the ongoing corruption scandal in the US: the one related to Joe Biden
and the gas company 'Burisma'. At the end of November, Ukrainian MPs (non-factional people's deputy Andrey Derkach; a deputy from
the Batkivshchyna Party Aleksey Kucherenko; and a deputy from the ruling Servant of the People party, Aleksandr Dubinsky) revealed
it at the press-conference [3].
The point here is that the former Minister of Ecology of Ukraine Nikolay Zlochevsky , an owner of "Burisma" gas company, in 2014
introduced a number of Western politicians to the board of directors of his company, which helped him to avoid accusations of corruption.
Hunter Biden , son of former US Vice President Joe Biden , received monthly large payments for his "consultancy services". As a result
Ukraine's General prosecutor General Viktor Shokin, who was investigating the corruption schemes of the company, was forced – under
pressure – to resign by Joe Biden, who even boasted about it in the US media.
Ukrainian MPs have now claimed at a press-conference that the money used to bribe the son of the former Vice President of the
United States was in fact stolen. "Biden received money, the source of which is not the successful activity of Burisma, brilliant
business moves, or recommendations. It is the money of the citizens of Ukraine. It was obtained by criminal means," said the MP Andrey
Derkach. The ultimate goal of all this fraud, in which the Bidens were deeply involved, will be the bankruptcy of Ukraine in 2020-2021,
through the formation of a pyramid of public debt.
Laundering scheme to withdraw money from Ukraine
According to Ukrainian deputies, this was a part of a bigger laundering scheme to withdraw money from Ukraine via Latvian banks
and the fund 'Franklin Templeton Investments,' which is close to the United States Democratic Party. The founder of the foundation,
John Templeton Jr., was one of the main sponsors of the campaign of former US President Barack Obama.
For the most part, it was in the region of $7.4 billion of stolen Ukraine's public money, from which only a "small share"
was used to bribe Western politicians, like Hunter Biden. The deputies have stressed that, according to the investigation of Ukraine's
general prosecution, the withdrawn and laundered money was then invested back into Ukraine. In particular through the Franklin Templeton
Investments, the money was used to buy domestic government bonds (DGB), issued by Kiev at high interest rate.
The principle of this scheme is that with the assistance of American funds, the laundered money was legalised and invested in
government bonds at 6-8% in dollars and 15-17% in Ukrainian currency (hryvnia). This is leading to enormous growth in the Ukrainian
public debt and eventually the bankruptcy of the country's economy.
Eventual bankruptcy of the economy
Ukrainian prosecutor Konstantin Kulik recently stated [4] in an interview that Ukraine takes IMF loans to pay out on these
debt obligations (DGB). As deputy Aleksandr Dubinsky stressed at the press conference, 40% of the current public budget goes towards
the payment of the public debt of Ukraine, including the repayment of DGB at inflated interest rates.
According to him, bankruptcy on the debts could happen by the end of 2020 or 2021.
And this scheme is connected with land privatization, as adopted by Kiev in November in accordance with the IMF demand. "DGBs
are a financial instrument by which the state owes all its property when paying off the DGB. And if the land market is opened, the
state will have no other valuable property, with the exception of land," said Dubinsky, demanding the suspension of debt payments
to international creditors.
As a result of this unpopular land reform and the widespread violations of labour rights, Ukraine's trade-unions called a general
strike [5] for November 14 and began preparations. For the first time in the history of independent Ukraine, a strike committee was
formed at the all-national level. This committee was joined by trade unions, individual entrepreneurs, small businesses, agricultural
producers and farmers.
Management fires workers, pays themselves millions in bonuses
On November 14, Ukrainian railroad workers protested [6] in front of the Presidential office in Kiev against the announced plans
to fire some 50% of railroad personnel. The workers demanded the railroad management should resign instead. The deputy head of the
railroad trade-union, Alexander Mushenok, recently said [7] that currently "only 20 workers are employed where 60 workers are needed."
At the same time the workers claim that the top-level management of the company are paying themselves millions in bonuses. One of
the IMF demands requires that the Kiev authorities privatize the railroad system as well. In practice, this means that the few profitable
routes will be privatized by western companies, while the majority of non-profitable routes – to poorly developed provinces – will
remain state-owned, making the railway transport even less profitable.
The entire course of privatization, as promoted by the IMF, can be summarized by the principle 'privatization of profits, nationalization
of losses." And the new Kiev government is far too dependent to protest against the imposition of this policy; however, this will
effectively mean that this government will lose its credibility and trustworthiness among the people.
*
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site, internet forums. etc.
Looks like both Yovanovich and Hill are connected to Soros and did his bidding instead of pursuing Trump policies as for
Ukraine. Yovanovich was clearly dismiied due to her role in channeling damaging to Trump information during 2016 elections,
the fact that she denies (as she denied the exostance of "do not procecute list"). And nothing can be taken serious from a
government official until she denied it.
Notable quotes:
"... Fiona Hill, who was the senior director for Europe and Russia in the National Security Council (NSC) said other NSC staff had been "hounded out" by threats against them, including antisemitic smears linking them to the liberal financier and philanthropist, George Soros, a hate figure on the far right. ..."
"... This was a mishmash of conspiracy theories that I believe firmly to be baseless, an idea of an association between her and George Soros." ..."
"... "My entire first year of my tenure at the National Security Council was filled with hateful calls, conspiracy theories, which has started again, frankly, as it's been announced that I've been giving this deposition, accusing me of being a Soros mole in the White House, of colluding with all kinds of enemies of the president, and of various improprieties." ..."
"... "When I saw this happening to Ambassador Yovanovitch, I was furious," she said, pointing to "this whipping up of what is frankly an antisemitic conspiracy theory about George Soros to basically target nonpartisan career officials, and also some political appointees as well." ..."
"... Hill dismissed the suggestion that Ukraine meddled in the 2016 election was a "conspiracy theory" intended to distract attention from Russia's well-documented role. ..."
Fiona Hill, who was the senior director for Europe and Russia in the National Security
Council (NSC) said other NSC staff had been "hounded out" by threats against them, including
antisemitic smears linking them to the liberal financier and philanthropist, George Soros, a
hate figure on the far right.
In her testimony to Congress, Hill described a climate of fear among administration
staff.
The UK-born academic and biographer of Vladimir Putin said that the former ambassador to
Ukraine, Marie Yovanovitch, was the target of a hate campaign, with the aim of driving her from
her post in Kyiv, where she was seen as an obstacle to some corrupt business interests.
Yovanovitch was recalled from Ukraine in May on Trump's orders. In a 25 July conversation
with the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, Trump described Yovanovitch as "bad news"
and predicted she was "going to go through some things". The former ambassador has testified
she felt threatened by the remarks.
Trump's lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, led calls for Yovanovitch's dismissal, as did two of Giuliani
business associates, Lev Parnas and Igor Fruman. All three are under scrutiny in hearings being
held by House committees looking at Trump's use of his office to put pressure on the Ukrainian
government to investigate his political opponents.
"There was no basis for her removal," Hill testified. "The accusations against her had no
merit whatsoever. This was a mishmash of conspiracy theories that I believe firmly to be
baseless, an idea of an association between her and George Soros."
"I had had accusations similar to this being made against me as well," Hill testified. "My
entire first year of my tenure at the National Security Council was filled with hateful calls,
conspiracy theories, which has started again, frankly, as it's been announced that I've been
giving this deposition, accusing me of being a Soros mole in the White House, of colluding with
all kinds of enemies of the president, and of various improprieties."
She added that the former national security adviser, HR McMaster "and many other members of
staff were targeted as well, and many people were hounded out of the National Security Council
because they became frightened about their own security."
"I received, I just have to tell you, death threats, calls at my home. My neighbours
reported somebody coming and hammering on my door," Hill said, adding that she had also been
targeted by obscene phone calls. "Now, I'm not easily intimidated, but that made me mad."
"When I saw this happening to Ambassador Yovanovitch, I was furious," she said, pointing to
"this whipping up of what is frankly an antisemitic conspiracy theory about George Soros to
basically target nonpartisan career officials, and also some political appointees as well."
In Yovanovitch's case, Hill said: "the most obvious explanation [for the smear campaign]
seemed to be business dealings of individuals who wanted to improve their investment positions
inside of Ukraine
itself, and also to deflect away from the findings of not just the Mueller report on Russian
interference but what's also been confirmed by your own Senate report, and what I know myself
to be true as a former intelligence analyst and somebody who has been working on Russia for
more than 30 years."
Hill dismissed the suggestion that Ukraine meddled in the 2016 election was a "conspiracy
theory" intended to distract attention from Russia's well-documented role.
The list contains some (but not all) of the key participants of the 2014 coup d'état
against President Yanukovich. There are 13 names in the list: MPs Serhiy Leshchenko, Mustafa
Nayem, Svitlana Zalishchuk, Serhiy Berezenko, Serhiy Pashynsky; ex-Prime Minister Arseniy
Yatsenyuk; ex-Head of the National Bank of Ukraine Valeriya Hontareva; ex-First Deputy of the
National Security and Defense Council Oleg Hladkovsky; judge of the Constitutional Court of
Ukraine Makar Pasenyuk; candidate for presidency Anatoly Hrytsenko; singer Svyatoslav Vakarchuk;
journalist Dmytro Hordon and ex-Head of the Presidential Administration Borys Lozhkin.
Pashynsky was involved in Snipergate. Yatsenyuk was the marionette chosen by Nuland to head
the Provisional government after Yanukovich will be overthrown.
Almost all of these people from the list were involved in various sort of scandals during
the last five years. Particularly, Oleg Hladkovsky was recently dismissed from his post due to
the corruption scandal in the defense sphere. Serhiy Leshchenko became known for the purchase
of the flat for $275,253 and the number of information attacks at well-known politicians and
businessmen. Serhy Pashynsky was tied to the hostile takeover of a confectionary factory in
Zhytomyr.
In its turn, the U.S. Department of State stated that the
words of Lutsenko are not true and aims to tarnish the reputation of Ambassador
Yovanovitch. Thus, there are certain concerns that the actual list might be fake.
WASHINGTON (Sputnik) - The House is holding its second public hearing with former US envoy
to Ukraine Marie Yovanovitch centring around her ouster which, according to her, is pertinent
to the impeachment probe against Trump. Former US Ambassador to Ukraine Marie Yovanovitch
flatly denied allegations that she circulated a list of potential corruption targets in Ukraine
that the United States did not want prosecuted, according to testimony at the opening of
hearings in the House impeachment probe of President Donald Trump on Friday.
"I want to reiterate first that the allegation that I disseminated a do not prosecute list
was a fabrication", Yovanovitch said. "Mr Lutsenko, the former Ukrainian prosecutor general
who made that allegation, has acknowledged that the list never existed. I did not tell Mr
Lutsenko or other Ukrainian officials who they should or should not prosecute. Instead I
advocated the US position that rule of law should prevail."
US President Donald Trump in a series of tweets on Friday
criticised former Ambassador to Ukraine Marie Yovanovitch's performance while she was
testifying in the impeachment hearing against him. He defended his decision to replace
Yovanovitch - appointed by his predecessor Barak Obama - as the US ambassador to Ukraine, where
she served from August 2016 until May 2019.
....They call it "serving at the pleasure of the President." The U.S. now has a very
strong and powerful foreign policy, much different than proceeding administrations. It is
called, quite simply, America First! With all of that, however, I have done FAR more for
Ukraine than O.
During Friday's Democrat-led impeachment inquiry hearing, former U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine
Marie Yovanovitch testified under oath that she did not give former Ukrainian Prosecutor
General Yuriy Lutsenko a "do not prosecute list" in 2017. Yovanovitch also doubled-down on
left-wing disinformation saying that Lutsenko "acknowledged that the list never existed" in
April.
"I want to reiterate first that the allegation that I disseminated a "Do Not Prosecute" list
was a fabrication,"
Yovanovitch told the House Intelligence Committee . "Mr. Lutsenko, the former Ukrainian
prosecutor general who made that allegation, has acknowledged that the list never existed. I
did not tell Mr. Lutsenko or other Ukrainian officials who they should or should not
prosecute."
"That is such a lie," Glenn Beck said on Friday's show. "She should be held for
perjury."
During a three-part BlazeTV exposé on the Democrats' corruption in Ukraine, Glenn
debunked what he called "the most misleading fabrication I've ever seen by the mainstream
media."
Earlier this year, award-winning investigative journalist John
Solomon reported Lutsenko's claim that then-Ambassador Yovanovitch gave him a list of
"people whom we should not prosecute" during a meeting in 2016. Shortly after Solomon's article
was released, several news sources, including the Washington Post and the Wall Street Journal,
reported that Lutsenko retracted his statement.
When Lutsenko said Yovanovitch "gave" him a list, he did not mean she actually handed him
anything in writing, but verbally conveyed the names of people he shouldn't prosecute.
"They never mentioned the fact that it was verbally dictated and he wrote the list down
himself -- are you kidding me?" Glenn exclaimed. "This is how the media is fact-checking and
debunking. They are playing with our republic and Ukraine's republic. They are planting
dynamite all around everything that we hold dear. How do they sleep at night? Everyone that
reads their stories actually thinks that there was a retraction of one of the most damning
parts of this entire case."
If you like what you see, use promo code GB20OFF to get $20 off a full year of BlazeTV . With a BlazeTV subscription, you're not just paying to watch
great pro-free speech, pro-America TV. Your subscription funds the intensive investigations
that let BlazeTV tell the stories
the liberal media wants to keep in the dark, giving you the unvarnished truth, showing you what
the media doesn't want you to see.
Read More
Ukrainian Prosecutor General Yuriy Lutsenko told Hill.TV's John Solomon in an interview that
aired Wednesday that U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine Marie Yovanovitch gave him a do not prosecute
list during their first meeting.
"Unfortunately, from the first meeting with the U.S. ambassador in Kiev, [Yovanovitch] gave
me a list of people whom we should not prosecute," Lutsenko, who took his post in 2016, told
Hill.TV last week.
"My response of that is it is inadmissible. Nobody in this country, neither our president
nor our parliament nor our ambassador, will stop me from prosecuting whether there is a crime,"
he continued.
The State Department called Lutsenko's claim of receiving a do not prosecute list, "an
outright fabrication."
"We have seen reports of the allegations," a department spokesperson told Hill.TV. "The
United States is not currently providing any assistance to the Prosecutor General's Office
(PGO), but did previously attempt to support fundamental justice sector reform, including in
the PGO, in the aftermath of the 2014 Revolution of Dignity. When the political will for
genuine reform by successive Prosecutors General proved lacking, we exercised our fiduciary
responsibility to the American taxpayer and redirected assistance to more productive
projects."
Hill.TV has reached out to the U.S. Embassy in Ukraine for comment.
Lutsenko also said that he has not received funds amounting to nearly $4 million that the
U.S. Embassy in Ukraine was supposed to allocate to his office, saying that "the situation was
actually rather strange" and pointing to the fact that the funds were designated, but "never
received."
"At that time we had a case for the embezzlement of the U.S. government technical assistance
worth 4 million U.S. dollars, and in that regard, we had this dialogue," he said. " At that
time, [Yovanovitch] thought that our interviews of Ukrainian citizens, of Ukrainian civil
servants, who were frequent visitors of the U.S. Embassy put a shadow on that anti-corruption
policy."
"Actually, we got the letter from the U.S. Embassy, from the ambassador, that the money that
we are speaking about [was] under full control of the U.S. Embassy, and that the U.S. Embassy
did not require our legal assessment of these facts," he said. "The situation was actually
rather strange because the funds we are talking about were designated for the prosecutor
general's office also and we told [them] we have never seen those, and the U.S. Embassy replied
there was no problem."
"The portion of the funds namely 4.4 million U.S. dollars were designated and were foreseen
for the recipient Prosecutor General's office. But we have never received it," he said.
Yovanovitch previously served as the U.S. ambassador to Armenia under former presidents
Obama and George W. Bush, as well as ambassador to Kyrgyzstan under Bush. She also served as
ambassador to Ukraine under Obama.
"... Is it not possible to have an article on Ukraine without all the [email protected] references? Might have been a non-biased article, but many of us will never know... ..."
"... They certainly aren't National Socialists, and arguably not nationalists. Nationalists are open to what is best for "the nation" regardless of where it lies on the political spectrum. Since they don't consider the people in Donbas to be part of "the nation", that means, if anything, they are useful idiots of Zionism. ..."
In my July 25th article " Zelenskii's dilemma " I pointed
out the fundamental asymmetry of the Ukrainian power configuration following Zelenskii's crushing victory over Poroshenko: while
a vast majority of the Ukrainian people clearly voted to stop the war and restore some kind of peace to the Ukraine, the real levers
of power in the post-Maidan Banderastan are all held by all sorts of very powerful, if also small, minority groups including:
The various "oligarchs" (Kolomoiskii, Akhmetov, etc.) and/or mobsters Arsen Avakov's internal security forces including some "legalized"
Nazi death squads The various non-official Nazi deathsquads (Parubii) The various western intelligence agencies who run various groups
inside the Ukraine The various western financial/political sponsors who run various groups inside the Ukraine The so-called "Sorosites"
(соросята) i.e. Soros and Soros-like sponsored political figures The many folks who want to milk the Ukraine down to the last drop
of Ukrainian blood and then run
These various groups all acted in unison, at least originally, during and after the Euromaidan. This has now dramatically changed
and these groups are now all fighting each other. This is what always happens when things begin to turn south and the remaining loot
shrinks with every passing day,
Whether Zelenskii ever had a chance to use the strong mandate he received from the people to take the real power back from these
groups or not is now a moot point: It did not happen and the first weeks of Zelenskii's presidency clearly showed that Zelenskii
was, indeed, in " free fall ": instead of becoming
a "Ukrainian Putin" Zelenskii became a "Ukrainian Trump" – a weak and, frankly, clueless leader, completely outside his normal element,
whose only "policy" towards all the various extremist minorities was to try to appease them, then appease them some more, and then
even more than that. As a result, a lot of Ukrainians are already speaking about "Ze" being little more than a "Poroshenko 2.0".
More importantly, pretty much everybody is frustrated and even angry at Zelenskii whose popularity is steadily declining.
... ... ...
Another major problem for Zelenskii are two competing narratives: the Ukronazi one and, shall we say, the "Russian" one. I have
outlined the Ukronazi one just above and now I will mention the competing Russian one which goes something like this:
The Euromaidan was a completely illegal violent coup against the democratically elected President of the Ukraine, whose legitimacy
nobody contested, least of all the countries which served as mediators between Poroshenko and the rioters and who betrayed their
word in less than 24 hours (a kind of a record for western politicians and promises of support!).
... ... ...
Some of the threats made by these Ukronazis are dead serious and the only person who, as of now, kinda can keep the Ukrainian
version of the Rwandan " Interahamwe " under control would probably be Arsen Avakov, but since he himself is a hardcore
Nazi nutcase, his attitude is ambiguous and unpredictable. He probably has more firepower than anybody else, but he was a pure "
Porokhobot " (Poroshenko-robot) who, in many ways, controlled Poroshenko more than Poroshenko controlled him. The best move
for Zelenskii would be to arrest the whole lot of them overnight (Poroshenko himself, but also Avakov, Parubii, Iarosh, Farion, Liashko,
Tiagnibok, etc.) and place a man he totally trusts as Minister of the Interior. Next, Zelenskii should either travel to Donetsk or,
at least, meet with the leaders of the LDNR and work with them to implement the Minsk Agreements. That would alienate the Ukronazis
for sure, but it would give Zelenskii a lot of popular support.
Needless to say, that is not going to happen. While Zelenskii's puppet master Kolomoiskii would love to stick this entire gang
in jail and replace them with his own men, it is an open secret that powerful interest groups in the US have told Zelenskii "don't
you dare touch them". Which is fine, except that this also means "don't you dare change their political course either".
...are going through the famous Kübler-Ross stages of griefs: denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance: currently,
most of them are zig-zagging between bargaining and depression; acceptance is still far beyond their – very near – horizon. Except
that Zelenskii has nothing left to bargain with.
Thank you for a rational article about Ukraine. The sad thing is that it might take years to reach the "acceptance" phase.
It would take someone like Hitler to clean out the stables. Arrest is not a viable option as they will bribe their way out.
These people need to be put down like rabid dogs. That is the only way to put an end to their mischief and it would be a deterrent
to their replacements.
Personally, I suspect that the Ukraine is being deliberately depopulated to make way for waves of "refugees" from Israel. Another
country that is still in the "denial" phase. Its military and political leaders know full-well that their strategic aims have
all failed. The boot is now firmly on the other foot.
I suspect that Crimea was their preferred destination and hence the massive non-stop propaganda against Russia on that score.
To give you an idea of how ridiculous it has all become, the UK no longer accepts medical degrees awarded by universities in Crimea.
Is it not possible to have an article on Ukraine without all the [email protected] references? Might have been a non-biased article, but
many of us will never know...
I suspect that the Ukraine is being deliberately depopulated to make way for waves of "refugees" from Israel.
You got that right – what it's all about is building a New Khazaria. But they're neither giving up on their Greater Israel
project between the two rivers, and hence more wars, conflict and chaos to drive out the native Arabs from the Middle East.
I suspect that Crimea was their preferred destination and hence the massive non-stop propaganda against Russia on that score.
@AWMThey certainly aren't National Socialists, and arguably not nationalists. Nationalists are open to what is best for
"the nation" regardless of where it lies on the political spectrum. Since they don't consider the people in Donbas to be part
of "the nation", that means, if anything, they are useful idiots of Zionism.
@bob sykes Kolomoiskii is the real hidden owner/controller of the company that bribed the Bidens. He has a finger in lots
of pies. His pretense to leaning towards Russia is his way to try to get the Americans to stop attempts to get at the many millions
that he stole from his own Ukrainians bank – fake loans to his companies.
Of course, the Russians understand all of that. This theater is aimed at the Americans – not at the Russians.
For the Ukrainian state to break up, there need to be some forces interested in a break-up. You won't find such forces inside
the Ukraine.
What is Ukrainian South-East? In pure political terms, "South-East" is a bunch of oligarchs, who are all integrated into Ukrainian
system, and have no reason to seek independence from Kiev, especially if it means getting slapped with Western sanctions.
Even the Kremlin doesn't show much interest in breaking up the Ukraine, so why the hell would it break up?
It's worth pointing out that the so-called "Novorossia movement" started out as Akhmetov's project to win concessions from
new Kiev regime. It was then quickly hijacked by Strelkov, a man who actually wanted to break up the Ukraine, and it is because
of Strelkov, that Donetsk and Lugansk are now de-facto independent. Without similar figures to lead secessionist movements elsewhere
in the Ukraine, this break-up that Saker keeps talking about will never happen.
His ratings must be sky-high, because otherwise I cannot imagine why Fox would allow him to continue to use their network as
a medium to broadcast common sense.
Of course the Dems are making it so easy.
Schiff, Kent, Taylor, Yanovitch -- what a pathetic, nauseating crew.
@Alfred I had the same thoughts. Zelenskii should show a similar coffin with the text
"This one is still empty" and then start rounding up the terrorists. He finally has a good
excuse.
Thank you Saker and Unz for the very interesting article .
I wonder what has been the role of Germany in the Ukrainian disaster . ...I have the
feeling , just the suspicion , that they contributed to the ucranian disaster out of their
genetic Drang nach Osten Nordic greed , is that right ?
Anyway since the Ukrainian disaster the cohesion of the EU is going going down . Germany
which was gifted with the german reunification , is less and less trusted spetially in south
Europe , and even less in the EU far west , in England which is going out of the EU .
Most of the people in the EU would like to keep collaborating with the US , of course ,
but also with Russia and with the rest of the world . Most of the people in the UE are scared
of the dark forces operating in Ukraine trying to provoke a war with Russia .
The stupid name-calling like the term "ukronazi" makes this article look like a rant like
North Korean communiques or the ravings of some Arab despot's propagandist. It is not better
than calling "The Saker" a "Moskal", "Sovok" or "Putler's stooge" etc. He should keep this
lingo to directly "debating" "Ukronazis" on twitter or youtube commentst etc. not for an
article that is supposed to be a serious analysis.
I understand that it is hard for a Russian nationalist to accept that the majority of
Ukrainians don't want to belong to their dream Russkiy Mir, they were seduced by the West,
which is more attractive with all its failings, because mostly of simple materialistic
reasons. Ukrainians happily go to EU countries that now allow them in as guest workers. The
fact, like it or not that majority of them chose the West over Russkiy Mir despite being very
close to Russians in culture, language, history etc. He is still in the first stage of grief
it seems.
All in all, Ukrainians are probably way above average in most human characteristics. The
area of Ukraine is by planetary standards one of the best available: arable land, great
rivers, Black see, pleasant and liveable.
But it is 2019 and life in Ukraine is barely better than it was 25-50 years ago,
population has actually dropped from its peak in early 1990's. Millions of Ukrainians live
abroad (I know some of them) and have – to be polite – at best an ambivalent
attitude towards their homeland. Almost all of them prefer to be somewhere else, even to
become someone else.
Now why is that? A normal society would have enough introspection to discuss this, to look
for answers. Throwing a temper-tantrum on a big square in Kiev every few years is not looking
for a solution. That is escapism, Orange-this, Maidan-that, 'Russians bad', 'we are going
West', 'golden toilets', and always 'Stalin did it'.
I don't agree with the facile name-calling that sees Nazis everywhere and exaggerates
throw-away symbolism. But Ukraine has not been functioning and it can't go like this much
longer. Not because it will collapse, it won't, but because during an era of general
prosperity Ukraine can't be a unstable exception (oh, I get it, they are better than Moldova,
good for them.)
Rebellions against geography are doomed. Projecting one's personal frustrations on
external enemies (Kremlin!) has never worked. Ukraine needs rationality – accepting
that they will not be in EU, that attempting to join Nato would destroy Ukraine, and that
they can't beat Russia in a war. And following advise of half-mad and half-ignorant
well-wishers from Washington or Brussels is a road to ruin. Nulands, Bidens and Tusks will
never live in Ukraine, they really deeply don't care about it. They have no skin in that
game, it is just entertainment for them.
Or alternatively you can pray that Russia collapses – good luck waiting for
that.
There is not much 'drang' left in Germany, so I think this is mostly fingers on the map
post dinner empty talk.
in 1945 the jewery asked Stalin to give Crimea to the jews , Stalin refused
Crimea is a jewel, but has one big problem: not enough water. But that's also true about
Izrael, maybe there is a deep genetic memory of coming out of a desert environment.
During WWII, Germany actually established settlements in Crimea. Think about it: there is
a massive war, you have like 1-2 years, short on transport and resources, and you start
sending settlers to Crimea – that's how much drang-nach-osten types wanted it.
And the Turks, etc This must be driving them absolutely nuts.
The mexicans are able to make fun of themselves , that`s a good thing . They have a joke
which aplies also to Ukraina ( and other countries )
The mexicans say : when God created Mexico He gave Mexico everything ; land , mountains ,
plains , tropical forests , deserts , two oceans , agriculture , gold , silver , oil . then
God saw how beautiful and perfect Mexico was and He though that He should also give something
bad to the country to prevent the sin of pride , and then he populated Mexico with pure
pendejos ,( idiots ) .
@AWM "Is it not possible to have an article on Ukraine without all the [email protected] references?
If you want a decent analysis of current events in the Ukraine, which is what The Saker
provides, I guess you'll just have to put up with his terminology.
The world won't miss a thing if Curmudgeon or AWM goes off in a huff, to sit on his toilet
and read the "one joke per dump" volume lodged on the tank and stops reading The Saker's very
thorough analysis as a protest action!
@Anon My experience is that Ukrainians individually are far from being pendejos .
But they are unable to act as a group or as a nation. (Well, they 'act', but it mostly
somehow fails.)
Maybe it is the relative shallow and heterogenous history of Ukraine. Or – and this
is what I have observed – a fundamental inner disloyalty to the Ukraine as a homeland.
When one observes the assorted Porkys, Timoshenkas, Yanuks, the oligarchs, but also the
crowds on Maidan, I get a sense that they are all about to leave Ukraine or are thinking
about leaving. Societies can't be built with one foot always at the airport, or in an old car
in a 5-km column waiting on the border of Poland. Or Russia.
Another good article – thanks – Yep, the US/EU NWO is not going to let their
"West Ukraine Isis" battalions and intel gang lose their funding , arms trafficking ops, or
terrorist reputation. This is a no win situation in Ukraine and the West knows it –
Even if NovoRossiya gets some independence, the Ukraine Isis will/can reek havoc and murder
for a long time along the border. The modern Cheka { Ukraine Isis } has been modified for the
security of the new Farmland owners – Monsanto, Cargill, DuPont and the rest of the
Globalist Corporations and their ports close to Odessa.
One point of contention since it wasn't made clear in this article – Novorussia
consists of Luhansk and Donetsk, but not Kharkov. While Kharkov has more Russians than most
other provinces of Ukraine do, it does not have a plurality like Donetsk and Luhansk.
All of Ukraine's doomsayers have been crying about Ukraine's demise for the lat 25
years, yet the fact is that it' s getting stronger and stronger every year,
USA diaspora keeps on delivering.
Shoutout to quarter/half Poles USA citizens LARPing as Ukrainian patriots in the
comments.
@Felix KeverichEven the Kremlin doesn't show much interest in breaking up the
Ukraine, so why the hell would it break up?
Follow the money my friend!
Some provinces send much more money to Kiev then they get back in "services". So long as
more loans from the EU, The USA and the IMF were forthcoming, that situation was not too bad.
Now, the spigot is being closed. Hence the sad face of Mr Z when he met Trump in
Washington.
This means that the provinces that are losing most from this internal transfer are going
to be strongly motivated to stop sending money to Kiev. Kiev will lose control and that will
fragment the country.
The Donbass was a big contributor to Kiev and got little in return – that was a
major reason for their dissatisfaction. Everyone there could see that Kiev sent the money
west and kept much for itself.
If the French provinces were to stop sending money to Paris, the Yellow movement would be
totally unnecessary.
@awry About 2.5 million Ukrainians have "emigrated" (you could also say "fled") to the RF
since 2014.
Per Bloomberg most of the outflow not to Russia has been to countries of Eastern Europe, esp.
Poland.
@AP "Ukraine was historically a marsh of Poland for centuries before it was a historical
marsh of Russia"
That was mostly Galicia and Volhynia. It is a tiny part of today's the Ukraine. In these
areas, the Poles were landowners, the Jews their rent/tax collectors and the peasants were
Ukrainian-speaking Slavs. Now, they are planning to sell the best farmland to "foreigners"
(i.e. Jews) and the Slavs will become serfs once again.
@Mr. Hack The problem with your argument is that the 'war' in the east was entirely
predicable. So was Crimea leaving and joining Russia. The people in charge in Kiev –
presumably with 3-digit IQ – would think about it, plan for it, etc They obviously
didn't. Instead they provided a needed catalyst to make it worse by voting in February 2014
to ban Russian language in official use, and the idiotic attacks on Russian speakers like in
Odessa, that were neither prevented nor punished. The other side – in this case Russia
and Russian speakers living in Donbas and Crimea – rationally took care of their own
interests. Post-Maidan Kiev handed them all they could on a silver platter while busying
themselves with silly slogans and videos of golden saunas.
Russia is actually one of the least susceptible countries to an economic collapse in the
world – it is largely self-sufficient, has enormous resources that others will always
buy, and has a very minimal percentage of its economy that deals with foreign trade. What
they are susceptible to is the loss of value for their currency – and that has already
largely happened since 2014. When it comes to energy, the countries that are low-cost
producers are least impacted – who you should worry about are the numerous higher-cost
producers like US shale, coal miners, or LNG gas that have huge upfront fixed costs and
built-in high transportation costs. Russia and Saudis will be fine.
Back to the drawing board, what exactly is the plan in Kiev? If they know that having a
war costs them investments, how do they end that war? It is highly unlikely that it would end
with a victorious Kiev army conquering Donetsk (or Crimea). So what's the plan?
It's amazing how spectacularly inept all these interventions over the last decades have been.
Iraq, Lybia, Syria, Yemen, the coup in Turkey but also Ukraine.
And I know that in the ME, the Isrseli policy, as iterated by Michael Orin is to let all
sides bleed each other to death, and that part has been relatively successful until
recently.
But in Ukraine, they were going to consolidate their control over the country from Kiev
and force-march the Russians out of Sevastopol. And that part didn't work at all, except as
leverage to impose sanctions on Russia; but the long term goal of using Ukraine to overthrow
Putin is now stuck in the Donbas.
My point being that it is the great fortune of the world that these criminal nitwits and
fools in the State (War) Department and their helpers in the "intelligence" community are so
arrogant and incompetent.
@Anon Merkel (who herself was studying in Donetsk for few months) definitely has a hand
in ze EuroUkrainian mess.
Afterall she met with Right Sector representatives one dayt before the final, bloody part
of the coup started. And that meeting of "reporting on delivering at our commitments and
asking Merkel about her delivery of her commitments" both with the next day start of "offence
at the government" was announced by Right Sector yet another day before, 16 February
2014.
However i have reservations about Merkel representing German peoples, especially some
alleged "genetical" trend of them to invade eastwards.
It was public, that Merkel's everything including public phone is spied upon by USA
"intelligence community", and Merkel considered it normal and proper.
So it is clearly stated what she considers her allegiance and whom she considers her
employees. Not citizens of Germany.
"Each of these countries is as inorganic and disunited as Ukraine, or worse, made up as they
are of various racial and ethnic groups who don't identify with each other."
I am dubious about this suggestion. But more importantly, Ukraine or the Ukraine has had a
violent revolution about every ten years. You simply cannot develop a stable government,
economy or safe social system if you you overturn the the government via violence every ten
tears.
That is the key differences and essential to any successful government, and more so for a
democracy that holds as innate belief, a tolerance for difference even competing ideas held
by its population. It is as if the only the only we are exporting is revolution as solution
to differences.
@Mr. Hack > Russia has never been able to lead with a carrot, but only with a stick.
Russia offered dozen billions of loans and years ahead orders for Ukrainian industries.
Those that Yatzenyuk begged to be re-started when he destroyed democratic government of
Ukraine.
EuroMaidan tried to stole the carrot from Ukraine, and while it succeeded in stealing what
Ukraine already picked, about 10%, the rest was kept safe of usurpers' reach, and so they
started looting Ukrainian economy instead. Hrivna fallen 3-fold – more than ruble.
> Positive outside influence into Ukraine's internal development in the form of
investments and economic development
EuroMaidan usurpers stopped real and ongoing investments from China and Russia by looting
what investments arrived into Ukraine already. But at least they got $5 billions of
investments from Nulland.
I like how "economic development" is listed as "outside influence". I thought that any
state or nation would claim being capable of their own economic development, but for
EuroMaidania it is quoted as some miracle that can only be given from outside.
> foreign investments being delayed until the war in the east is resolved
And that was why EuroMaidan usurpers invaded Donbass and started the war. To preclude
investments from the West after they stopped investments form China and Russia.
> create a chaotic situations
EuroMaidan proponent blaming chaotic situations. Precious. "Bees against honey"
movement.
> Since the West changed the dynamics of the energy game around the world
Did it? how exactly? By making Ukrainian pipelines liability no one wants to touch with a
pole?
> It's learned to better feed itself, and that's about it
But that is exactly what Ukraine knew how to do, and what EuroMaidania can not do.
While Russia is gaining this experience – EuroMaidania was and is destroying it, for
the sake of being "not like Russia". Way to go!
> One more jolt like in 2014
You mean the one when rouble fallen two-fold and hrivna three-fold?
Guess if the West could do it again – they would. But they can't.
> where are Russia's automobiles, televisions, medical equipment, computers,
pharmaceuticals etc; within the world markeplace?
Russia is not packaging consumer goods. Russia is sending technologies, which others pack
as consumer goods.
Ukraine could become one of those salesmen, packing Russian technologies into pretty wraps
and selling around.
EuroMaidan usurpers feared that and prevented that.
EuroMaidan even destroyed Antonov company, which was one of just 4 companies in the world
capable of building large airframes. Ensuring AirBus+Boeing+Tupolev/Ilyushin would have one
competitor less. And as Antonov was el-cheapo vendor with strategy based on dumping –
it was especially dangerous for Russian company, of the three. Thank you, guys, for removing
this riddance out of Russian pathway. You did great service!
@Hapalong Cassidy Beckow> the crowds on Maidan, I get a sense that they are all about
to leave Ukraine or are thinking about leaving.
You do not need to "have a feeling"
The promise of "visa-less living and working in EU" was exactly what EuroMaidan crowd
paraded as their aim and treasure, somehow magically warranted by the "Deep Association" that
Yatzenyuk and Poroshenko later dragged feet for months, trying to delay signing of this
economy suicide pact.
They were very public and honest about it. They claimed Yanukovich was somehow putting
ball and chain on them all by giving the second thought to orders from Brussels. Aid in
leaving Ukraine was the price they sold Ukrainian economy for. Ther were never shy in 2014 to
speak about it.
Hapalong Cassidy> While Kharkov has more Russians than most other provinces of Ukraine
do, it does not have a plurality like Donetsk and Luhansk.
There is a point. Kharkov in North-East and Odessa in South-West were trading cities,
routing the official and smuggled goods streams and hosting the largest foreign goods
markets. This clearly had impact upon mindsets of citizens and even more of cities
elites.
People in Kharkov went to the streets right after the coup commited and without support
they were at least equally numerous to all-Ukraine sponsored gathering of EuroMaidan #2.
But their leaders did not seek for independence, Kharkov city mayor Kernes openly shook hands
with Andrey "White Fuhrer" Byletsky and expressed his care about his (not Kharkov citizens)
safety in the night of Rymarskaya street murders, 2014 March 14th AFAIR.
People in Kharkov went against nazi from westernmost Ukraine regions (and even policemen)
and stormed those out of their district government building. Who else did then?
They had a huge impulse, but they also focused the most efforts from usurpers to deflect
and dissipate it. And little free resources the usurpers had back then.
Month later, in April, Kharkov was exhausted and pacified. But other regions of Ukraine were
overlooked those two months.
However, it was that first month which gave people in Donetsk and Lugansk both time and
examples to understand what is really going on (it was almost unbelievable that something
like that can actually happen in XXI century in Europe, wasn't it?) and learn their Ukrainian
elites are prostituting them, and then find some other leaders which would have enough skin
in the game to not sell them out.
You may rightly say Kharkov citizens did not resist for long. But have to admit the
resistance of Donbass and Lugansk was in significant part based upon time Kharkov bought them
in March and April 2014, and upon self-exposing that Kharkov's fleeting but furious
resistance forced EuroMaidan usurpers into.
"All, repeat, ALL the steps taken to sever crucial economic and cultural links between Russia
and the Ukraine were decided upon by Ukrainian leaders, never by Russia who only replied
symmetrically when needed.
Even with international sanctions directed at her, Russia successfully survived both the
severance of ties with the Ukraine and the AngloZionist attempts at hurting the Russian
economy. In contrast, severing economic ties with Russia was a death-sentence for the
Ukrainian economy which has now become completely deindustrialized."
No wonder saker deletes posts to his website containing info like these:
The top trade partner of *the* Ukraine is Russia. So his thesis is a little 'shoddy math'
ish. The links have not been severed as he pretends.
" the severance of ties with Russia " The Ukraine is more tied to Russia than any other
country, by recent trade volumes (as well as in traditional culture). Saker doesn't like
these facts to muddy up his thesis.
This means that the provinces that are losing most from this internal transfer are going
to be strongly motivated to stop sending money to Kiev.
You don't get it. Ukraine's South-Eastern provinces are inanimate objects . They
have no consciousness, no self-interest or free will. They don't decide anything.
Donbass never decided to break away from the Ukraine. That choice was made for it by
Strelkov, when he and his men occupied Slovyansk and began an armed confrontation.
@Anon The Ukraine used to export something like $20 billion worth of goods to Russia
annually. It's now closer to $5 billion, and Ukrainians are a lot poorer as a result.
@Felix Keverich The point is saker maintains it is completely de-industrialized. It is
'dead'. Total trade of >40 B all partners, isn't dead by a long shot. See what he says?
'Death sentence'. Far from it. A decrease isn't death. No doubt there has been a plunge. But
saker is over stating it. Russia is still a center of gravity for the Ukraine.
I am so sick and tired of hearing the term nazi this and nazi that when referring to the
situation in the Ukraine. The term nazi died in 1945 and should be left dead and buried. It
was a stupid word created by the British during the war because of their inability to
pronounce the German name for the NSDAP. The British and American media have a fetish for the
word and will call any "right-wing" movement "nazi" if given any opportunity. This shows
their total lack of creativity to come up with anything new and their deep obsession with
anything to do with Hitler which borders on religious worship. I say get rid of the usage of
the word on this site unless one is referring to the actual NSDAP party that existed until
1945.
@AWM You are an absurd cretin. Of course referring to current Ukraine as being controlled
by Nazi's is 100% accurate.
Ukronazis and Hitler Nazi's have many alignments with eachother:
1. Bizarre, fundamentally paganist usage of ahistoric/religious images from a millenia ago
as national symbols that should have had no connection to national identity of either state
in the 1930's or now ( swastika and Tryzub) even the UPA flag has more sense about it to any
"Ukrainian " state
2. Mass arrests and persecution of political opponents I'm fairly sure that Ukronazi's
have arrested ( and maybe even killed) far more people in their first 5 years, that the
Nazi's ever did in their 6 year, pre-war time in charge
3. Mass killing and torture of the people of the Donbass- now take on board this is with
Russia fighting the war of fighting the war that they are not even there and Russia/DNR/LNR
basically conducting huge talks with west/Banderastan and making huge concessions every time
they have been in a a hugely advantageous position or made a big breakthrough in the war.
Even Nazi's wouldn't have used such a lousy pretext for instigating war against the people of
Donbass – although at least the Nazi's could govern their state ukrops can't govern f
** k all without it descending into farce
4. Above average representation of freaks and/or highly camp idiots Goebbels, Goering and
Ribbentrop versus Avakov, "Yats" the yid, Poroshenko, Turchynov and many more – a
lamentable contest
5. Neither would have got off the ground without Anglo-American funding
Just because the Nazi's in the 30's and 40's were more competent does not take away the
similarities
Structural bottlenecks and slow reform progress lead to anemic growth in Ukraine
The rate of economic growth in Ukraine remains too low to reduce poverty and reach income
levels of neighboring European countries. Following the 16 percent cumulative contraction of
the economy in 2014-15, economic growth has recovered to 2.4 percent in 2016-17 and 3.3
percent in 2018. Faster economic growth for a sustained period of time is needed to reduce
poverty which remains above pre-crisis levels. More needs to be done if Ukraine's aspiration
is to become a high-income country and to close the income gap with advanced economies. Today
Ukraine is far from that goal. In terms of GDP-per-capita, Ukraine remains one of the poorest
countries in the region -- at levels of Moldova, Armenia and Georgia. Ukraine's GDP per
capita in purchasing power parity terms is about three times lower than in Poland, despite
having similar income levels in 1990.
At the growth rate of recent years, it will take Ukraine more than 50 years to reach income
levels of today's Poland. If Ukraine's productivity growth and investment rate remains at the
low levels observed in recent years, overt the medium-term the growth rate will converge to
almost zero per annum -- productivity growth is offset by declining contribution of labor as
Ukraine undergoes the demographic transition. Boosting total factor productivity growth to 3
percent per year and investment to 30 percent of GDP would result in sustained growth of
about 4 percent per year over the medium- to long-term. Given declining total population this
translates to GDP per capita growth of about 4.5 percent per year. These trends will not
improve on their own, they can happen only through the implementation of appropriate policies
that boost productivity and increase the returns on factors of production.
1. It does not split trade to industries. Hi-tech big added value and lo-tech slim added
value – falls into the same "total"
2. It only shows one snapshot, not YoY dynamics.
3. The column "Export Product" shows exactly the same value – literally, 100% –
for ALL the countries, all the rows. I wonder what we should deduce from it
2012 – $19,8B
2013 – $17,6B – the start of the coup
2014 – $15B – the coup won power but did not entrenched yet and did not had time
yet to enforce its ideals
2015 – $9.8B – the work started
2016 – $4.8B – 80% of 2012 exports are cut off, EuroMaidan means business
2017 – $3.6B – 82% of 2013 exports are cut off, coming to plateau ?
2018 – $3,9B – a slight rebound, plateau reached
@bob sykes I'd dismiss this, as Putin is apparently doing. Kolomoisky is looking who else
would provide money that he can steal. He, Porky, and others of their ilk stole Western loans
so blatantly, that even US-controlled IMF is balking at giving Ukraine more money. So,
Kolomoisky hopes that Russia will, so that he has more to steal. I hope that his hopes are in
vain.
The entire Ukraine farce can be explained as a simple project
Khazaria 2.0.
I met a Jew (American) in Ukraine over 20 years ago.
He told me the plan Jews were returning to historically Jewish cities in Ukraine by the
hundreds buying up for kopecki on the Gryvnia anything they could.
Media outlets, banks, factories, beachfront land, farmland, apartments, etc.
The idea? Make Ukraine the next EU Country, and benefit from the huge potential of
Ukraine.
I agreed with him at the time, that Ukraine had huge potential, I was there as an engineer
working for German companies but his lust for what could be 'looted' disgusted me.
This is a standard CIA scenario, used in Sarajevo and Deraa before Kiev. So, Ukrainians
bought an old stale show, swallowed it hook, line, and sinker.
But the Georgian snipers brought in 2014 to Kiev by Saakashvili started dying in
suspicious circumstances, so those who are still alive rushed to Belarus and started deposing
their testimony. They implicated a lot of Ukies, including former speaker Parubii, former MP
Pashinsky, etc. It was well known (to those who did not keep their eyes wide shut for
political reasons) that the sniper fire in 2014 on Maidan was from the building controlled by
the coup leaders, who later tried to blame Yanuk for it. That's why post-coup Ukrainian
authorities got rid of the trees on Maidan: bullet holes in those trees indicated where the
fire was coming from. But this recent testimony implicated particular people, who (surprise,
surprise!) happened to be among the coup leaders.
@Truth3 The truth is that you are absolutely right. 'Ukrainians' boasted that they are
the 'Khazars' since Mazeppa and Orlyk of the 'Constitution of Bendery' fame, while parading a
distaste for 'the adherents of deceitful Judaism' and noisy adherence to Orthodoxy.
Look at this entry of the http://www.encyclopediaofukraine.com and see if
anything changed:
"After Mazepa's death, on 16 April 1710, Orlyk was elected hetman, with the backing of
Charles XII of Sweden, in Bendery. The chief author of the Constitution of Bendery, he
pursued policies aimed at liberating Ukraine from Russian rule. He gained the support of the
Zaporozhian Host, concluded a treaty with Charles XII* in May 1710, and sought to make the
Ukrainian question a matter of international concern by continuing Mazepa's attempts at
establishing an anti-Russian coalition ** . Orlyk signed a treaty with the Crimean khan
Devlet-Girei in February 1711, negotiated with the Ottoman Porte, which formally recognized
his authority over Right-Bank Ukraine and the Zaporizhia in 1712, conducted talks with the
Don Cossack participants in Kondratii Bulavin's revolt who had fled to the Kuban, and even
contacted the Kazan Tatars and the Bashkirs. In 1711–14 he led Cossack campaigns
against the Russians in Right-Bank Ukraine. Despite initial victories they ultimately failed,
because of Turkish vacillation and because the pillaging, raping, and taking of many civilian
captives by Orlyk's Crimean Tatar allies resulted in the loss of public and military support
on the Right Bank".
Nowhere does the 'first "European" constitution' speak about 'ukrainians', but of 'Exercitu
Zaporoviensi genteque Rossiaca" (Zaporozhian Host and the Ruthenian people) living in
"Parva Rossia"/Little Russia.
* putting Ukraine under the protection of the King of Sweden.
** an plot of 'European' and Islamic powers with an intense 'Masonic-Kabbalistic' coloring
(and Jewish financial support) against Russian 'Tsardom' and 'Patriarchal' Church. 'Ukraine'
was an anti-Russian project from the get go. Brzezinski's quip: "Ukraine, a new and important
space on the Eurasian chessboard, is a geopolitical pivot because its very existence as an
independent country helps to transform Russia. Without Ukraine, Russia ceases to be a
Eurasian empire" reflects only the revival of the old plan in new circumstances.
@Seraphim " Brzezinski's quip: "Ukraine, a new and important space on the Eurasian
chessboard, is a geopolitical pivot "
Old Zbieg was as lunatic as Pole can be and as cunning as Jew can be (was he?).
The Poles were so desiring to became Slavic superpower, and on the height of their might
in 15th century – they could become. They occupied Russian lands – oh, that
mythical Kievan Rus oppressed by Moscow for centuries. And they even occupied Moscow for few
months – more than unified Europe managed to do under both Napoleon and Hitler
combined! Polska was really stronk then.
.well, they ate themselves from inside and sold their statehood to all the foreign bidders
while boasting about Polish pride. Like ukropeans do today. They lost their strength, they
lost their eastern colony, and for a while they even lost Poland itself.
They could never move over it.
Zbieg – coming from Galicia, the last shrink of Poland-occupied lands – had
this specifically Polish resentment burning in him. And he managed to make USA fight Polish
fights. Managed to use American incompetence in history and geography to sell them that idea
that the Ukraine – the borderlands between Poland and Russia have "geopolitical"
importance. For USA, no less. Wow!
Okay, USA invested at very least $5B into buying Ukrainian warchiefs, and we don't know
how much more was added by EU and Germany. They now have this "geopolitical asset" as Zbieg
urged them to do. What are they gonna do with it now? How do they gonna make Ukrainians pay
back the money they spent? Old Zbieg preached about the world "paid by Russia to fight
against Russia". This is that very "Russia, occupy the Ukraine finally, we are tired of
fruitless waiting!" whining they repeat again and again. But if this won't work, just like it
did not work yet, how do they think to make Ukrainians pay for it? Or whom else? I wonder
@Arioch "> My point is the ukraine isn't dead. It isn't dying.
In which quality? As a swath of land inhabited by few peasants here and there – it
surely will remain.
As an economically vibrant country, one of UN founders, with economy larger than German and
closing on France – what it used to be – it is dead.
As a laws-bound polity it is dead since 2014, though was dying even before.
As STEM engineering and education stronghold it was in USSR – it is dead.
As one in just four in the whole world producers of really large airplanes – it is
dead.
As one of the few ICBM producers – it is dead, know-how sold to Saudi.
As one of the few turbojet engines producers – it is dead, know-how sold to China.
As one of the reliable and well known tanks and APCs producer – it is dead, even
USA-occupied Iraq does not buy this trash.
As the country, living from the geographic rent, just providing roads and hotels for cargo
traffic, it is almost dead. Bridges are collapsing, roads – neither for cars nor
railways – are not maintained."
Bravado, anyone can see.
Dead countries don't produce electricity. Real economists look at things like this. Not
just at industrial reorganization. That is the only point you have. Industrial
reorganization. Not death of industry.
@Anon BTW, most *live* countries of the world do not produce ICBMs, nor jet engines, nor
APCs etc, nor super heavy aircraft. The military industrial complex remnants from the SU are
not industries that most of the planet's countries have. Specialties. Those can not be
measures of whether a country is living or dead. Use some real measures.
@Anon Actually a good point. Mass cargo logistics and energy generation. Indeed.
The thing here is, that as of now the Ukraine is enjoying its privileged position from
times Ukrainians ruled USSR (IOW, after Stalin died in 1953 and of few coup leaders Khruschev
became top dog in 1956). The Ukraine is reeking with then top-tech nuclear power plants, that
very few of other USSR republics had (one in Ignalina in Baltics, one in Armenia, and dozen
in Russia, that is all. Ukraine was #2 with huge gap).
There is a switch, though. What do you do with electricity you produced?
And, what kind of electricity you produce?
The second question is tangential to "green energy" fad.
The generation is split to "base" generation, which covers required minimum and should be
steadily generating around the clock, and "maneuvering" generation which can be turned on and
off in a matter of few minutes, to accommodate with daytime traits, like "people awoke in
between 7-8am, took shower, cooked breakfast and departed to school/work".
In general, base generation is predictable, thus does not need big reserves, can use economy
of scales and cut costs. Maneuvering one has to increase costs, dealing with unpredictable
mode changes and extra wearing it puts on the equipment and employees.
The first question, as you can not pour electricity into a tank and keep it for months
there, can be roughly split to
1) use at home, for things like washing, cleaning, entertaining (TV, computers), air
conditioning in summer and heating in winter.
2) use in industries, this is perhaps what "real economists" look for. Those should had less
daily spikes, they might even have near constant consumption around the clock.
3) export to the countries, who need it, but does not want to build their own power
plants
The export is significant thing. There is so called Byrshtyn Island, a constellation of
power plants in Western Ukraine, that was cut off from Ukrainian grid and plugged to Polish
grid, to act as maneuvering damper for Polish citizens' daylight cycles.
You chart shows that between 2014 and 2015 there was strong (about 2000 GWH) decrease in
production, which remained more or less stable after that. It also shows huge seasonal
variation.
It probably means Ukrainian industries and households enjoy a lot of winter-time heating, but
very little of summer-time AC. Just like it was built during USSR times.
Ukrainian electricity export seems rising. Were there new power plants put to service? I
did not heard. Then it means that domestic consumption shrunk.
There was also a streak of Nuclear Power Plants accidents in the news of 2017-2019.
This can stem from two factors:
1) increased reliance on NPP as other power plants go belly-up, especially forcing those
giant NPPs into maneuvering modes, which they were not designed for. You can find news
sources that Ukrainian NPPs were being tested to 105% of normative capacity and to
maneuvering modes, the modes that just do not make sense when together.
2) decreased maintenance
Anyway, those NPPs are of old Soviet design of 1980-s, they are closing to end of life.
We'll see if new ones will be built. Or if they will just be used regardless of aging until
some hard failure, "run to the ground". And what will come after.
Of course, as long as they operate – no mater how harmful to locals – EU will
buy cheap energy.
And since EuroMaidan government is living on debts, it will have no choice than to sell. Even
if domestic power consumption will get zero, the EU will buy the power.
But I do not think EU would invest into building new power plants there when Soviet ones
finally crack.
@Anon Indeed, only Airbus and Boeing can produce super-heavy aircrafts.
China and Russia are contenders. Ukraine used to be, but stepped out.
Does it mean, USA and France are hell-bent over their military industrial complex?
Maybe.
Does it make them run worse?
Bombardier and EmBraer factories are bought by Airbus and Boeing, not vice versa.
Avro of Canada once used to be a pillar, now is memory.
And all the other countries have to kiss up to political powers that allow them purchasing
Boeing and Airbus jets and maintenance as a privilege for their lapdogging.
Iran wanted to buy Airbus badly, how did it work out?
So, yeah, specialties. Those specialties that can not be replaced – for master
races.
And those that can easily – for lapdogs.
New Zealand can produce good beef. But so can Brazil and Argentina. And Ukraine too.
But Brazil can not produce irreplaceable large cargo aircrafts. And even mid-size they can
not produce independently.
All nations are completely artificial along with the gods, ideologies, fiat money & all
the rest if the human fictions. If humans went extinct overnight would the US, Russia et al
still exist? No, nor would their thousands of gods.
That little trick with the maps can be done with many countries. The US is a fine example.
1st map = 13 colonies – keep adding new maps for every new state they added after
France paid for & won US independence & include the theft/conquest of Mexican
territory & Hawaii.
The Ukraine is a huge basket case made much worse by the US, but your (Orlov too) Rabid
Russian nationalism blinds you. IOW, like the empires propagandists, you too are spinning a
narrative, albeit more truthful than empires, but a narrative (emotional) nonetheless.
@Dr Scanlon Maybe we just compare real Ukraine with what it was promised to become?
Michael Saakashvili, 2014-08-26, "Exactly one year from today Ukraine would send
humanitarian aid to Russia. Mark my words.". I am still trying to find that aid around me, no
luck
There also was a much more extended timetable, year by year, how Ukraine would rocket to
the future and how Russia would fall down to middle ages. Wanted to re-read it but could not
find.
@Anon Or yea, sure. Even Ukrainian statistics (which in terms of reliability might be
somewhat better than Nostradamus, at least sometimes) report 53 births for 100 deaths, with
the population shrinking due to this differential alone by more than 200,000 per year. If you
count in emigration, the picture becomes very bleak. Millions work in Russia, Poland, and
elsewhere. Mind you, temporary emigration for work easily becomes permanent. For example, I
have a cousin who used to live in Lvov. He worked in Russia for 20+ years, and since 2014
never visited Ukraine. I guess he is still counted, as he remains a Ukrainian citizen.
@Mr. Hack OK, let's go to the original of the constitution 'ratified' by "His Majesty the
King of Sweden" (cum consensu S-ae R-ae Maiestatis Sueciae, Protectoris Nostri/with the
consent of His Majesty the King of Sweden, our protector):
"It is no secret that Hetman Bohdan Khmelnytsky of glorious memory, with the
Zaporozhian Host, took up arms and began a just war against the Polish Commonwealth for no
other reason (apart from rights and liberties) except their Orthodox faith, which had been
forced as a result of various encumbrances placed on it by the Polish authorities into union
with the Roman church. Similarly, after the alien new Roman religion had been eradicated
from our fatherland, he with the said Zaporozhian Host and Ruthenian [Rossiaca] people,
sought and submitted himself to the protection of the Muscovite tsardom for no other
reason than "that it shared the same Orthodox religion". Therefore, if God our Lord, strong
and mighty in battle, should assist the victorious armies of His Royal Majesty the King of
Sweden to liberate our fatherland from the Muscovite yoke of slavery, the present newly
elected Hetman will be bound by duty and put under obligation to take special care that no
alien religion is introduced into our Ruthenian [Rossiacam] fatherland. Should one, however,
appear anywhere, either secretly or openly, he will be bound to extirpate it through his
authority, not allow it to be preached or disseminated, and not permit any dissenters,
MOST OF ALL THE ADHERENTS OF DECEITFUL JUDAISM, to live in Ukraine, and will be bound to make
every possible effort that only the Orthodox faith of the Eastern confession, under
obedience to the Holy Apostolic See of Constantinople, be established firmly for ever
and be allowed to expand and to flourish, like a rose among thorns, among the neighbouring
countries following alien religions, for the greater glory of God, the building of churches,
and the instruction of Ruthenian [Rossiacis] sons in the liberal arts. And for the greater
authority of the Kievan metropolitan see, which is foremost in Little Russia [Parva Rossia],
and for a more efficient administration of spiritual matters, His Grace the Hetman should,
after the liberation of our fatherland from the Muscovite yoke, obtain from the Apostolic See
of Constantinople the original power of an exarch in order thereby to renew relationship with
and filial obedience to the aforementioned Apostolic See of Constantinople, from which
it , was privileged to have been enlightened in the holy Catholic faith by the preaching of
the Gospel".
"neque ignotum est, gloriosae memoriae Ducem Theodatum Chmielniccium cum Exercitu
Zaporoviensi non ob aliam causam praeter iura libertatis commotum fuisse iustaque contra
Rempublicam Polonam arma arripuisse, solum pro Fide sua Orthodoxa, quae variorum
gravaminum compulsu a potestate Polonorum coacta fuerat ad unionem cum Ecclesia Romana;
post extirpatam quoque e patria Neoromanam exoticam Religionem, non alio motivo cum eodem
Exercitu Zaporoviensi genteque Rossiaca protectione Imperii Moscovitici dedisse et libere se
subdidisse, solum ob Religionis Orthodoxae unionem. Igitur modernus neoelectus lllustrissimus
Dux, quando Dominus Deus fortis et potens in praeliis iuvabit felicia sacrae S-ae R-ae
Maiestatis Sueciae arma ad vindicandam patriam nostram de servitutis iugo Moscovitico
tenebitur et debito iure obstringetur singularem volvere curam fortiterque obstare, ut nulla
exotica Religio in patriam nostram Rossiacam introducatur, quae si alicubi clamve , palamve
apparuerit, tune activitatem suam extirpandae ipsi debebit, praedicari ampliarique non
permittet, asseclis eiusdem, PRAESERTIM VERO PRAESTIGIOSO IUDAISMO cohabitationem in Ucraina
non concedet et omni virium conatu sollicitam impendet curam, ut sola et una Orthodoxa Fides
Orientalis Confessionis sub obedienta S-tae Apostoiicae sedis Constantinopolitanae in
perpetuum sit firmanda, atque cum amplianda gloria Divina, erigendis ecclesiis exercendisque
in artibus liberalibus filiis Rossiacis dilatetur, ac tanquam rosa inter spinas, inter vicina
exoticae Religionis Dominia virescat et florescat. Propter vero majorem authoritatem
primariae in Parva Rossia sedis Metropolitanae Kiiovensis faciliorique in Spiritualibus
regimine, impositam sibi idem Illustrissimus Dux vindicata patria nostra de iugo Moscovitico
geret provinciam circa procurandam et impertiendam a sede Apostolica Constantinopolitana
Exarchicam primitivam potestatem, ut hoc actu renovetur relatio et filialis patriae nostrae
obedientia ad praefatam Apostolicam sedem Constantinopolitanam, cuius praedicatione Evangelii
in Fide Sancta Catholica illuminari firmarique dignata est".
ТHЕ PYLYP ORLYK CONSTITUTION,
[email protected]://www.lucorg.com/block.php/block_id/26
@Anon > Also, check construction spending – click on 10 year
.now how can i account there for the fact, that UAH in 2013 costed three times more than
UAH in 2015 ?
> Farming is an industry.
Grain industry – is low added value one, it is highly competitive market because
grain from any country on Earth is just grain.
USSR used to buy grain, as it sponsored bread production and peasants all around were
buying bead to feed their hens, goats, pigs, etc. Official meat production was large too.
It is definitely better to export at least something than nothing. But it also is better
to export high added value goods.
Before WW1 a minister of Russian Empire said "Let our peasants starve but we will export
all the grains we contracted" – few years later Russian Empire ceased to exist.
In 1931 and 1932 Stalin tenfold decreased then banned grains export breaking the
contracts. 15 years later USSR won WW2.
Franlky, it is just weird that Ukraine and Russia together produce most world's traded
grain, like there is no other fertile soil on Earth. Also Russia and Ukraine are both to the
north from USA, so USA should be able to produce more grains in its warmer climate. Why isn't
USA world #1 grains exporter?
and EU just whimsically bans Ukrainian meat beyond some arbitrary quota.
EU will easily find where to buy meet.
Can Ukraine reciprocate by banning Airbus or Boeing purchases? I wonder
EU can pressure Ukrainian government, and Ukraine can do little in defense.
"... "In direct contravention of U.S. interests" says the NBC and quotes a member of the permanent state who declares "it is clearly in our national interest" to give weapons to Ukraine. ..."
"... But is that really in the national U.S. interest? Who defined it as such? ..."
"... And that's where the policy community and I part company. It is the president, not the bureaucracy, who was elected by the American people. That puts him -- not the National Security Council, the State Department, the intelligence community, the military, and their assorted subject-matter experts -- in charge of making policy. If we're to remain a constitutional republic, that's how it has to stay. ..."
"... The constitution does not empower the "U.S. government policy community", nor "the administration", nor the "consensus view of the interagency" and certainly not one Lt.Col. Vindman to define the strategic interests of the United States and its foreign policy. It is the duly elected president who does that. ..."
"... Mr. Kolomoisky, widely seen as Ukraine's most powerful figure outside government, given his role as the patron of the recently elected President Volodymyr Zelensky, has experienced a remarkable change of heart: It is time, he said, for Ukraine to give up on the West and turn back toward Russia. ..."
"... "They're stronger anyway. We have to improve our relations," he said, comparing Russia's power to that of Ukraine. "People want peace, a good life, they don't want to be at war. And you" -- America -- "are forcing us to be at war , and not even giving us the money for it." ..."
"... Mr. Kolomoisky [..] told The Times in a profanity-laced discussion, the West has failed Ukraine, not providing enough money or sufficiently opening its markets. ..."
"... Instead, he said, the United States is simply using Ukraine to try to weaken its geopolitical rival. "War against Russia," he said, "to the last Ukrainian." Rebuilding ties with Russia has become necessary for Ukraine's economic survival, Mr. Kolomoisky argued. He predicted that the trauma of war will pass. ..."
"... Kolomoisky's interview is obviously a trial balloon for the policies Zelensky wants to pursue. He has, like Trump, campaigned on working for better relations with Russia. He received nearly 73% of all votes. ..."
"... Ambassador Taylor and the other participants of yesterday's clown show would certainly "mess it up and get in the way" if Zelensky openly pursues the policy he promised to his voters. They are joined in this with the west-Ukrainian fascists they have used to arrange the Maidan coup: ..."
"... Only some 20% of the Ukrainians are in favour of continuing the war against the eastern separatists who Russia supports. During the presidential election Poroshenko received just 25% of the votes. His party European Solidarity won 8.1% of the parliamentary election. Voice won 5.8%. ..."
"... on Yovanovitch, She added: "If our chief representative is kneecapped, it limits our effectiveness to safeguard the vital national security interests of the United States." ..."
"... She wasn't fired, she was kneecapped, and Ukraine is a US vital national security interest, especially after it installed a new government with neo-fascism support.. . .Kneecapping is a form of malicious wounding, often as torture, in which the victim is injured in the knee ..."
NBC News
is not impressed by the first day of the Democrats' impeachment circus. But it fails to
note what the conflict is really about:
It was substantive, but it wasn't dramatic.
In the reserved manner of veteran diplomats with Harvard degrees, Bill Taylor and George
Kent opened the public phase of the House impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump on
Wednesday by bearing witness to a scheme they described as not only wildly unorthodox but
also in direct contravention of U.S. interests.
"It is clearly in our national interest to deter further Russian aggression," Taylor, the
acting U.S. ambassador to Ukraine and a decorated Vietnam War veteran, said in explaining why
Trump's decision to withhold congressionally appropriated aid to the most immediate target of
Russian expansionism didn't align with U.S. policy.
But at a time when Democrats are simultaneously eager to influence public opinion in favor
of ousting the president and quietly apprehensive that their hearings could stall or
backfire, the first round felt more like the dress rehearsal for a serious one-act play than
the opening night of a hit Broadway musical.
"In direct contravention of U.S. interests" says the NBC and quotes a member of the
permanent state who declares "it is clearly in our national interest" to give weapons to
Ukraine.
But is that really in the national U.S. interest? Who defined it as such?
President Obama was against giving weapons to Ukraine and never transferred any to Ukraine
despite pressure from certain circles. Was Obama's decision against U.S. national interest?
Where are the Democrats or deep state members accusing him of that?
Which brings us to the really critical point of the whole issue. Who defines what is in the
"national interest" with regards to foreign policy? Here is a point where for once I agree with
the right-wingers at the National Review where Andrew McCarthy writes :
[O]n the critical matter of America's interests in the Russia/Ukraine dynamic, I think the
policy community is right, and President Trump is wrong. If I were president, while I would
resist gratuitous provocations, I would not publicly associate myself with the delusion that
stable friendship is possible (or, frankly, desirable) with Putin's anti-American
dictatorship, which runs its country like a Mafia family and is acting on its revanchist
ambitions.
But you see, much like the policy community, I am not president. Donald Trump is.
And that's where the policy community and I part company. It is the president, not the
bureaucracy, who was elected by the American people. That puts him -- not the National
Security Council, the State Department, the intelligence community, the military, and their
assorted subject-matter experts -- in charge of making policy. If we're to remain a
constitutional republic, that's how it has to stay.
The U.S.
constitution "empowers the President of the United States to propose and chiefly
negotiate agreements between the United States and other countries."
The constitution does not empower the "U.S. government policy community", nor "the
administration", nor the "consensus view of the interagency" and certainly not one Lt.Col.
Vindman to define the strategic interests of the United States and its foreign policy. It is
the duly elected president who does that.
The president does not like how the 'American policy' on Russia was built. He rightly
believes that he was elected to change it. He had stated his opinion on Russia during his
campaign and won the election. It is not 'malign influence' that makes him try to have good
relations with Russia. It is his own conviction and legitimized by the voters.
...
[I]t is the president who sets the policies. The drones around him who serve "at his
pleasure" are there to implement them.
There is another point that has to be made about the NBC's assertions. It is not in
the interest of Ukraine to be a proxy for U.S. deep state antagonism towards Russia. Robber
baron Igor Kolomoisky, who after the Maidan coup
had financed the west-Ukrainian fascists who fought against east-Ukraine, says so directly in
his
recent NYT interview :
Mr. Kolomoisky, widely seen as Ukraine's most powerful figure outside government, given his
role as the patron of the recently elected President Volodymyr Zelensky, has experienced a
remarkable change of heart: It is time, he said, for Ukraine to give up on the West and turn
back toward Russia.
"They're stronger anyway. We have to improve our relations," he said, comparing Russia's
power to that of Ukraine. "People want peace, a good life, they don't want to be at war. And
you" -- America -- "are forcing us to be at war , and not even giving us the money for
it."
... Mr. Kolomoisky [..] told The Times in a profanity-laced discussion, the West has failed
Ukraine, not providing enough money or sufficiently opening its markets.
Instead, he said, the United States is simply using Ukraine to try to weaken its
geopolitical rival. "War against Russia," he said, "to the last Ukrainian." Rebuilding ties
with Russia has become necessary for Ukraine's economic survival, Mr. Kolomoisky argued. He
predicted that the trauma of war will pass.
...
Mr. Kolomoisky said he was feverishly working out how to end the war, but he refused to
divulge details because the Americans "will mess it up and get in the way."
Kolomoisky's interview is obviously a trial balloon for the policies Zelensky wants to
pursue. He has, like Trump, campaigned on working for better relations with Russia. He received
nearly 73% of all votes.
Ambassador Taylor and the other participants of yesterday's clown show would certainly "mess
it up and get in the way" if Zelensky openly pursues the policy he promised to his voters. They
are joined in this
with the west-Ukrainian fascists they have used to arrange the Maidan coup:
Zelenskiy's decision in early October to accept talks with Russia on the future of eastern
Ukraine resulted in an outcry from a relatively small but very vocal minority of Ukrainians
opposed to any deal-making with Russia. The protests were relatively short-lived, but
prospects for a negotiated end to the war in the eastern Donbas region became more remote in
light of this domestic opposition.
...
The supporters for war with Russia are ex-president Poroshenko and two parliamentary
factions, European Solidarity and Voice, whose supporters are predominantly located in
western Ukraine. Crucially, however, they can also rely on right-wing paramilitary groups
composed of veterans from the hottest phase of the war in Donbas in 2014-5.
Only some 20% of the Ukrainians are in favour of continuing the war against the eastern
separatists who Russia supports. During the presidential election Poroshenko received just 25%
of the votes. His party European Solidarity won 8.1% of the parliamentary election. Voice won
5.8%.
By pursuing further conflict with Russia the deep state of the United States wants to ignore
the wishes not only of the U.S. voters but also those of the Ukrainian electorate. That
undemocratic mindset is another point that unites them with the Ukrainian fascists.
Zelensky should ignore the warmongers in the U.S. embassy in Kiev and sue for immediate
peace with Russia. (He should also investigate
Biden's undue influence .) Reengaging with Russia is also the easiest and most efficient
step the Ukraine can take to lift its desolate economy.
It is in the national interest of both, the Ukraine and the United States.
Posted by b on November 14, 2019 at 18:23 UTC |
Permalink
next page " agree with mccarthy about who conducts foreign policy, disagree about who
the aggressor is; it's the USA, trying to weaken Russia, which is the aggressor.
thanks b... typo - immediate piece with Russia - 'peace' is the spelling here...
the comments from Kolomoisky in the recent nyt interview are very telling.. aside from
being a first rate kleptomaniac who will willingly play both sides if he can profit from it,
he is also speaking a moment of truth..for him Ukraine is available to the highest bidder...
he could give a rats ass about Ukraine or the people... but still, it is refreshing that the
NYT published his comments in this regard..
the quote "the Americans "will mess it up and get in the way." is very true... it was true
before kolomisky picked a side too.. this guy is very shrewd.. i wonder if his own country is
able to see thru him?
national interest.... yes, trump gets to decide and he won on the idea of having closer
relations with russia, but the cia-msm has been lambasting him and anyone else associated
with him since before the election over the clinton e mails... they have painted a scenario
that it is all russias fault and have been relentless in this portrayal... hoping trump is
going to turn this around is like hoping someone is going to turn the titanic around from
hitting a giant iceberg... the usa is too far gone and will be hitting the iceberg.. they are
in fact...
From NYT about Kolomo???? (spelling in English is highly variable)
George D. Kent, a senior State Department official, said he had told Mr. Zelensky that his
willingness to break with Mr. Kolomoisky -- "somebody who had such a bad reputation" -- would
be a litmus test for his independence. [If is good to be independent, i.e. to do what we
want.]
And William Taylor, the acting ambassador in Kiev, said he had warned Mr. Zelensky: "He,
Mr. Kolomoisky, is increasing his influence in your government, which could cause you to
fail." [La Paz is a fresh reminder for Kiev?]
Well the thing about Zelensky is he's still there, and he is making changes in Donbass.
Kolomoisky was interested in the fracked gas in Donbass, the completion of NordStream II
has made a mess of that idea. It is good that he has seen the light, as it means Zelensky
will have support in his attempts to adapt to reality. But Kolomoisky is still a crook no
doubt.
My immediate reaction was that Kolomoisky realises he has to act - the Ukrainian oligarchs
have got too close to America. I agree with James that he is a extremely clever man.
Ukraine's traditional business is playing both ends against the middle and sending the
proceeds to Switzerland (or the Caribbean in Porosyonok's case). Since 1990 a few of these
robber barons have made a very good business winding up the west against Russia, it could go
on ever - why spoil it by lifting the rock and seeing all the insects scurrying around in the
light?
Another rock that has been lifted is in Washington, where the khokhol diaspora are
desperately trying to get Uncle Sam to right the wrongs of a century ago.
"Deep state" is misleading and actually a false construction.
There is an Imperial State (the ruling faction)which consists of imperial apparatchiks
placed in every key position in government.
There is one and only one Western Empire and its deep state spreads throughout Western
governments and society. They are the owners oif the world and they run the world they
own.
... @ b -- "Only some 20% of the Ukrainians favor to continue the war against the eastern
separatists who Russia supports."
The are not 'separatists', but rather Ukrainians who want to stay in a federated Ukraine
as 'provinces' with powers to pass their regional laws, similar to those in Canada.
The segment of empire in the US that are against Russia act so because it was Russia that
stymied them in Syria and continues to be in their way of expanding the control from that
part of empire...the US segment.
I still believe that the global private finance core segment of empire is behind Trump and
throwing America(ns) under the bus as the world turns more multilateral. The cult of global
private finance intends on still having some overarching super-national role in the new
multilateral world and holding debt guns to everyones heads to make it ongoing.
I don't believe that strategy will work but as long as they can be fronted by a MAD player
of some sort (Occupied Palestine comes to mind) they can be bully players in international
matters.
As the world economies grind to a "halt" there will be lots of pressure everywhere and
very little clarity about the key civilization war over public/private finance, IMO
For a military dictatorship, diplomacy is the continuation of war by other means. The US has
been at war with Russia since the right-wing coup at the Democratic convention of 1944. All
presidents have been servants of the military, which includes the police/intel/security
apparatus; the few who did not entirely accept their figurehead role were "dealt with."
Kennedy, Nixon, Carter and now Trump. The Washington permanent state bureaucrats are shocked
and understandably offended; they have after all, been running US foreign policy for 75
years!
Wow! The depth of delusion on display is as breathtaking as its complete projection of the
intentions and actions of the Evil Outlaw US Empire! Oh so many saying I'm displaying four
fingers instead of two. Too bad there isn't a padded cell big enough to contain all the
lunatics. I recall the pre- and post-coup discussions from 2014--that Russia was going to
make NATO own Ukraine until it was forced to concede it has no business being there; that
Russia would teach the would-be leaders of Ukraine a serious lesson in where their national
interests lay. NATO is ready to cede and the lesson's been learned.
IMO, two referendums must be held. The first within Russia: Will you accept portions of
Ukraine wanting to merge with Russia: Yes/No? Second to be given within Ukraine provided Yes
wins in #1: Do you wish to join Russia or remain in Ukraine? IMO, this is a very longstanding
unresolved issue of consequence for the people involved. The political leaders of Russia and
Ukraine might both be against such a vote, but IMO that merely kicks the can further down the
road and opens the door for more mischief making by the Evil Outlaw US Empire. Assuming a Yes
from Russia and some from Ukraine, a strategic threat to Russia and Europe would be
mitigated. Additional questions about those parts of Ukraine not wanting to join Russia could
be solved via additional referenda in the Ukraine and neighboring nations that might prove
willing to absorb the remnants and their people. Such action would of course negate the Minsk
Agreements.
Given the ideological passions of those living in Western and Northern Ukraine, I don't
see any hope for the continuation of the Ukrainian state as currently arranged, thus the
proposed referenda. However, if Russia says Nyet, then Minsk must be implemented.
"Democracy" is not about letting the people as a whole have a say in how the country is
governed. That would be fascist, and racist, and populist, and LITERALLY HITLER. Letting the
people decide on things like foreign policy, is literally anti-democratic.
No, "Democracy" is about privatizing power and socializing responsibility. The elites get
to set the policy, but the public at large gets to take responsibility when things go wrong.
Because you see, we are a "Democracy."
Breaking off long established economic and cultural ties with a large neighbouring country,
virtually overnight, is a rash act, and certain to create dislocation and hardship. The
craziness of the idea was only achievable through the traumatizing psy-op of the sniper
event, leading directly to the coup and the state of war. The EU and the US were clearly
malevolent in orchestrating the Association agreement with its ridiculous terms and the
corresponding Maidan pressures.
The fools in Hong Kong, after protester-sponsored screenings of the World On Fire
documentary, were actually quoted as presuming the Maidan protests had "won" and expressed
their hopes that they too could "win". Good luck to them.
Kolomoisky and Zelensky know what needs to be done, but they fear the blood that will flow
with Nazi-Banderist scum! Zelinski's balls are not that big, and has no options left after
compromising his position from day one. Who will make the first move, I fear not him? Russia
has time, and patience, which is sorely lacking in the west who feel they have to push the
envelope.
The Minsk II protocol was agreed to on 12 February 2015 by the leaders of Ukraine, Russia,
France, and Germany, It included provisions for a halt in the fighting, the withdrawal of
foreign forces, new constitution to allow special status for Donbass, and election in Donbass
for local self governance. Control of the present border of Ukraine would be restored to the
Ukraine government. Donbass would continue to be in Ukraine with some autonomy here (scroll down).
There are many such autonomous zones in the world, and in Europe, seen here .
The problem in Ukraine is that the neo-Nazi factions promoted by the US don't want to see a
resolution, and will fight it with US support.
Kolomoysky is obviously a master thief and general scumbag...but he is no fool...
I think the writing on the wall became obvious with the Nordstream 2 finalization, where,
it is noted, Denmark came in just under the wire in terms of not disrupting the
timetable...
Obviously the interests of German business have prevailed...and rightly so in this
case...
And what of the famous EU line about 'protecting' Ukraine as a gas transit
corridor...?
LOLOLOL...that is in the same category of nothingburger as the EU noises about 'alternate
payment' mechanisms for trade with Iran...
As soon as the Denmark story broke, Gazprom and Russian energy analysts talked openly
about the tiny volumes that Ukraine could expect to see transiting its territory...as part of
a new agreement to replace the one that has expired...
It works out to a small fraction of the several billion dollars in transit fees the
Ukraine was getting...
Also considering that the IMF appears to be finally shutting off the tap of loans to this
failed gangster state...and that the promises from the EU in 2013 were just so much fairy
tales...hard-nosed operators like Kolomoysky are recalculating...
The chaos and national ruin has really cost these gangster capitalists nothing [in fact
they have profited wildly]...so it is easy for them to reverse course and come begging back
to Russia...
Bryan MacDonald has a good piece about this today in RT...
So, here we are, almost six years since the first "EuroMaidan" protests in Kiev, and
Ukraine's most prominent oligarch has finally voiced the unmentionable: the project has
failed.
As for Kolomoysky...like Trump, there is something to like about dirtballs who speak their
minds openly...LOL
Quite a turnaround by Kolomoisky. Wasn't he once caught on a tapped phone call admitting
while chuckling about Ukrainian complicity in shooting down MH-17? i.e. NOT Donbas rebels and
NOT Russia.
@12 karlof1... a referendum... as if the usa would agree to that, lol.... look how they
processed the one in crimea...
@18 flankerbandit... last line is true, but it pales in relation to the ugliness these 2
exhibit 99% of the time, although the 1% when they don't it's refreshing! ukraine will
continue to be used as a tool by the west..
forget about any referendum.. that makes too much sense and won't be allowed..
Nordstream 2 will come online in less than 2 months and the Ukrainian gas exports at that
time will cease (I.e. no oil for the Oligarchs to steal), no matter what the US says they
can't replace the Russian oil exports in terms of money & support to Ukraine, so the
Oligarchs are now positioning themselves to abandon the US in order for the Russians to keep
even a tiny bit of oil flowing into their pockets
It's a tough balancing act, being a Ukrainian oligarch. For two decades they stole what they
could from the Ukraine (and from perverting the various sweetheart deals Russia was
providing). Once the industry and energy money was stripped, and Russia started closing the
spigots, they managed to get the West to pump in ungodly amounts of cash so long as they
would agree to talk mean about Russia, and didn't mind the US machine taking its cut of the
loot.
But now the Ukrainian thieves are beginning to realize that the Western thieves are going
to steal the very ground from under their feet, so there will be no more Ukraine to steal
from. That's not a very good business model. Plus they're no doubt seeing how the US treats
its partners in crime in Syria and elsewhere, and realize they could easily find themselves
the next meal for the US beast. Pretty easy to see why the smarter ones are getting
nervous.
they need to make peace with Russia or they will be left out in the cold, literally. They
seemed to have previously bought into some insane lie that they'd be a part of the EU and
NATO if theyd do Washington's bidding. The Deep state vastly underestimated Putin's resolve
when it became clear to the Russians that Washington may try and turn Crimea into a NATO port
one day. The game is over. Ukraine needs to find a way forward now for itself or it will be a
failed state in the near future. It's clear Merkel and Europe want no part of this headache
I don't think Russians want to 'own' any part of Ukraine...at least that is the nearly
unanimous opinion of my own contacts and colleagues in Russia...so I don't think any
referenda will be on the table...
What I do think is possible is what Yanukovich and Russia agreed to in terms of a trade
and economic deal...which was a lot more practical [not to mention generous] than the EU
'either or' nonsense...
Ukraine has run itself into the ground, literally...now they are selling vast tracts of
agricultural land to huge Euro agribusiness concerns...literally dispossessing themselves of
their own food security...
At the time of the Soviet dissolution, Ukraine had the highest living standards and some
of the world's prime industry and technology...including for instance the Yuzhnoye design
bureau [rocket engines and spacecraft] and many more such cutting edge aerospace
concerns...
For years these crucial enterprises were able to keep going due to the Russian
market...that all ended in 2014 [and in fact was tapering off even before due to the massive
corruption]...
Now the Chinese are looking to scoop up these gems at firesale prices...
It is really quite unbelievable that the nutcases in the Ukraine would be willing to cut
off their own arm just to bleed on Russia's shirt...
Why did the Ukraine never recover from the gangster capitalism like Russia did...because
no Putin ever came along to reign in the oligarchy...[It could be argued Putin hasn't done
nearly enough in this regard].
The Ukraine is actually a preview of what we can expect to see in our own future...as the
unleashed oligarchy similarly runs everything into the ground in order to extract maximal
wealth for a parasite elite...already we are nothing but a Ponzi Scheme on the verge of
toppling...
Kolomoisky is talking his book and helping USA to make the case that Nordstream is a NATO
security issue. To pretend that he's serious about a rapproachment with Russia just plays
into that effort.
And b ignores my comment on the prior thread that he references (about Trump being
Constitutionally charged with foreign policy). Repeating: the "Imperial Presidency" has flung
off Constitutional checks and balances by circumventing the need to get Congressional
approval for spending. Wars (like Syria) are now be funded by Gulf Monarchies, black ops, and
black budgets.
While for practical reasons the Executive Branch of USA government has the power to
negotiate treaties and manage foreign relations, Constitutionally he does so for the
sovereign (the American people) and his efforts are subject to review and approval of the
people's representatives via the power of the purse.
Ignoring how the "Imperial Presidency" has usurped power leads to faulty analysis that
supports that power grab.
Ukrainegate IS a farce, but for other reasons. Chief among them being the inherent fakery
of 'managed democracy' which manifests as kayfabe.
There is an Imperial State (the ruling faction)which consists of imperial apparatchiks
placed in every key position in government.
There is one and only one Western Empire and its deep state spreads throughout Western
governments and society. They are the owners of the world and they run the world they
own.
Nicely put:- that is the reality. Thanks b for your intrepid reports.
Paul Craig Roberts has a deeply aggrieved rant at zero hedge if barflies want a chuckle.
What a shitshow.
Crimea?
It has been part of Russia about as long as the USA has been a country.
9 out of 10 residents are of Russian origin, and Russian is the spoken language.
I guess it could be returned to the 10%-- but out of fairness, we must turn the USA over to
its original occupants.
If you live in the USA, get your ass ready to leave.
One of the problems that the anti-nazis face in Ukraine is that there are occupying armies in
the country. Armies which cannot be trusted to obey instructions which are not agreed upon by
NATO warmongers.
One such army is Canadian, commanded I believe by a descendant of the Ukrainian SS refugees
and reporting to the Foreign Minister in Ottawa, a Russophobe with a family background of
nazi collaboration.
The actual political situation is much more delicate than media reports suggest: what are
called elections feature, in the Washington approved fashion, the banning of socialist and
communist candidates. Bans which are enforced by a combination of fascist commanded police
forces and, even less responsible, private nazi militias. Opponents of the Maidan regime are
driven into exile, jailed or murdered.
Those who wonder as Jackrabbit, in a rare essay into rationality, does above, about the
nature of the US Constitution after decades of the erosion of checks and balances thanks to
the Imperial Presidency, will recognise that a dialectic is at work here. Washington's
support for fascism abroad has instituted fascism at home which has led in turn to the
installation of fascist regimes abroad, not just occasionally but routinely. Wherever the US
intervenes it leaves a fascist regime, in which socialists are banned and persecuted, behind
it.
And what this means is that, among other things, the ability of the population to effect
political change is cancelled: there is no way that the people of Ukraine can decide what
they want because the decisions have been taken for them, in weird cult like gatherings of SS
worshiping Bandera supporters in Toronto and Chicago. It is no accident that most of the
'Ukrainians' being wheeled out by the Democrats to testify against Trump are actually greedy
expatriates who have never really lived in Ukraine.
There was a moment, not long ago, when it looked as if the Minsk accords promised a path to
peace and reconciliation. Unfortunately the plain people of Ukraine, the poorest in Europe
though living in one of the richest countries, Washington, Ottawa and NATO didn't like the
sound of Minsk. Nor did the fascists in the Baltic states and Poland, for whom, for
centuries, Ukraine has been a cow to milk, its people slaves to be exploited and its rich
resources too tempting to ignore.
As Thomas Jefferson explained the President's role in foreign affairs in 1790, and the lack
of advisors' policy making decisions: ''as the President was the only channel of
communication between the United States and foreign nations, it was from him alone 'that
foreign nations or their agents are to learn what is or has been the will of the nation';
that whatever he communicated as such, they had a right and were bound to consider 'as the
expression of the nation'; and that no foreign agent could be 'allowed to question it,' or
'to interpose between him and any other branch of government, under the pretext of either's
transgressing their functions.' Mr. Jefferson therefore declined to enter into any discussion
of the question as to whether it belonged to the President under the Constitution to admit or
exclude foreign agents. 'I inform you of the fact,' he said, 'by authority from the
President.'
Might also be worth yesterdays hero's asking if dear Mr Kolomoisky, joint Uki/Israeli
national, took a part in authorising the shoot down of MH17 as a news cover for Operation
Protective Edge. Heave ho zionist USA ....et al.
1.The decisions to with hold and release aid have nothing to do with the President making
foreign policy but with his campaign. Saying it was about foreign policy is a damned lie.
2.Trump as president is supposed to lead foreign policy, which means actually setting a
policy. Military aid to Ukraine, yes, except no, except yes, personal handling without asking
anybody with experience how to achieve the national goal desired, national agenda kept secret
from the people who have to carry it out, abuse of officials, demands for dubiously legal
actions without rationale...Saying it was about the president's executive role is a damned
lie.
3.Trump has not made even a tweet that questions US support for fascists. That not even a
issue for Trump. Saying this is about support for fascism is a damned lie.
4.Kolomoyskiy is a bankroller of fascists. It is not impossible even a billionaire might get
frightened by the genie he's let out of the bottle, even if he's Jewish and rich enough to
run away. But actually undoing the fascist regime means taming the paramilitaries and this is
not even on the horizon. Given the rivalry between Poroshenko and Kolomoyskiy it's not even
certain it's a real change of heart or just soothing words for the non-fascist people. Nor is
it even clear the Zelensky will follow even the Steinmeier formula. If he does, good, but
until something actually happens? Saying it's about the antifascist turn is a damned lie.
The only thing that isn't a lie is that Trump was not committing treasons, "merely" a
campaign violation. But then, Clinton never did either. The crybabies who dished it out but
can't take it deserve zero respect, and zero time.
Curious to know how Kolomoisky is working "feverishly" to end the war in the Donbass region.
Wonder if he is planning to come clean on what he knows of the Malaysia Airlines MH17
shootdown and crash in an area not far from Slavyansk and near where his Privat Group's
subsidiary company Burisma Holdings holds a licence to drill for oil and natural gas. What
does he know about Kiev and Dnepropetrovsk air traffic control personnel's direction to MH17
to fly at 10,000 metres in the warzone and not an extra 1,000 metres above as the flight crew
had requested? He had been governor of Dnepropetrovsk region at the time.
Somewhere I read it alleged that the actual owner of Burisma was or is Kolomoiski.
Anything to this?
And via John Helmer (via Checkpointasia and dances with bears) comes the perspective that
it's not so much Kolomoiski floating trial balloons (though that may also be true) but that K
is being given space in the NYT to build his credentials as the new Borg villain, thereby
making it still harder for Zelensky to reconcile with Russia.
fb @ 25 said;"The Ukraine is actually a preview of what we can expect to see in our own
future...as the unleashed oligarchy similarly runs everything into the ground in order to
extract maximal wealth for a parasite elite...already we are nothing but a Ponzi Scheme on
the verge of toppling..."
Yup, aided and abetted by our current regime, while pretending not to...
@23
"It's a tough balancing act, being a Ukrainian oligarch. For two decades they stole what they
could from the Ukraine (and from perverting the various sweetheart deals Russia was
providing). Once the industry and energy money was stripped, and Russia started closing the
spigots, they managed to get the West to pump in ungodly amounts of cash so long as they
would agree to talk mean about Russia, and didn't mind the US machine taking its cut of the
loot."
This is it in a nutshell. The Russians were fed up with Ukraine stealing gas. Hence, Nord
Stream 2. That was always the plan. Whether the Yanks truly grasped the rationale here
---Russia is cutting off gas to Ukraine, simple---has never been clear to me. Although it is
a fairly simple plot. The Russians had decades of shenanigans with the Ukes and said Basta.
By not overreacting to the Ukrainian-USA freakout and keeping their eyes on the prize (Nord
Stream and disengaging, gas-wise, from Uk), they have managed to reach their goal of getting
Nord Stream 2 online.
Kolomoiski is the bankroller and commander of the Azov Battalion. Has close arrangements with
other paramilitaries. And is the current principal of Burisma. And is Privatbank, the only
bank left in Ukraine. He gets a cut of all the action.
When Trump queries Zelensky, all that Zelensky is thinking is this guy does not know the
score. This guy does not know who's on first. He wants me to investigate the boss? Let him
talk to the boss. And who does Z talk to in D.C.? Pointless getting into detail with
Trump.
Trump has no team. No one in D.C. is on his side. He's unable to finish anything.
1) Say the fantasy happens and the US/Russia become BFFs like US/UK...
- Say hello to the new boss, same as the old boss?
- Tough to answer, many unknowns- Russia may act different once its on top, actors may
derail schemes, Deep State temper tantrum, etc...
In general, governments are the order-providing solution for chaos and problems that only
first existed inside the minds of those seeking power over others.
Kolomoiski is a U.S. asset. His interview with the NYTimes proves it.
His threats are meant to mobilize NATO and Russia haters in general; because Trump and
most of his cadre care nothing for Ukraine.
Does anyone think Russia will give Kolomoiski 100 million dollars? Why was he given an
opportunity to threaten the USA? For no reason? Something else is afoot but Russia still
won't take the bait because they are winning.
Russia is quite happy with the status quo. The war in Ukraine keeps the war against Russia
on a level which is easy to manipulate and therefore geostrategically beneficial. Kolomoiski
will get nothing.
Thank you, b, for that snippet from NY Interview with Kolomoisky . I had glanced the headline
on RT but didn't read it because of RT's usual clumsy writing.
Nebojsa Malic
A protester is seen hanging from the balcony in the Senate Chamber on January 6, 2021 in Washington, DC © Win McNamee / Getty Images / AFP 157 1 Follow RT on
A crowd of protesters stormed Congress protesting a presidential election they claimed had been fraudulent. When this happened in Serbia in 2000, the US called it democracy. When it happened in Washington, DC – not so much.
citizens. We support the ongoing trial in the Netherlands to deliver justice for those who died & for their loved ones, and call on Russia to cooperate fully
Serbian Patriot @PatriotSerbian · Mar 9 Replying to @BBCSteveR Fundamental flaws remain in the JIT's final verdict. Feel free to debate these critical points Steve: ( https:// 21stcenturywire.com/2019/06/23/des pite-its-official-verdict-fundamental-flaws-remain-in-dutch-jit-mh17-investigation/ )
Despite its 'Official' Verdict, Fundamental Flaws Remain in Dutch JIT MH17 Investigation 21WIRE | After an elaborate five year, NATO member state-led process, not everyone is convinced by the JIT's politicized conclusion. 21stcenturywire.com taseenb @taseenb · 19h Replying to @BBCSteveR She's amazing and she's right. I would have called you a mercenary though, which is more accurate orbi @kwo_vadis · Mar 9 Replying to @BBCSteveR Have you talked to the Skripals? Deborah Wylde @flamingyam · Mar 9 Replying to @BBCSteveR Why did you ignore her questions? Instead, avoiding them by throwing more accusations at her. Mark Curtis @markcurtis30 · Mar 9 I've written a lot on the media over the years but the current state of UK press reporting on UK foreign policy is shocking. There is no news system, the public is being misinformed, the press (from Tory to "liberal") acts largely as an appendage of the state. Please see thread. https:// twitter.com/declassifiedUK Arthur Tewungwa @ATewungwa · Mar 9 Replying to @BBCSteveR Love the way Mahathir Mohammed the PM of the country's whose plane has been shot down is relegated to a spectator. The BBC shamelessly tie his rejection of the allegation thrown at Russia with the sale of Palm oil, further portraying Malaysia as an economic basket case. Really
